au revoir and Adieu
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 Posted: Wed Feb 13, 2008 10:34 am |
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| Viewpoint |
| vip |
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| Joined: 20 Feb 2005 |
| Posts: 9273 |
| Location: Nicosia/Lefkosa |
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| DT. wrote: |
| Viewpoint wrote: |
| DT. wrote: |
| Expatkiwi wrote: |
| BC Numismatics wrote: |
The 'TRNC' will never gain international recognition.It is like the European equivilant of the Bantustans - established & recognised only by the establishing state,in this case,Turkey.The Bantustans (Bophuthatswana,Ciskei,Transkei,& Venda) were all established & recognised only by South Africa right up until their reincorporation back into South Africa in April 1994.
Aidan. |
Aidan, I know all about those states. I visited South Africa in 1987, and I did go to Bophuthatswana (Thaba n'chu and Sun City). However, TRNC has something that Bophuthatswana, Transkei, Ciskei, and Venda lacked: a ligitimately elected government. Unlike the Bantustans, the TRNC government is elected by the vast majority of registered voters in the TRNC. That gives it a ligitimate represented voice for the Turkish Cypriot people. |
sure, its represenative of the population, everytime someone without the blessing of Ankara tries to get to power Ankara only needs to "amend"the population by introducing a few thousand more "voting" settlers and Bob's your uncle. |
So? DT thats the dynamics of the beast when you are economically held hostage by an aggresive GC community who policies have always been to keep us wanting a solution by keeping us isolated. |
you've never been held hostage. You are free to trade through the legitimate ports of this country. Your football teams are even free to join in on EUropea competitions if they're good enough if they apply via the CFA.
You isolation is your own doing and is politically motivated. Had it been a humanitarian plight then your options are clear and there for you to utilise. |
If you had TC representation as your constitution dictates in your "RoC" I would agree with you 100% but you do not represent us in any shape or form, we did not elect your leaders and do not contribute to your state, why on earth would we want to work through a GC state where we can easily be manipulated and discriminated against which would be the financial ruin of many businesses in the TRNC, no TC business enterprise would take that risk. You have to understand that we do not see the "RoC" as you do, we see the TRNC as you see the "RoC" and are willing to put up with the inconveniences until things are sorted out, but this does not mean we will not fight our corner and ask for the same rights you see fit yourselves in your GC state in our TC state. |
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Last edited by Viewpoint on Wed Feb 13, 2008 10:39 am; edited 1 time in total |
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| Posted: Wed Feb 13, 2008 10:38 am |
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| DT. |
| professor |
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| Joined: 12 Nov 2006 |
| Posts: 5061 |
| Location: Ethnically cleansed from Morphou |
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| Viewpoint wrote: |
| DT. wrote: |
| Viewpoint wrote: |
| DT. wrote: |
| Expatkiwi wrote: |
| BC Numismatics wrote: |
The 'TRNC' will never gain international recognition.It is like the European equivilant of the Bantustans - established & recognised only by the establishing state,in this case,Turkey.The Bantustans (Bophuthatswana,Ciskei,Transkei,& Venda) were all established & recognised only by South Africa right up until their reincorporation back into South Africa in April 1994.
Aidan. |
Aidan, I know all about those states. I visited South Africa in 1987, and I did go to Bophuthatswana (Thaba n'chu and Sun City). However, TRNC has something that Bophuthatswana, Transkei, Ciskei, and Venda lacked: a ligitimately elected government. Unlike the Bantustans, the TRNC government is elected by the vast majority of registered voters in the TRNC. That gives it a ligitimate represented voice for the Turkish Cypriot people. |
sure, its represenative of the population, everytime someone without the blessing of Ankara tries to get to power Ankara only needs to "amend"the population by introducing a few thousand more "voting" settlers and Bob's your uncle. |
So? DT thats the dynamics of the beast when you are economically held hostage by an aggresive GC community who policies have always been to keep us wanting a solution by keeping us isolated. |
you've never been held hostage. You are free to trade through the legitimate ports of this country. Your football teams are even free to join in on EUropea competitions if they're good enough if they apply via the CFA.
You isolation is your own doing and is politically motivated. Had it been a humanitarian plight then your options are clear and there for you to utilise. |
If you had TC representation as your constitution dictates in your "RoC" I would agree with you 100% but you do not represent us in any shape or form, we did not elect your leaders and do not contribute to your state, why on earth would we want to work through a GC state where we can easily be manipulated and discriminated against which would be the financial ruin of many businesses in the TRNC, no TC business enterprise would take that risk. You have to understand that we do not see the "RoC" as you do, we see the TRNC as you see the "RoC" and are willing to put up with the inconveniences until things are sorted out, but this does not mean we will not fight our corner and ask for the same rights you see fit yourselves in
GC state in our TC state. |
then you admit you are not isolated. It is merely a preference due to your dislike of the government of cyprus. |
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| Posted: Wed Feb 13, 2008 10:42 am |
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| Viewpoint |
| vip |
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| Joined: 20 Feb 2005 |
| Posts: 9273 |
| Location: Nicosia/Lefkosa |
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| DT. wrote: |
| Viewpoint wrote: |
| DT. wrote: |
| Viewpoint wrote: |
| DT. wrote: |
| Expatkiwi wrote: |
| BC Numismatics wrote: |
The 'TRNC' will never gain international recognition.It is like the European equivilant of the Bantustans - established & recognised only by the establishing state,in this case,Turkey.The Bantustans (Bophuthatswana,Ciskei,Transkei,& Venda) were all established & recognised only by South Africa right up until their reincorporation back into South Africa in April 1994.
Aidan. |
Aidan, I know all about those states. I visited South Africa in 1987, and I did go to Bophuthatswana (Thaba n'chu and Sun City). However, TRNC has something that Bophuthatswana, Transkei, Ciskei, and Venda lacked: a ligitimately elected government. Unlike the Bantustans, the TRNC government is elected by the vast majority of registered voters in the TRNC. That gives it a ligitimate represented voice for the Turkish Cypriot people. |
sure, its represenative of the population, everytime someone without the blessing of Ankara tries to get to power Ankara only needs to "amend"the population by introducing a few thousand more "voting" settlers and Bob's your uncle. |
So? DT thats the dynamics of the beast when you are economically held hostage by an aggresive GC community who policies have always been to keep us wanting a solution by keeping us isolated. |
you've never been held hostage. You are free to trade through the legitimate ports of this country. Your football teams are even free to join in on EUropea competitions if they're good enough if they apply via the CFA.
You isolation is your own doing and is politically motivated. Had it been a humanitarian plight then your options are clear and there for you to utilise. |
If you had TC representation as your constitution dictates in your "RoC" I would agree with you 100% but you do not represent us in any shape or form, we did not elect your leaders and do not contribute to your state, why on earth would we want to work through a GC state where we can easily be manipulated and discriminated against which would be the financial ruin of many businesses in the TRNC, no TC business enterprise would take that risk. You have to understand that we do not see the "RoC" as you do, we see the TRNC as you see the "RoC" and are willing to put up with the inconveniences until things are sorted out, but this does not mean we will not fight our corner and ask for the same rights you see fit yourselves in
GC state in our TC state. |
then you admit you are not isolated. It is merely a preference due to your dislike of the government of cyprus. |
DT isolation is inconvenience and lack of opportunity, the degree of this in the TRNC is debatable, can it be better of course it can and that what we are asking for. |
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| Posted: Wed Feb 13, 2008 10:46 am |
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| DT. |
| professor |
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| Joined: 12 Nov 2006 |
| Posts: 5061 |
| Location: Ethnically cleansed from Morphou |
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| You're a clever guy and realised early that this is the price you pay for whats happened. You obviously also realise how ludicrous it sounds to play the victim of isolation then. |
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| Posted: Wed Feb 13, 2008 10:46 am |
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| observer |
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| Joined: 18 Sep 2006 |
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DT wrote:
| Quote: |
you've never been held hostage. You are free to trade through the legitimate ports of this country. Your football teams are even free to join in on EUropea competitions if they're good enough if they apply via the CFA.
You isolation is your own doing and is politically motivated. Had it been a humanitarian plight then your options are clear and there for you to utilise. |
Isn't this the logic of every bully, hostage taker or terrorist?
Of course you have a choice, you can do exactly what I want or I will hurt you, kill you, or kill lots of you. |
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| Posted: Wed Feb 13, 2008 10:48 am |
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| DT. |
| professor |
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| Joined: 12 Nov 2006 |
| Posts: 5061 |
| Location: Ethnically cleansed from Morphou |
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| observer wrote: |
DT wrote:
| Quote: |
you've never been held hostage. You are free to trade through the legitimate ports of this country. Your football teams are even free to join in on EUropea competitions if they're good enough if they apply via the CFA.
You isolation is your own doing and is politically motivated. Had it been a humanitarian plight then your options are clear and there for you to utilise. |
Isn't this the logic of every bully, hostage taker or terrorist?
Of course you have a choice, you can do exactly what I want or I will hurt you, kill you, or kill lots of you. |
Turn that around to ...You can come and look at your house but if you try anything 40k soldiers are gonna kill you. |
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| Posted: Wed Feb 13, 2008 11:35 am |
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| Viewpoint |
| vip |
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| Joined: 20 Feb 2005 |
| Posts: 9273 |
| Location: Nicosia/Lefkosa |
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| DT. wrote: |
| You're a clever guy and realised early that this is the price you pay for whats happened. You obviously also realise how ludicrous it sounds to play the victim of isolation then. |
DT for example we dont have direct flights thats isolation in our eyes, its the degree you are willing to accept and yes you are right its the price we pay for our own country as is the loss of land and control over the north for GCs.
The degree of isolation is the key here why is it do you think that GC policies have not and will not bear fruit? but this does notmean we will stop asking for the rights that ever other person in the world enjoys. |
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| Posted: Wed Feb 13, 2008 11:39 am |
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| DT. |
| professor |
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| Joined: 12 Nov 2006 |
| Posts: 5061 |
| Location: Ethnically cleansed from Morphou |
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| Viewpoint wrote: |
| DT. wrote: |
| You're a clever guy and realised early that this is the price you pay for whats happened. You obviously also realise how ludicrous it sounds to play the victim of isolation then. |
DT for example we dont have direct flights thats isolation in our eyes, its the degree you are willing to accept and yes you are right its the price we pay for our own country as is the loss of land and control over the north for GCs.
The degree of isolation is the key here why is it do you think that GC policies have not and will not bear fruit? but this does notmean we will stop asking for the rights that ever other person in the world enjoys. |
I don't see how your mistrust would stop you form flying like thousands other tcs from Larnaca airport. You have wys in which you can go round this so called isolation. The only options i have is a property commission you've set up which has been taking the piss out of the very few number of gc's that have tried to seek justice through it. |
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| Posted: Wed Feb 13, 2008 12:38 pm |
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| observer |
| instructor |
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| Joined: 18 Sep 2006 |
| Posts: 964 |
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| DT. wrote: |
| observer wrote: |
DT wrote:
| Quote: |
you've never been held hostage. You are free to trade through the legitimate ports of this country. Your football teams are even free to join in on EUropea competitions if they're good enough if they apply via the CFA.
You isolation is your own doing and is politically motivated. Had it been a humanitarian plight then your options are clear and there for you to utilise. |
Isn't this the logic of every bully, hostage taker or terrorist?
Of course you have a choice, you can do exactly what I want or I will hurt you, kill you, or kill lots of you. |
Turn that around to ...You can come and look at your house but if you try anything 40k soldiers are gonna kill you. |
An interesting argument which has been spoilt by exaggeration. Since the gates opened how many GCs have been killed by any soldier?
And it still doesn't negate my point. In this thread, I am making no claims. You are the one that is saying that our isolation is our own doing because we will not do what you want. I am pointing out that that is the tactic of the bully, hostage taker and terrorist throughout the centuries. |
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| Posted: Wed Feb 13, 2008 12:42 pm |
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| DT. |
| professor |
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| Joined: 12 Nov 2006 |
| Posts: 5061 |
| Location: Ethnically cleansed from Morphou |
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| observer wrote: |
| DT. wrote: |
| observer wrote: |
DT wrote:
| Quote: |
you've never been held hostage. You are free to trade through the legitimate ports of this country. Your football teams are even free to join in on EUropea competitions if they're good enough if they apply via the CFA.
You isolation is your own doing and is politically motivated. Had it been a humanitarian plight then your options are clear and there for you to utilise. |
Isn't this the logic of every bully, hostage taker or terrorist?
Of course you have a choice, you can do exactly what I want or I will hurt you, kill you, or kill lots of you. |
Turn that around to ...You can come and look at your house but if you try anything 40k soldiers are gonna kill you. |
An interesting argument which has been spoilt by exaggeration. Since the gates opened how many GCs have been killed by any soldier?
And it still doesn't negate my point. In this thread, I am making no claims. You are the one that is saying that our isolation is our own doing because we will not do what you want. I am pointing out that that is the tactic of the bully, hostage taker and terrorist throughout the centuries. |
it has nothing to do with what we want. You may have a complete disregard for the rule of law but the world doesn't.
The options you have are legal options, which the govt has to provide for you. A port of entry/exit for travel and trade, organised associations for spors etc. These are all established and recognised institutions which the world is interacting with.
Your "bully" as you put it is international law, just because you don't respect it doesn't mean its wrong. |
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