Cyprus-Forum.com

[Bananiot]

My friend, I am not reporting for a newspaper. I am not an unbiased journalist here, I am here to tell my opinion primarily, otherwise I (and I am sure you too) wouldn't bother.

B25 however, could not stand, from day one, a different opinion from his own, so he uses barbarous insults to make his point, he thinks.

You are correct, insan, I also took almost the same wording (but off hand) from the relevant Sec. Council Resolutions on Cyprus.

[Talisker]

As indicated in another thread (TC students impose segregation from Turks, http://www.cyprus-forum.com/viewtopic.php?t=27965) I've been reading a paper 'Trauma, identity and search for a solution in Cyprus' (http://www.vamikvolkan.com/History-of-Cyprus.php) by Vamik D. Volkan, Emeritus Professor of Psychiatry at the University of Virginia, Charlottesville, Virginia, USA. Professor Volkan is Turkish Cypriot.

He makes the following interesting observation in this paper regarding some pupils being sent by TC parents to receive their education in the free south:

I began to interview Cypriot Turks in their late teens and early twenties, boys and girls, whenever I could. I should say that I was not conducting scientific research; I simply wanted to develop a clearer general impression of their views.

The results of my interviews surprised me. All of the young people I interviewed seemed unaware of their ancestors’ recent history. I also learned that, since the opening of the borders between the Greek and Turkish sides after the Greek side became a member of the European Union, more than 250 Turkish Cypriot families began sending their children to secondary or higher schools on the Greek side where no lessons are given on the massive and chronic Cypriot Turkish trauma. I was also informed that 10-20 Cypriot Turkish children are also attending Cypriot Greek elementary schools. The Cypriot Turkish parents’ justification for sending their children to schools on the Cypriot Greek side is their perception that the Cypriot Turkish schools are inferior to the schools in the south, which are part of the EU system. Some parents were aware that their children might experience humili­ations after crossing the border to the Cypriot Greek side, but in spite of this they continued to send them there.

I'd hope there might be an opportunity here for GCs to show that TCs can be successfully integrated into a unified nation state by ensuring these children receive the appropriate protection and quality education to persuade more TCs that it is safe and beneficial to mix with GCs. This may ultimately assist progression to a reunified, reintegrated, democratic Cyprus - surely the best solution for all in the long run?

[B25]

"political equality of 2 communities" is not the personal belief of Bananiot... it's the belief of every Cypriot and foreigner concerned about reunification of Cyprus and accepted by UN in relevant resolutions...

link

In 1990 a major development was an initiative by the Secretary-General to provide a more elaborate definition of the concept of bi-zonality in his 8 March 1990 report to the Council. In it he also raised the concept of political equality. (The report was subsequently endorsed by the Council in resolution 716 of 11 October 1991.) It said:

“The political equality of the two communities in and the bi-communal nature of the federation need to be acknowledged. While political equality does not mean equal numerical participation in all federal government branches and administration, it should be reflected inter alia in various ways: in the requirement that the federal constitution of the State of Cyprus be approved or amended with the concurrence of both communities; in the effective participation of both communities in all organs and decisions of the federal Government in safeguards to ensure that the federal Government will not be empowered to adopt any measures against the interests of one community; and in the equality and identical powers and functions of the two federated States.” “The bi-zonality of the federation should be clearly brought out by the fact that each federated State will be administered by one community which will be firmly guaranteed a clear majority of the population and of the land ownership in its area.” (S/21183, Annex I)

4.3 . Bi-zonality and political equality revisited

In 1992, Secretary-General Boutros Boutros-Ghali introduced a new “Set of Ideas” for a draft settlement, further expanding the previous concepts and proposing a secular, bi-zonal, bi-communal federal republic composed of two politically equal states, to be submitted to both communities for referendum (S/23780). The plan defined the relationship between Greek and Turkish Cypriots as not one of majority and minority, but rather one of two communities in the state of Cyprus. The concept of political equality picked up the idea endorsed by the Council in resolution 716. Bi-zonality would be reflected in the fact that each state in the federation would exercise jurisdiction over a clear majority of the population and of land ownership in its area.

Yes Insan, just quote the UN resolutions that suit YOU. how many resolutions are there AGAINST you that you refuse to acknowledge?? And you idiot pleb Banana was going to quote the same, hooray! What a plonker.

[B25]

My friend, I am not reporting for a newspaper. I am not an unbiased journalist here, I am here to tell my opinion primarily, otherwise I (and I am sure you too) wouldn't bother.

B25 however, could not stand, from day one, a different opinion from his own, so he uses barbarous insults to make his point, he thinks.

You are correct, insan, I also took almost the same wording (but off hand) from the relevant Sec. Council Resolutions on Cyprus.

Banana, you can have your opinion, but you try to force feed it to the rest of us who don't agree. You are just a guilty of insults, so stop playing the innocent here. 76% have my way of thinking, what about yours???

Lets just agree to disagree shall we, you opinionate the giving of our country to the Turkey I wishing to hold onto it for Cyprus.

However, I won't stand by and listen to some of the deliberate propoganda you transmit under the guise of your opinion.

Have a good evening.

[insan]

"political equality of 2 communities" is not the personal belief of Bananiot... it's the belief of every Cypriot and foreigner concerned about reunification of Cyprus and accepted by UN in relevant resolutions...

link

In 1990 a major development was an initiative by the Secretary-General to provide a more elaborate definition of the concept of bi-zonality in his 8 March 1990 report to the Council. In it he also raised the concept of political equality. (The report was subsequently endorsed by the Council in resolution 716 of 11 October 1991.) It said:

“The political equality of the two communities in and the bi-communal nature of the federation need to be acknowledged. While political equality does not mean equal numerical participation in all federal government branches and administration, it should be reflected inter alia in various ways: in the requirement that the federal constitution of the State of Cyprus be approved or amended with the concurrence of both communities; in the effective participation of both communities in all organs and decisions of the federal Government in safeguards to ensure that the federal Government will not be empowered to adopt any measures against the interests of one community; and in the equality and identical powers and functions of the two federated States.” “The bi-zonality of the federation should be clearly brought out by the fact that each federated State will be administered by one community which will be firmly guaranteed a clear majority of the population and of the land ownership in its area.” (S/21183, Annex I)

4.3 . Bi-zonality and political equality revisited

In 1992, Secretary-General Boutros Boutros-Ghali introduced a new “Set of Ideas” for a draft settlement, further expanding the previous concepts and proposing a secular, bi-zonal, bi-communal federal republic composed of two politically equal states, to be submitted to both communities for referendum (S/23780). The plan defined the relationship between Greek and Turkish Cypriots as not one of majority and minority, but rather one of two communities in the state of Cyprus. The concept of political equality picked up the idea endorsed by the Council in resolution 716. Bi-zonality would be reflected in the fact that each state in the federation would exercise jurisdiction over a clear majority of the population and of land ownership in its area.

Yes Insan, just quote the UN resolutions that suit YOU. how many resolutions are there AGAINST you that you refuse to acknowledge?? And you idiot pleb Banana was going to quote the same, hooray! What a plonker.

I acknowledge all UN resolutions... i haven't refused any of them... Almost all UN resolutions call upon all concerned parties to do this or that... Only one calls upon UN members not to recognise the TRNC... and in the constitution of TRNC it clearly cites that existence or recognition of TRNC, is not an obstacle in front of reunification...

What will unite us will be the common interests we agreed on, not whether TRNC is recognized or not... However, this is something u will never comprehend, put aside understanding it...

Recognition of TRNC does not solve the Cyprus problem just like recognition of so-called RoC didn't solve it...

[Bananiot]

You are thick, as well as a fascist B25. I can just about tolerate an intelligent fascist who can communicate in an articulate way his ideas, however, a thick fascist like yourself is too much for this forum. I was trying to say that I was doing exactly what my employer wanted me to do with respect to how we should deal with our T/C compatriots. Obviously this is too much for you to understand.

Taliskser, can you get my point? I am not here to report stories for anyone, for you or anyone else. I am here to express my honest, unbiased, democratic and so forth opinion. Can you deal with this? As far as the point you raised about T/C students coming to the south, you might like to know that the serious students, that is those with aspirations for university studies abroad, go to the English school and they are taught in English. I suppose you know what some bash patriots did to them a year or so ago. Very few, basically of Kurdish and Roma origin go to Ayios Antonios School in Limassol. Greek Cypriot teachers (belonging to the bash patriot function) do not accept appointment to this school and they refer to it the "tourdjiko sxoleio". So, before jumping to conclusions about the solution we should seek, you should look at the wider picture, the real picture of Cyprus (for which you can find scientific measurements in order to evaluate situations and try to safely arrive at conclusions) which speaks volumes about the dangers of pursuing a solution based on a unitary country. I would be the first to support it, of course, if it were feasible. There is no doubt that this is the best solution. However, we must remember that every time we went for the desirable instead of the feasible, we paid a hefty price. We cannot afford to do the same mistake because this would be our last one.

[Oracle]

The "equal partners" talk targets those that refuse to accept the only feasible solution to our problem, that is, BBF between two politically equal communities and who, by insisting on a desirable but not feasible so called better solution, simply work for total destruction of Cyprus.

So, you are using your position as a "teacher" to spread your political agenda and brainwash the young 'uns?

Have we been transported back to Stalin's oligarchic era?

[Oracle]

I am not here to report stories for anyone, for you or anyone else. I am here to express my honest, unbiased, democratic and so forth opinion. .

But does anyone realise how warped and pro-occupation/partition your views are?

[Bananiot]

Direct your complains to my boss (name and address provide)

Dr Andreas Demetriou
Minister of Education and Culture
Corner of Kimonos and Thoukidides
Akropolis 1434
Nicosia

[Talisker]

Taliskser, can you get my point? I am not here to report stories for anyone, for you or anyone else. I am here to express my honest, unbiased, democratic and so forth opinion. Can you deal with this?

Well actually, if I'm being pedantic, you do 'report stories' (in red text). You then provided additional information providing your opinion on how a solution would pan out (in blue text).

Its the first of its kind and it is taking place tomorrow (Monday). Greek Cypriot teachers will visit a number of Turkish Cypriot schools on Monday December 28. The visits are taking place at a time when serious efforts are being made to solve our problem and will contribute to a better understanding between the two communities who will be asked to govern our united country as two equal partners in the blissful event of a solution.

Frankly, I don't care, I was just pointing out that in this case your opinion distracted from the interesting facts you reported.

As far as the point you raised about T/C students coming to the south, you might like to know that the serious students, that is those with aspirations for university studies abroad, go to the English school and they are taught in English. I suppose you know what some bash patriots did to them a year or so ago. Very few, basically of Kurdish and Roma origin go to Ayios Antonios School in Limassol. Greek Cypriot teachers (belonging to the bash patriot function) do not accept appointment to this school and they refer to it the "tourdjiko sxoleio". So, before jumping to conclusions about the solution we should seek, you should look at the wider picture, the real picture of Cyprus (for which you can find scientific measurements in order to evaluate situations and try to safely arrive at conclusions) which speaks volumes about the dangers of pursuing a solution based on a unitary country. I would be the first to support it, of course, if it were feasible. There is no doubt that this is the best solution. However, we must remember that every time we went for the desirable instead of the feasible, we paid a hefty price. We cannot afford to do the same mistake because this would be our last one.

I've argued elsewhere that the RoC government should provide incentives for TCs to come south, including appropriate protection and lack of discrimination. I disagree with you about the aspirations of any solution - it should be for the very best for all Cypriots as EU citizens, and in my opinion this would be as a unified, democratic state where everyone moves on from being a GC or a TC or whatever to becoming a Cypriot with equal human and political rights as individuals within the Cypriot melting pot.