Why didn't they ask the TCs?
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 Posted: Thu Mar 20, 2008 2:55 pm |
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| Oracle |
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| Joined: 11 Feb 2008 |
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| Location: One step ahead of the Turks! |
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| observer wrote: |
| Oracle wrote: |
Blind man ... where have I made accusations of thread hijacking ... I am not [b]that[/b] authoritarian .. nor bothered about the integrity of your thread....
In hindsight the pieces of the jigsaw fitted to confirm the events of the coup ... but at the time there was no real evidence that this was an inevitability.
Not the force, time or any of the events and their manifestations could have been predicted.
It was up to whoever had accepted any loyalty to the RoC to disarm this operation ... the TCs were as well co-ordinated or not, as the case may be ...... as the GCs, to fend off the attacks ... But the TCs took a back seat to protect their rear ends ... and waited like fair maidens to be rescued ...  |
Clear-sighted man to forgetful woman
Oracle
| Quote: |
Listen Nurgary ... I have gone easy on you being a putative "newbie".
The only thing in your favour so far is that you have posted a completely irrelevant question, in precisely the wrong thread!
|
And was that your answer to why the anti-coupists didn't make contact with the TCs?
In fact the coup was very well predicted and known to most Cypriots beforehand (perhaps not the exact date). By 1974 the GCs had shredded the Constitution, so much so that the neutral president of the Supreme Court, Dr Ernst Forsthoff, resigned in protest, and TCs had been kicked out of the government in the 11 years before. Why they should show any loyalty to Makarios is a mystery.
Your lack of knowledge of the events of the time must inevitably cast doubt on your rather excitable opinions. |
Then tell me how this fitted in to your thread? ... and then iceman's response ... it was in answer to those, I took up the newbie ... so as I indicated, talk to them for posting irrelevencies .... but then of course Zan required his moments in the sun ... so don't just moan at me
| Nurgary wrote: |
New to this forum - so Hi,
Have been reading some threads over last few weeks and have to post that SBA's will only be given up when HMG wants to give them up. As simple as that. I keep on hearing that HMG owes rent on them but I can't find any document that indicates that any rent for SBA;s was ever signed. I am may be wrong so I ask anybody here to give me a reference to this document. |
Back to your post:
| observer wrote: |
And was that your answer to why the anti-coupists didn't make contact with the TCs? |
I don't know. Ask Denktash. He said it was an ".... internal Greek Cypriot affair". So the TCs were clearly distancing themselves from helping.
In any case, what does it mean if 'the anti-coupists didn't make contact with the TCs'?
And what does it mean if 'the anti-coupists did make contact with the TCs'?
Do you think Turkey endangered TCs more, by embarking on killing 7000+ GCs, instead of allying with the anti-coupists?
What would have been the TC-death toll, if Turkey allied with the anti-coupists to remove the coupists from power?
This three-way fight ensured the ones caught in the middle ... GCs ..... suffered the greatest losses ... GCs were attacked by both coupists and Turkey.
Turkey's belligerence put the TCs squarely with them, the attackers, and hence suddenly to become enemies to the GCs also! |
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| Posted: Thu Mar 20, 2008 3:02 pm |
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| Viewpoint |
| vip |
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| Joined: 20 Feb 2005 |
| Posts: 8966 |
| Location: Nicosia/Lefkosa |
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| Oracle wrote: |
| observer wrote: |
| Oracle wrote: |
Blind man ... where have I made accusations of thread hijacking ... I am not [b]that[/b] authoritarian .. nor bothered about the integrity of your thread....
In hindsight the pieces of the jigsaw fitted to confirm the events of the coup ... but at the time there was no real evidence that this was an inevitability.
Not the force, time or any of the events and their manifestations could have been predicted.
It was up to whoever had accepted any loyalty to the RoC to disarm this operation ... the TCs were as well co-ordinated or not, as the case may be ...... as the GCs, to fend off the attacks ... But the TCs took a back seat to protect their rear ends ... and waited like fair maidens to be rescued ... |
Clear-sighted man to forgetful woman
Oracle
| Quote: |
Listen Nurgary ... I have gone easy on you being a putative "newbie".
The only thing in your favour so far is that you have posted a completely irrelevant question, in precisely the wrong thread!
|
And was that your answer to why the anti-coupists didn't make contact with the TCs?
In fact the coup was very well predicted and known to most Cypriots beforehand (perhaps not the exact date). By 1974 the GCs had shredded the Constitution, so much so that the neutral president of the Supreme Court, Dr Ernst Forsthoff, resigned in protest, and TCs had been kicked out of the government in the 11 years before. Why they should show any loyalty to Makarios is a mystery.
Your lack of knowledge of the events of the time must inevitably cast doubt on your rather excitable opinions. |
Then tell me how this fitted in to your thread? ... and then iceman's response ... it was in answer to those, I took up the newbie ... so as I indicated, talk to them for posting irrelevencies .... but then of course Zan required his moments in the sun ... so don't just moan at me
| Nurgary wrote: |
New to this forum - so Hi,
Have been reading some threads over last few weeks and have to post that SBA's will only be given up when HMG wants to give them up. As simple as that. I keep on hearing that HMG owes rent on them but I can't find any document that indicates that any rent for SBA;s was ever signed. I am may be wrong so I ask anybody here to give me a reference to this document. |
Back to your post:
| observer wrote: |
And was that your answer to why the anti-coupists didn't make contact with the TCs? |
I don't know. Ask Denktash. He said it was an ".... internal Greek Cypriot affair". So the TCs were clearly distancing themselves from helping.
In any case, what does it mean if 'the anti-coupists didn't make contact with the TCs'?
And what does it mean if 'the anti-coupists did make contact with the TCs'?
Do you think Turkey endangered TCs more, by embarking on killing 7000+ GCs, instead of allying with the anti-coupists?
What would have been the TC-death toll, if Turkey allied with the anti-coupists to remove the coupists from power?
This three-way fight ensured the ones caught in the middle ... GCs ..... suffered the greatest losses ... GCs were attacked by both coupists and Turkey.
Turkey's belligerence put the TCs squarely with them, the attackers, and hence suddenly to become enemies to the GCs also! |
Why did the GCs fight Turkey???? the resistence to Turkeys help was what caused your losses, if you had of handed out roses instead of bullets and bombs you would have all been in your homes, Turkey would have resolved the consititional crisis and left. |
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| Posted: Thu Mar 20, 2008 3:09 pm |
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| denizaksulu |
| vip |
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| Joined: 10 May 2007 |
| Posts: 10870 |
| Location: London, Ethnically Cleansed from Anglisidhes since 1963 |
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[quote="Oracle"]
| observer wrote: |
| Oracle wrote: |
Blind man ... where have I made accusations of thread hijacking ... I am not [b]that[/b] authoritarian .. nor bothered about the integrity of your thread....
In hindsight the pieces of the jigsaw fitted to confirm the events of the coup ... but at the time there was no real evidence that this was an inevitability.
Not the force, time or any of the events and their manifestations could have been predicted.
It was up to whoever had accepted any loyalty to the RoC to disarm this operation ... the TCs were as well co-ordinated or not, as the case may be ...... as the GCs, to fend off the attacks ... But the TCs took a back seat to protect their rear ends ... and waited like fair maidens to be rescued ... |
Clear-sighted man to forgetful woman
Oracle
| Quote: |
Listen Nurgary ... I have gone easy on you being a putative "newbie".
The only thing in your favour so far is that you have posted a completely irrelevant question, in precisely the wrong thread!
|
And was that your answer to why the anti-coupists didn't make contact with the TCs?
In fact the coup was very well predicted and known to most Cypriots beforehand (perhaps not the exact date). By 1974 the GCs had shredded the Constitution, so much so that the neutral president of the Supreme Court, Dr Ernst Forsthoff, resigned in protest, and TCs had been kicked out of the government in the 11 years before. Why they should show any loyalty to Makarios is a mystery.
Your lack of knowledge of the events of the time must inevitably cast doubt on your rather excitable opinions. |
Then tell me how this fitted in to your thread? ... and then iceman's response ... it was in answer to those, I took up the newbie ... so as I indicated, talk to them for posting irrelevencies .... but then of course Zan required his moments in the sun ... so don't just moan at me
| Nurgary wrote: |
New to this forum - so Hi,
Have been reading some threads over last few weeks and have to post that SBA's will only be given up when HMG wants to give them up. As simple as that. I keep on hearing that HMG owes rent on them but I can't find any document that indicates that any rent for SBA;s was ever signed. I am may be wrong so I ask anybody here to give me a reference to this document. |
Back to your post:
| observer wrote: |
And was that your answer to why the anti-coupists didn't make contact with the TCs? |
I don't know. Ask Denktash. He said it was an ".... internal Greek Cypriot affair". So the TCs were clearly distancing themselves from helping.
In any case, what does it mean if 'the anti-coupists didn't make contact with the TCs'?
And what does it mean if 'the anti-coupists did make contact with the TCs'?
Do you think Turkey endangered TCs more, by embarking on killing 7000+ GCs, instead of allying with the anti-coupists?
What would have been the TC-death toll, if Turkey allied with the anti-coupists to remove the coupists from power?
This three-way fight ensured the ones caught in the middle ... GCs ..... suffered the greatest losses ... GCs were attacked by both coupists and Turkey.
Turkey's belligerence put the TCs squarely with them, the attackers, and hence suddenly to become enemies to the GCs also![/quote]
Think before you post OrPh.  Yet more inconsistency. In another response you claim Turk were your enemy since 1571. When did they become friends again to become enemies again in 1974. Please clarify in your usual red/pink colors. |
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| Posted: Thu Mar 20, 2008 3:32 pm |
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| Oracle |
| professor |
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| Joined: 11 Feb 2008 |
| Posts: 6880 |
| Location: One step ahead of the Turks! |
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[quote="denizaksulu"]
| Oracle wrote: |
| observer wrote: |
| Oracle wrote: |
Blind man ... where have I made accusations of thread hijacking ... I am not [b]that[/b] authoritarian .. nor bothered about the integrity of your thread....
In hindsight the pieces of the jigsaw fitted to confirm the events of the coup ... but at the time there was no real evidence that this was an inevitability.
Not the force, time or any of the events and their manifestations could have been predicted.
It was up to whoever had accepted any loyalty to the RoC to disarm this operation ... the TCs were as well co-ordinated or not, as the case may be ...... as the GCs, to fend off the attacks ... But the TCs took a back seat to protect their rear ends ... and waited like fair maidens to be rescued ... |
Clear-sighted man to forgetful woman
Oracle
| Quote: |
Listen Nurgary ... I have gone easy on you being a putative "newbie".
The only thing in your favour so far is that you have posted a completely irrelevant question, in precisely the wrong thread!
|
And was that your answer to why the anti-coupists didn't make contact with the TCs?
In fact the coup was very well predicted and known to most Cypriots beforehand (perhaps not the exact date). By 1974 the GCs had shredded the Constitution, so much so that the neutral president of the Supreme Court, Dr Ernst Forsthoff, resigned in protest, and TCs had been kicked out of the government in the 11 years before. Why they should show any loyalty to Makarios is a mystery.
Your lack of knowledge of the events of the time must inevitably cast doubt on your rather excitable opinions. |
Then tell me how this fitted in to your thread? ... and then iceman's response ... it was in answer to those, I took up the newbie ... so as I indicated, talk to them for posting irrelevencies .... but then of course Zan required his moments in the sun ... so don't just moan at me
| Nurgary wrote: |
New to this forum - so Hi,
Have been reading some threads over last few weeks and have to post that SBA's will only be given up when HMG wants to give them up. As simple as that. I keep on hearing that HMG owes rent on them but I can't find any document that indicates that any rent for SBA;s was ever signed. I am may be wrong so I ask anybody here to give me a reference to this document. |
Back to your post:
| observer wrote: |
And was that your answer to why the anti-coupists didn't make contact with the TCs? |
I don't know. Ask Denktash. He said it was an ".... internal Greek Cypriot affair". So the TCs were clearly distancing themselves from helping.
In any case, what does it mean if 'the anti-coupists didn't make contact with the TCs'?
And what does it mean if 'the anti-coupists did make contact with the TCs'?
Do you think Turkey endangered TCs more, by embarking on killing 7000+ GCs, instead of allying with the anti-coupists?
What would have been the TC-death toll, if Turkey allied with the anti-coupists to remove the coupists from power?
This three-way fight ensured the ones caught in the middle ... GCs ..... suffered the greatest losses ... GCs were attacked by both coupists and Turkey.
Turkey's belligerence put the TCs squarely with them, the attackers, and hence suddenly to become enemies to the GCs also![/quote]
Think before you post OrPh. Yet more inconsistency. In another response you claim Turk were your enemy since 1571. When did they become friends again to become enemies again in 1974. Please clarify in your usual red/pink colors. |
Are you no longer distinguishing between Turks and TCs ..... |
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| Posted: Thu Mar 20, 2008 4:58 pm |
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| denizaksulu |
| vip |
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| Joined: 10 May 2007 |
| Posts: 10870 |
| Location: London, Ethnically Cleansed from Anglisidhes since 1963 |
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[quote="Oracle"]
| denizaksulu wrote: |
| Oracle wrote: |
| observer wrote: |
| Oracle wrote: |
Blind man ... where have I made accusations of thread hijacking ... I am not [b]that[/b] authoritarian .. nor bothered about the integrity of your thread....
In hindsight the pieces of the jigsaw fitted to confirm the events of the coup ... but at the time there was no real evidence that this was an inevitability.
Not the force, time or any of the events and their manifestations could have been predicted.
It was up to whoever had accepted any loyalty to the RoC to disarm this operation ... the TCs were as well co-ordinated or not, as the case may be ...... as the GCs, to fend off the attacks ... But the TCs took a back seat to protect their rear ends ... and waited like fair maidens to be rescued ... |
Clear-sighted man to forgetful woman
Oracle
| Quote: |
Listen Nurgary ... I have gone easy on you being a putative "newbie".
The only thing in your favour so far is that you have posted a completely irrelevant question, in precisely the wrong thread!
|
And was that your answer to why the anti-coupists didn't make contact with the TCs?
In fact the coup was very well predicted and known to most Cypriots beforehand (perhaps not the exact date). By 1974 the GCs had shredded the Constitution, so much so that the neutral president of the Supreme Court, Dr Ernst Forsthoff, resigned in protest, and TCs had been kicked out of the government in the 11 years before. Why they should show any loyalty to Makarios is a mystery.
Your lack of knowledge of the events of the time must inevitably cast doubt on your rather excitable opinions. |
Then tell me how this fitted in to your thread? ... and then iceman's response ... it was in answer to those, I took up the newbie ... so as I indicated, talk to them for posting irrelevencies .... but then of course Zan required his moments in the sun ... so don't just moan at me
| Nurgary wrote: |
New to this forum - so Hi,
Have been reading some threads over last few weeks and have to post that SBA's will only be given up when HMG wants to give them up. As simple as that. I keep on hearing that HMG owes rent on them but I can't find any document that indicates that any rent for SBA;s was ever signed. I am may be wrong so I ask anybody here to give me a reference to this document. |
Back to your post:
| observer wrote: |
And was that your answer to why the anti-coupists didn't make contact with the TCs? |
I don't know. Ask Denktash. He said it was an ".... internal Greek Cypriot affair". So the TCs were clearly distancing themselves from helping.
In any case, what does it mean if 'the anti-coupists didn't make contact with the TCs'?
And what does it mean if 'the anti-coupists did make contact with the TCs'?
Do you think Turkey endangered TCs more, by embarking on killing 7000+ GCs, instead of allying with the anti-coupists?
What would have been the TC-death toll, if Turkey allied with the anti-coupists to remove the coupists from power?
This three-way fight ensured the ones caught in the middle ... GCs ..... suffered the greatest losses ... GCs were attacked by both coupists and Turkey.
Turkey's belligerence put the TCs squarely with them, the attackers, and hence suddenly to become enemies to the GCs also![/quote]
Think before you post OrPh. Yet more inconsistency. In another response you claim Turk were your enemy since 1571. When did they become friends again to become enemies again in 1974. Please clarify in your usual red/pink colors. |
Are you no longer distinguishing between Turks and TCs ..... |
I said red / pink. Not blue. It never bothered you before. |
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| Posted: Thu Mar 20, 2008 5:45 pm |
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| Oracle |
| professor |
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| Joined: 11 Feb 2008 |
| Posts: 6880 |
| Location: One step ahead of the Turks! |
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| Viewpoint wrote: |
Why did the GCs fight Turkey???? the resistence to Turkeys help was what caused your losses, if you had of handed out roses instead of bullets and bombs you would have all been in your homes, Turkey would have resolved the consititional crisis and left. |
.... correct homes for graves!
Where is the evidence Turkey came to help the GCs fight the coupists?
Hew well-able were they to tell the coupists from the anti-coupists? ... they all spoke Greek ... so they were all fair game to Turks that hated GCs and Greeks equally.
So I do not think your average Greek-hating, brainwashed, war-fueled, semi-literate Anatolian would have stopped to check credentials before shooting.
Why did Turkey seek to enter via the Bases (request refused) if not as part of its sneaky plan to double cross its allies and take the whole island instead of its '50s declared intent of 40%?
When in its history has Turkey truly carried out a"peace-keeping" mission?
Why did it choose to endanger the TCs by turning the GCs against them with its belligerence? ... Because that would "validate" its long-held intent of seizing half the island to "hide" them in. |
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| Posted: Thu Mar 20, 2008 6:11 pm |
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| Viewpoint |
| vip |
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| Joined: 20 Feb 2005 |
| Posts: 8966 |
| Location: Nicosia/Lefkosa |
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| Oracle wrote: |
| Viewpoint wrote: |
Why did the GCs fight Turkey???? the resistence to Turkeys help was what caused your losses, if you had of handed out roses instead of bullets and bombs you would have all been in your homes, Turkey would have resolved the consititional crisis and left. |
.... correct homes for graves!
Where is the evidence Turkey came to help the GCs fight the coupists?
Hew well-able were they to tell the coupists from the anti-coupists? ... they all spoke Greek ... so they were all fair game to Turks that hated GCs and Greeks equally.
So I do not think your average Greek-hating, brainwashed, war-fueled, semi-literate Anatolian would have stopped to check credentials before shooting.
Why did Turkey seek to enter via the Bases (request refused) if not as part of its sneaky plan to double cross its allies and take the whole island instead of its '50s declared intent of 40%?
When in its history has Turkey truly carried out a"peace-keeping" mission?
Why did it choose to endanger the TCs by turning the GCs against them with its belligerence? ... Because that would "validate" its long-held intent of seizing half the island to "hide" them in. |
What did you expect the Turkish Army to do when faced with 11 years of preparation which led to the verocity of shooting and bombs raining down on the soldiers landing on the beaches, if met with flowers they would have embraced all the people of Cyprus, but when you are met with anger and fear for your life you fight for your own and all hell breaks loose, you dug your own graves without any thought for the reprecussions of your own actions. If you play with fire you are bound to get burned. |
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| Posted: Fri Mar 21, 2008 9:33 am |
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| Nikitas |
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OK so you offer flowers to the soldiers on the beach, what exactly do you offer the pilots bombing you and the ship gunners shelling your village? How do you tell them to stop, telepathy?
The Turkish captain of the Kocatepe was radioing the Turkish pilots to stop bombing his ship and they laughed. The sank it and badly damaged two others. These guys obviously were out for blood, anyone's blood. Flowers my eye! |
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| Posted: Fri Mar 21, 2008 10:26 am |
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Oracle
| Quote: |
| When in its history has Turkey truly carried out a"peace-keeping" mission? |
Lebanon, Afghanistan, Bosnia, and if you want to go back far enough, Korea. Many would add Cyprus where there has been peace for over 30 years.
Ignorance ... ignorance ... ignorance ... mixed with a large dose of turkophobia |
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| Posted: Fri Mar 21, 2008 10:44 am |
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| denizaksulu |
| vip |
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| Joined: 10 May 2007 |
| Posts: 10870 |
| Location: London, Ethnically Cleansed from Anglisidhes since 1963 |
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| Nikitas wrote: |
OK so you offer flowers to the soldiers on the beach, what exactly do you offer the pilots bombing you and the ship gunners shelling your village? How do you tell them to stop, telepathy?
The Turkish captain of the Kocatepe was radioing the Turkish pilots to stop bombing his ship and they laughed. The sank it and badly damaged two others. These guys obviously were out for blood, anyone's blood. Flowers my eye! |
Good morning Nikitas,
The transcript of the pilots radio messages to the Kocatepe were published. Kocatepe was on radio silence for its own safety. The pilots had asked for ID (from Kocatepe). They did not break their silence. Thepilots repeated their ID equest numerous times. Then wrongly assumed it was a legitimate target. Sad for the Turks , joy for the opposition I suppose. A usuless blunder.
What is discussed here should have taken place before the horse had bolted from the stables, so no point arguing about it. If the TCs had known of any imminent Coup, it was up up to them to make the first move. IMHO.
Regards..........and have a lovely weekend |
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