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US changes position on Annan Plan

Propose and discuss specific solutions to aspects of the Cyprus Problem

Postby -mikkie2- » Thu Mar 31, 2005 5:44 pm

Bananiot,

I personally don't need anyone to support what I think or believe. I say things the way I see them, as does MicAtCyp, as you do as well.

However, I am still not sure of what it is YOU are looking for. A while back you accepted that the Anan plan needs to change, but you yourself has not said what should change in the plan. I personally want a solution that respects the rights of all citizens, no matter what their ethnic background. For me the Annan plan does not do that therefore I am dead against it. I have given my views as to how to mitigate the undermining of human rights in Cyprus. Insan knows my views but he has poo pooed them as they do not agree with his thesis! All I get back from him is Hellenistic conspiracies to undermine the TC community and to render them a minority! MicAtCyp also has stated his views and he has stated that he does not give a monkeys about the form of the solution as long as human rights are not compromised. So, where do you stand on what affects our community? Should our community compromise rights just for the sake of a solution? Any solution? Is it such a sin to want to form a new state that is unifying in nature rather than divisive?

Regarding Papadopoulos, all I can find is that he has taken part in all negotiatiations since the 1960's and worked in creating the 77 and 79 high level agreements. He is considered a constitutional expert. If I find any links that give particular info then I will post them on here.
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Postby Bananiot » Thu Mar 31, 2005 8:28 pm

I said many times that Papadopoulos did not negotiate the A plan because he wanted to sell the no vote to the greek cypriots. He could have negotiated many things, including Karpasia itself, but then he would find it extremely difficult to avert its acceptance. So he used this method to sink the plan because he has no stomach for bizonal bicommunal federation. This is so obvious nowadays when he will not say what changes he wants to the plan. Its the philosophy of the plan he does not like. Going for a new plan based on a new philosophy is not an option so his stalling tactics lead us nearer and nearer to partition which is "the next best solution" and mikkie, he was not making a gaffe when he said it. Over the last fifty years he wrote countless articles against federation. He went as far as to write that he prefers double union to federation. Do you seriously believe that such a person can conclude a federation deal with the Turkish Cypriots?
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Postby -mikkie2- » Thu Mar 31, 2005 11:23 pm

Bananiot,

I still do not believe that we will end up with an agreed partition. My personal opinion is that Papadopoulos wanted to gain EU membership first before stting down at the table to negotiate properly. Why? Because we gain some power over the Turks in one domain. balancing out the power Turkey has over us. Now that we are on a sort of level playing field we can negotiate from a position where we don't have to keep compromising ourselves as we have been doing over the years. At least that is my hope. Its now up to Papadopoulos to capitalise when the time comes.

That is why I think the next set of negotiations will determine what will happen. Last year was the start of the end game! It was not the end game.

As for Karpasia, well I think you very well know that the Turkish military want the whole northern coast to be in Turkish hands. There was little or no leway regarding Karpasia. I refer you to the COMPLETE failure of Turkey and Greece to agree the security issues regarding the plan.
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Postby Andrik » Fri Apr 01, 2005 4:07 pm

Because we gain some power over the Turks in one domain. balancing out the power Turkey has over us.


Europe is bending over backwards for them yet WE are balancing things?? :lol: :lol: Whatever.
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Postby Bananiot » Fri Apr 01, 2005 7:25 pm

Karpasia was there for the taking but he flatly refused to ask for it. Can you think of any other reason as to why he did not want to know?

Anyway, Papadopoulos is now the blackship of Europe and our stakeholders do not take him seriously. Thus, he is in no position to help Cyprus. If all of a sudden we feel that we have been upgraded because we tricked the EU to accept us, then we should expect more misery. Much more misery.
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Postby -mikkie2- » Fri Apr 01, 2005 9:22 pm

Much more misery.


How can things possibly be worse! Will Turkey invade the rest of the island? Will we be kicked out of the EU? Will the US drop a nuke on us? What? The worst possible thing that could happen DID happen 31 years ago.
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Postby Realist » Sat Apr 02, 2005 12:23 am

Bananiot,

I really don't see the relevance of Karpasia. Turkey is using a bargaining chip that rightly she should not have and you are willing to trade. To me that highlights how bad the Annan plan was for us. For 30 years Turkey has said no to many attempts for a settlement. Now that Turkey wishes to enter the EU we are expected to say yes on her terms.

There is no point in having a solution whatever the cost. The president may not be the most devious of politicians but at least Papathopoulos had the courage to speak up against something that was wrong for the people however you wish to look at it. The very fact that the country that invaded Cyprus doesn't like him should be something held in his favour.
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Postby Harry » Sat Apr 02, 2005 10:05 am

I, who am an American citizen, can tell you that all this propoganda is all for some kind of profit for themselves. Americans never had anything to lose, when they said that a ton of bricks will fall on our heads. I love to see them sacrifice, if they had any land to be lost. I don't know why they have their noses up Turkeys ass. This whole Cyprus confict has to do with one thing and thats land, everything else can be bargained. I can't believe their trying to find a middle ground for this. There isn't any.
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