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Unitary State - with provisos.

Propose and discuss specific solutions to aspects of the Cyprus Problem

Postby denizaksulu » Fri Jan 07, 2011 2:49 pm

lola-tulip wrote:Heartbroken Cyprus, with more to lose, has always been ready to sit down and talk. But, big, powerful turkey still calls the shots of when to join or leave the table. If Liberation were offered: there is much catching up for the two communities; on all that they have missed from their estrangement. Maybe to last a few centuries, again, before unresolved "past" issues resurface.




For Deniz - I have not been able to find out when this poem/song was written because it is from my anthology which does not lend itself to such deterministic matters :) Gatsos published most of his poems in the 30s and 40s but I do not have these original works. According to the Internet, he wrote songs in the second part of his life and this poem was recorded in 1974 in a discography.




Thank you Tulip for your response. It was nice of you.
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Postby denizaksulu » Sat Jan 08, 2011 3:55 pm

Yolcu wrote:yialousa1971- Narrow mindedness and racism isn't going to solve anything. I see that you are identified as a Forum Moderator. It doesn't appear that you have restrained from expressing an opinion that is far from moderate. I wonder, what exactly is it that you "lecture"? I hope it isn't history.


Yolcu - Yialoser is a self-appointed Moderator. He is having an imaginary affair with our beloved Moderator Lana. He lives in dreamland. :lol:
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Postby Yolcu » Sat Jan 08, 2011 5:27 pm

Lola-tulip and Deniz,
Both of the Poems are beautiful. Thank you for sharing your lovely way to show how you feel for Cyprus.
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Postby BirKibrisli » Sun Jan 09, 2011 3:27 am

Yolcu wrote:May a Peaceful future have no sides.

Our hearts need to be large enough to forgive and bring everyone together.

I am convinced that when the leaders of the world understand Cyprus, they will be able to come to grips with the rest of human tragedy that is playing itself out all over the world right at this moment as we all debate our intellectual analysis of the past.

The size of a good heart needs to include the ones who we believe have failed us.


Oh..NO NO NO....Stop talking about big hearts,undertanding,forgiveness etc...People on this site do not want to even think about such concepts...Here it is black and white...Our side is right,the other side is wrong,definitely...No compromise,compassion or empahty is possible...
Cyprus is Turkish and shall remain Turkish forever...There will be no solution till the "balance of power" changes...Then the remaining 63% of "occupied" Cyprus shall be liberated and returned to their rightful rulers...Thus spoke Birkibrisli! :wink: :lol: :lol:
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Postby Simon » Sun Jan 09, 2011 4:37 pm

BirKibrisli wrote:
Yolcu wrote:May a Peaceful future have no sides.

Our hearts need to be large enough to forgive and bring everyone together.

I am convinced that when the leaders of the world understand Cyprus, they will be able to come to grips with the rest of human tragedy that is playing itself out all over the world right at this moment as we all debate our intellectual analysis of the past.

The size of a good heart needs to include the ones who we believe have failed us.


Oh..NO NO NO....Stop talking about big hearts,undertanding,forgiveness etc...People on this site do not want to even think about such concepts...Here it is black and white...Our side is right,the other side is wrong,definitely...No compromise,compassion or empahty is possible...
Cyprus is Turkish and shall remain Turkish forever...There will be no solution till the "balance of power" changes...Then the remaining 63% of "occupied" Cyprus shall be liberated and returned to their rightful rulers...Thus spoke Birkibrisli! :wink: :lol: :lol:


Bir, most GCs accept that we have made mistakes and have contributed to the problem of Cyprus. Where GCs get fed up is when TCs repeat the past to justify their demands, as if only GCs should be punished for their mistakes. Where is the balance? It is clear to any objective observer that the GCs have been bending over backwards to compromise for years. A BBF is a huge compromise for us. Rotating presidency is a massive offer our President has made. Allowing thousands of settlers to stay is another. Allowing a TC constituent state and coastline to be larger than your population share is a further example. These concessions are so great that many GCs find them unacceptable, perhaps in a similar way that TCs would if their leadership agreed that the veto be removed. The fact is the TCs just want everything their own way. GCs aren't even allowed to prey in churches in the north on occasions.

You may be able to justify Turkey initially invading Cyprus, but only to restore the constitution as a guarantor. The subsequent actions and continuing occupation is illegal and this will not change. TCs need to start considering what GCs want in a more constructive manner, and stop expecting to reap the spoils of winning a war, which is how your leadership is currently behaving.

You used to be a balanced man Bir. Bitterness has got the better of you.
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Postby quattro » Sun Jan 09, 2011 5:53 pm

Bir if you cannot forgive and have a big heart i feel only pity for you dear stay in AUS and leave us to solve it the best way we can we are here living the problem you are not.
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Postby Get Real! » Sun Jan 09, 2011 5:59 pm

Simon wrote:You used to be a balanced man Bir. Bitterness has got the better of you.

You mean you couldn't see through him before until he started spelling it out for you! :lol:
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Postby Simon » Sun Jan 09, 2011 6:32 pm

Get Real! wrote:
Simon wrote:You used to be a balanced man Bir. Bitterness has got the better of you.

You mean you couldn't see through him before until he started spelling it out for you! :lol:


What I mean is, Bir previously espoused reasonable and balanced solutions and views, which he seems to no longer hold. I see no reason why he would initially lie about his beliefs, so therefore, somewhere along the line things went wrong with him.
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Postby BirKibrisli » Mon Jan 10, 2011 1:52 am

Simon wrote:
BirKibrisli wrote:
Yolcu wrote:May a Peaceful future have no sides.

Our hearts need to be large enough to forgive and bring everyone together.

I am convinced that when the leaders of the world understand Cyprus, they will be able to come to grips with the rest of human tragedy that is playing itself out all over the world right at this moment as we all debate our intellectual analysis of the past.

The size of a good heart needs to include the ones who we believe have failed us.


Oh..NO NO NO....Stop talking about big hearts,undertanding,forgiveness etc...People on this site do not want to even think about such concepts...Here it is black and white...Our side is right,the other side is wrong,definitely...No compromise,compassion or empahty is possible...
Cyprus is Turkish and shall remain Turkish forever...There will be no solution till the "balance of power" changes...Then the remaining 63% of "occupied" Cyprus shall be liberated and returned to their rightful rulers...Thus spoke Birkibrisli! :wink: :lol: :lol:


Bir, most GCs accept that we have made mistakes and have contributed to the problem of Cyprus. Where GCs get fed up is when TCs repeat the past to justify their demands, as if only GCs should be punished for their mistakes. Where is the balance? It is clear to any objective observer that the GCs have been bending over backwards to compromise for years. A BBF is a huge compromise for us. Rotating presidency is a massive offer our President has made. Allowing thousands of settlers to stay is another. Allowing a TC constituent state and coastline to be larger than your population share is a further example. These concessions are so great that many GCs find them unacceptable, perhaps in a similar way that TCs would if their leadership agreed that the veto be removed. The fact is the TCs just want everything their own way. GCs aren't even allowed to prey in churches in the north on occasions.

You may be able to justify Turkey initially invading Cyprus, but only to restore the constitution as a guarantor. The subsequent actions and continuing occupation is illegal and this will not change. TCs need to start considering what GCs want in a more constructive manner, and stop expecting to reap the spoils of winning a war, which is how your leadership is currently behaving.

You used to be a balanced man Bir. Bitterness has got the better of you.


What got the better of me was not "bitterness",dear Simon...
It was being told time and time again that I was an Ottoman remnant,my pain and loss did not count,that I was wrong to oppose Enosis with Greece,and I was a terrorist because I had the audacity to suggest that TMT was originally formed to protect the TCs from what was the expected onslought from the EOKA and GC paramilitaries....

I have not written one word here in the past 6 years that I would not stand by now...I am simply practising the motto "If you can't beat them join them!"...If there is no empathy and compassion and respect and understanding for the TC plight,then there will be none for the GC plight...Fair is fair...If Cyprus is a Greek island and has always been so,then there are no Cypriots,no Cypriot nation,and my very being is in question...I have no other option but to return fire with fire...

If everything that is touched by the Greek culture and civilisation shall reamain forever Greek,then everything that is touched by the Turkish culture and civilisation shall remain Turkish...If we are playing the game of "waiting for the balance of power to change" to resort to military action,then I will go along with that and accept that "might is right",so be it...You get my drift???
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Postby BirKibrisli » Mon Jan 10, 2011 2:01 am

quattro wrote:Bir if you cannot forgive and have a big heart i feel only pity for you dear stay in AUS and leave us to solve it the best way we can we are here living the problem you are not.


I have a bigger heart than you can ever imagine,dear quattro...
But one sided empathy and compassion are not enough to solve our problem...don't worry,I have resigned my self to living out my life in exile...As to solving the problem amoungst yourselves,I can only wish you luck...Just look at some of the p[osters on this forum and multiply that by thousands out there,and you will understand why there will never be a solution...Apart from the status quo that is... :(
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