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GREEK CYPRIOT TEACHERS VISITING T/C SCHOOLS TOMORROW

Propose and discuss specific solutions to aspects of the Cyprus Problem

Postby denizaksulu » Tue Dec 29, 2009 9:53 pm

halil wrote:
denizaksulu wrote:
Bananiot wrote:Thus we agree to differ on this, Talisker, there is nothing wrong with this. To your questions now:

1. Any GC teacher can go to these visits, but the majority refuse to do so.
2. The TC teachers are very moderate and quite progressive. I would say they are light years ahead of us on this. Pupils in TC schools seem very glad to see us and very ... curious too.
3. Your last question raises some important issues. For a start, these visits are now becoming quite regular. It is a pity we cannot reciprocate to the same effect. Very few schools on our side have followed the lead of TC schools. As I wrote before, it is up to the Headmaster of each school to embrace the effort. Most Headmasters on our side are reactionary and would never allow Turks to set foot at their schools. Some have done a great job, however. Among them are Pavlos Karagiorgis from Avgorou Technical School and Theocharis Masouras, who this year did fantastic stuff at Vergina Lyceum in Larnaca. Here is a short report that appeared in newspapers after a recent event on December 14 at Vergina Lyceum, organised by Headmaster Theocharis Masouras. Sorry but it is in Greek.

«Η Κυβέρνηση και το Υπουργείο Παιδείας και Πολιτισμού εργάζονται για ένα σχολείο κατά του αποκλεισμού, ένα σχολείο συνύπαρξης όλων των πολιτισμών και φυσικά ένα σχολείο το οποίο καλλιεργεί την ειρηνική συναντίληψη και συνύπαρξη των δύο μεγαλύτερων κοινοτήτων, της ελληνοκυπριακής και της τουρκοκυπριακής». Αυτό ήταν το μήνυμα που έστειλε ο Υπουργός Παιδείας και Πολιτισμού Ανδρέας Δημητρίου μιλώντας στο δικοινοτικό-διαπολιτισμικό συναπάντημα «Ολοι μαζί», που διοργάνωσε το Λύκειο Βεργίνας στις 14 Δεκεμβρίου.

Το μήνυμα της εκδήλωσης διατύπωσε επιγραμματικά ο Υπουργός Παιδείας και Πολιτισμού λέγοντας πως αν εκδηλώσεις σαν αυτές γίνονταν την επομένη των Συμφωνιών Ζυρίχης - Λονδίνου στα σχολεία, θα προλαβαίναμε πολλά σημερινά δεινά. «Ποτέ δεν είναι αργά», είπε. Η καλλιέργεια κουλτούρας ειρηνικής συμβίωσης Ε/κ - Τ/κ και διαπολιτισμικής συνύπαρξης, υπογράμμισε, είναι η λυδία λίθος για την ειρήνη και ευτυχία στο νησί μας.

Ο Υπουργός Παιδείας και Πολιτισμό επαίνεσε το Λύκειο Βεργίνας που είναι πρωτοπόρο σε αυτή την προσπάθεια, όπως τόνισε, μιλώντας ενώπιον ακροατηρίου από Ελληνοκύπριους, Τουρκοκύπριους, Παλαιστίνιους μαθητές από το εν λόγω σχολείο, αλλά και από την Αγγλική Σχολή Λευκωσίας.

Ο διευθυντής του Σχολείου Θεοχάρης Μασούρας, συλλογιζόμενος το πολιτικό μας πρόβλημα ανέφερε πως αυτή η πατρίδα είναι πολύ μικρή για να συνεχίσει να παραμένει χωρισμένη στα δυο, αλλά και πολύ μεγάλη για να χωρέσει όλους μας, σε μια πολυπολιτισμική Κύπρο χωρίς σύνορα και διαχωριστικά οδοφράγματα.

«Το πόσο μικρή είναι η Κύπρος, μας το υπενθυμίζει η φύση. Λίγο να σηκωθεί η στάθμη της θάλασσας, ένα τσουνάμι, μια μεγάλη πυρκαγιά, μια πανδημία, ένας σεισμός, ένας μολυσμένος ιός, καταστραφήκαμε όλοι, αδιακρίτως γλώσσας, θρησκείας και καταγωγής. Η Κύπρος χάθηκε!», σημείωσε.

Το πέρασμα του χρόνου, είπε ο κ. Μασούρας, με άλυτο το κυπριακό πρόβλημα εμπεδώνει τη διχοτόμηση και την αποξένωση. Ο ιός του εθνικισμού και σοβινισμού, πρόσθεσε, πρέπει να εκλείψει ώστε να μην βρει ξανά πρόσφορο έδαφος και λίπασμα για να γεννήσει άλλα άνθη του κακού και του μίσους. Εκδηλώσεις βέβαια σαν αυτή, σημείωσε, δεν δίνουν λύση στο κυπριακό πρόβλημα ούτε ασχολούνται με το περιεχόμενο της όποιας λύσης. «Εχουν όμως ένα στόχο. Να μας προετοιμάσουν ψυχολογικά και συναισθηματικά ώστε όταν οι ηγέτες των δύο κοινοτήτων καταθέσουν στον κυπριακό λαό, Ε/κ και Τ/κ, ένα σύνταγμα επανένωσης της πατρίδας να το στηρίξουμε. Κι αν ακόμη δεν τα βρούμε και καταδικαστούμε να ζούμε εσαεί χωριστά, «τζιείνοι ποτζιεί, τζιαι μεις ποδά», εκδηλώσεις σαν αυτή, μας μαθαίνουν να ανεχόμαστε και να σεβόμαστε ο ένας τον άλλο, ο γείτονας, τον γείτονα, ο Ε/κ, τον Τ/κ και αντιστρόφως», υπογράμμισε. Η εκδήλωση όμως αυτή, εκτός από δικοινοτική είναι και διαπολιτισμική, είπε εξηγώντας πως γι‘ αυτό το λόγο συμμετέχουν και οι αραβόφωνοι μαθητές του Σχολείου. «Θέλουμε να στείλουμε λοιπόν διττό μήνυμα: Όλοι μαζί μπορούμε να συμβιώσουμε και να ζήσουμε ειρηνικά στο σημερινό πολυπολιτισμικό παγκοσμιοποιημένο περιβάλλον. Υποσχόμαστε στα αραβόπουλα πως όσο καιρό θα διαρκέσει η παραμονή τους στον τόπο μας, αυτή θα τους είναι ευχάριστη ανάμνηση και θα έχουν να διηγούνται για την κυπριακή φιλοξενία που συνάντησαν. Υποσχόμαστε στους σύνοικους και συμπατριώτες μας Τ/κ πως θα κόψουμε πίσω μας και θα γκρεμίσουμε τα γιοφύρια του μίσους και της καχυποψίας προσδοκώντας τη μέρα της λύτρωσης και επανένωσης της γλυκείας χώρας.

Για να γυρίσει όμως ο ήλιος θέλει δουλειά πολλή. Εμείς τοποθετούμε το δικό μας χαλικάκι στην υπόθεση της ειρήνης και της συμβίωσης. Ο νομπελίστας φυσικός Einstein, διαχρονικός στις ιδέες του και στον τρόπο επίλυσης χρόνιων προβλημάτων, μας δείχνει τον τρόπο “Δεν μπορείς να επιλύσεις ένα πρόβλημα με το επίπεδο σκέψης που το δημιούργησε”», υπογράμμισε ο κ. Μασούρας.

Στο δικοινοτικό μέρος της εκδήλωσης, συμμετείχαν με προγράμματά τους Ελληνοκύπριοι και Τουρκοκύπριοι μαθητές, λογοτέχνες και τραγουδοποιοί. Ως προς το διαπολιτισμικό μέρος συμμετείχαν αραβόφωνοι μαθητές, που αποτελούν την πιο συμπαγή ομάδα αλλόγλωσσων παιδιών του Λυκείου Βεργίνας.

Το καλλιτεχνικό πρόγραμμα περιλάμβανε τραγούδια και απαγγελίες από τα παιδιά του Λυκείου, ενώ τα 44 παιδιά των Τουρκοκυπρίων τραγούδησαν την «Τυλληρκώτισσα». Οι Αραβες μαθητές του σχολείου, κυρίως Παλαιστίνιοι εντυπωσίασαν με τους χορούς τους. Κοινή διαπίστωση όλων ήταν η ομοιότητά τους με τους ποντιακούς χορούς.

Ποίηση απήγγειλαν ο Άντης Κανάκης και η Νεσιέ Γιασίν, ενώ φωνητικό σύνολο του Λυκείου τραγούδησε μεταξύ άλλων και τραγούδι «Η δική μου η πατρίδα» σε στίχους της Νεσιέ Γιασίν. Τραγούδησαν επίσης ο Αδάμος Κατσαντώνης και ο Γιλτάν Τασκί.

Στην εκδήλωση παρευρέθηκαν βουλευτές από το ΑΚΕΛ, ΔΗΣΥ, ΔΗΚΟ, δημοτικοί σύμβουλοι, στελέχη του Υ.Π.Π., μέλη του Συνδέσμου Γονέων, εκπρόσωποι κομμάτων, αστυνομίας, στρατού και εκπρόσωποι της Παλαιστινιακής Πρεσβείας.


Convergence of the educational systems in north and south may be possible, after solution, and when we have buried nationalism forever.


Will that ever happen? I doubt it. It goes to both sides.

Bananiot, apart from nationalism what are your other opinions of the visits? are they positive?


Deniz here is the news link about GC teachers visit to north.

http://www.kibrisligazetesi.net/kibrisl ... e_id=32771

http://www.kibrispostasi.com/index.php/ ... _HABERLERI

Deniz comments for above news might be very intersting for u to read as well ....



Thank you Halil.
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Postby Talisker » Tue Dec 29, 2009 9:55 pm

Bananiot wrote:Thus we agree to differ on this, Talisker, there is nothing wrong with this. To your questions now:

1. Any GC teacher can go to these visits, but the majority refuse to do so.
2. The TC teachers are very moderate and quite progressive. I would say they are light years ahead of us on this. Pupils in TC schools seem very glad to see us and very ... curious too.
3. Your last question raises some important issues. For a start, these visits are now becoming quite regular. It is a pity we cannot reciprocate to the same effect. Very few schools on our side have followed the lead of TC schools. As I wrote before, it is up to the Headmaster of each school to embrace the effort. Most Headmasters on our side are reactionary and would never allow Turks to set foot at their schools. Some have done a great job, however. Among them are Pavlos Karagiorgis from Avgorou Technical School and Theocharis Masouras, who this year did fantastic stuff at Vergina Lyceum in Larnaca. Here is a short report that appeared in newspapers after a recent event on December 14 at Vergina Lyceum, organised by Headmaster Theocharis Masouras. Sorry but it is in Greek.

Convergence of the educational systems in north and south may be possible, after solution, and when we have buried nationalism forever.

Thanks Bananiot, I would fight for your right to disagree with me! :lol:

I'd imagine most headteachers are in the 50+ age bracket. They will remember the traumas the island went through 35+ years previously, and are therefore likely to be prejudiced in their thoughts of Turks and TCs. Are the younger generation of teachers (and future headteachers) more likely to be involved in exchange visits? Wish I could read the report you provided - but afraid I got to admit I can't read Greek. :(

If exchange visits occur more frequently convergence of educational systems may be possible, and highly beneficial, even before a solution. Was hugely encouraged to read on another thread that Greek is now taught in (some?) TC schools - couldn't the RoC government and teaching authorities in the south offer support there, and possible exchange for teaching of Turkish (or is that seen as a step too far at this stage?)?
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Postby Piratis » Tue Dec 29, 2009 9:59 pm

Bananiot wrote:Piratis, spare us the agony. It was you who started all this name calling because you did not stand to listen to the opposite view. During the referendum, we could not even put one "yes" sticker on our cars because the windscreen would get duly smashed by your kind. All the "yes" kiosks were vandalised and then the ambient atmosphere followed where 26% of Cypriots were declared foreign agents. We have seen the ugly face of fascism and we can smell a fascist from miles.


I smashed no windscreens or any of the other things you accuse me of asshole. Maybe you did, but I didn't.

You are the biggest fascist and you want to apply in Cyprus the kind of fascism that exists in Turkey by making the whole of Cyprus a Banana Republic of Turkey where Turks do whatever they feel like with no regards to democracy and human rights. We will not allow you to downgrade the Cypriot people to the status of the Kurds in Turkey.
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Postby Bananiot » Tue Dec 29, 2009 10:57 pm

Have you lost it too, Piratis? I said people that became fanatic for the "no" vote did bad things during the referendum. Didn't say that you personally vandalised cars or kiosks.
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Postby Piratis » Tue Dec 29, 2009 11:06 pm

You said "the windscreen would get duly smashed by your kind." Apparently for you everybody that disagrees with you is fascist and the "kind" that smashes windscreens!! Hooligans exist proportionally on all "sides" and of course the fewer people your side has the fewer hooligans will have as well. This doesn't mean you can equate the 76% of the people who do not accept your plans for Cyprus with those that smash windshields!
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Postby Bananiot » Tue Dec 29, 2009 11:12 pm

No I do not Piratis. I call fascists out but you keep quite and this makes me wonder. For example, ELAM went on as SS type march on Saturday, shouting sick slogans and brandishing batons and you said nothing, not a single word of condemnation came from your mouth. You only managed to mumble that you "understand the reaction of these people", that is the fascists.

I remind you also that the very first post I entered in this forum was enough for you to call me a traitor to my country. If you give, you must be prepared to take. As simple as that.
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Postby Piratis » Wed Dec 30, 2009 2:20 am

Bananiot, I don't know anything about ELAM, I am not associated with them in any way, neither I have ever seen any of their demonstrations. I was just replying to your post about a demonstration against the employment of foreign workers, and not about some organization I know nothing about.

If you give, you must be prepared to take.

No problem with me. This is what I said to Bir as well, who saw some problem with "our version" of free speech!
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Postby Bananiot » Wed Dec 30, 2009 10:12 am

You were quick to excuse them! You understood their reaction, you wrote. You tend to have an opinion on anything we discuss here (that is fine of course) but then you cannot get yourself to condemn outright an organisation that threatens to infect our society with the deadly virus of fascism. You, and some others in this forum, of the bash patriot nature.
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Postby runaway » Wed Dec 30, 2009 10:49 am

Piratis wrote:We will not allow you to downgrade the Cypriot people to the status of the Kurds in Turkey.


If TCs could have been president, prime minister, ministers like Kurds in Türkiye in ex rep. of Cyprus, we wouldn't have CY problem by now. We all know we won't have an upgrade in that field in the next 1000 years. :evil:
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Postby Tim Drayton » Wed Dec 30, 2009 11:04 am

Talisker wrote:
Bananiot wrote:Thus we agree to differ on this, Talisker, there is nothing wrong with this. To your questions now:

1. Any GC teacher can go to these visits, but the majority refuse to do so.
2. The TC teachers are very moderate and quite progressive. I would say they are light years ahead of us on this. Pupils in TC schools seem very glad to see us and very ... curious too.
3. Your last question raises some important issues. For a start, these visits are now becoming quite regular. It is a pity we cannot reciprocate to the same effect. Very few schools on our side have followed the lead of TC schools. As I wrote before, it is up to the Headmaster of each school to embrace the effort. Most Headmasters on our side are reactionary and would never allow Turks to set foot at their schools. Some have done a great job, however. Among them are Pavlos Karagiorgis from Avgorou Technical School and Theocharis Masouras, who this year did fantastic stuff at Vergina Lyceum in Larnaca. Here is a short report that appeared in newspapers after a recent event on December 14 at Vergina Lyceum, organised by Headmaster Theocharis Masouras. Sorry but it is in Greek.

Convergence of the educational systems in north and south may be possible, after solution, and when we have buried nationalism forever.

Thanks Bananiot, I would fight for your right to disagree with me! :lol:

I'd imagine most headteachers are in the 50+ age bracket. They will remember the traumas the island went through 35+ years previously, and are therefore likely to be prejudiced in their thoughts of Turks and TCs. Are the younger generation of teachers (and future headteachers) more likely to be involved in exchange visits? Wish I could read the report you provided - but afraid I got to admit I can't read Greek. :(

If exchange visits occur more frequently convergence of educational systems may be possible, and highly beneficial, even before a solution. Was hugely encouraged to read on another thread that Greek is now taught in (some?) TC schools - couldn't the RoC government and teaching authorities in the south offer support there, and possible exchange for teaching of Turkish (or is that seen as a step too far at this stage?)?


Turkish is available as an optional third foreign language at a number of Greek Cypriot high schools. There are also quite a few Turkish language courses for adults being run at government education centres.
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