Cyprus-Forum.com

[Robin Hood]

ISIS driven out of Palmyra again by Assad's forces with help from the Russian air forces and other allies.

Syrian Army recaptures Palmyra, aided by Russian Air Force – Kremlin
https://on.rt.com/84l9

For those that won't accept the news from RT ..........

Palmyra: Syrian forces 'completely retake' IS-held town
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/mar/02/syrian-regime-recaptures-palmyra-from-islamic-state

[miltiades]

ISIS driven out of Palmyra again by Assad's forces with help from the Russian air forces and other allies.

Syrian Army recaptures Palmyra, aided by Russian Air Force – Kremlin
https://on.rt.com/84l9

For those that won't accept the news from RT ..........

Palmyra: Syrian forces 'completely retake' IS-held town
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/mar/02/syrian-regime-recaptures-palmyra-from-islamic-state

Surely you mean ...singular NOT plural !!

[Robin Hood]

ISIS driven out of Palmyra again by Assad's forces with help from the Russian air forces and other allies.

Syrian Army recaptures Palmyra, aided by Russian Air Force – Kremlin
https://on.rt.com/84l9

For those that won't accept the news from RT ..........

Palmyra: Syrian forces 'completely retake' IS-held town
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/mar/02/syrian-regime-recaptures-palmyra-from-islamic-state

Surely you mean ...singular NOT plural !!

Milti .......... promise me you will try to keep up, you’re getting sloppy ......... correct name of Russian Air Force is ........ Russian Aerospace Forces So RT got it wrong!

[Londonrake]

ISIS driven out of Palmyra again by Assad's forces with help from the Russian air forces and other allies.

Syrian Army recaptures Palmyra, aided by Russian Air Force – Kremlin
https://on.rt.com/84l9

For those that won't accept the news from RT ..........

Palmyra: Syrian forces 'completely retake' IS-held town
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/mar/02/syrian-regime-recaptures-palmyra-from-islamic-state

Thanks. Yes, I had been following the story and of course it's very good news. As is any about the attritional demise of ISIS. I hope they haven't repeated their previous cultural vandalism. Destroying millennium old architectural treasures on the basis that they are "un-Islamic". Much like the Taliban used to IIRC.

A silver lining I read recently though was that on one of the desecrated sites the explosives have in fact revealed previously buried treasures which may exceed in importance those destroyed. Also of efforts on the part of some nations to restore partially destroyed areas.

None of that of course can bring back the large number of people who have been publicly executed, usually in a very barbaric manner at Palymyra for ISIS capital sins. The likes of trying to flee or resisting being cannon fodder for "the cause".

As far as RT is concerned you again give a distorted view. Like your "F" internet sites (to me fringe to you perhaps free) they are not in any respect an impartial source. RT is a large, very well resourced, State run media group. In no way does it have any editorial autonomy and to present it as a paragon of such whilst denigrating all of the Western press as "propaganda rags" shows not only extreme prejudice but also perhaps an extraordinary level of naivety. As I keep repeating, news sources within a dictatorship don't all play martial music and praise the Great Leader 24/7. Propaganda is quite subtle and the art of "spin" has certainly been no stranger to President Putin in his past. However, those who wish to believe what they churn out 100% are not likely to change their mind. Dogma and confirmation bias.

I don't know why you include the Guardian. It is of course a prime example of your typical Western MSM propaganda rag.

Whilst you and I disagree on many things there is (mostly) I think fairly civilised discourse about them. It seems though that this particular subject and its associated ones attract an element with racist "issues". In particular a seminal hatred of the British. I can see why you get along so well.

[Robin Hood]

LR:

As far as RT is concerned you again give a distorted view. Like your "F" internet sites (to me fringe to you perhaps free) they are not in any respect an impartial source. RT is a large, very well resourced, State run media group. In no way does it have any editorial autonomy and to present it as a paragon of such whilst denigrating all of the Western press as "propaganda rags" shows not only extreme prejudice but also perhaps an extraordinary level of naivety. As I keep repeating, news sources within a dictatorship don't all play martial music and praise the Great Leader 24/7. Propaganda is quite subtle and the art of "spin" has certainly been no stranger to President Putin in his past. However, those who wish to believe what they churn out 100% are not likely to change their mind. Dogma and confirmation bias.

I don't know why you include the Guardian. It is of course a prime example of your typical Western MSM propaganda rag. (To show that I have no bias and can recognise 'subtle propaganda' .... the Guardian is nowhere near as accomplished as RT . because its too obvious .... see below.)

No, I disagree, the view as presented by RT as news is not distorted far from it! The rest of that paragraph is your own opinion driven by your dogma and is not supported by fact. Most MSM outlets are also very heavily funded by large (very large) media corporations, about six of them in all and all with vested interests. Some in the US particularly, are also substantially funded by the CIA and other Government institutions, as recent reports have high-lighted. This you seem to discount as having no influence on their reporting bias, it only happens in Russia.

The BBC is also a 100% Government funded TV News channel and is also considered as biased.

I personally find very little propaganda in the news covered by RT and their reports very rarely make any anti-American comments or accusation, unlike many Western news outlets do with regard to Russia as is obvious from the pantomime currently filling the news at the present time, in the US.

If you want an example of a news report and a 'loaded' news report, just look at the two links I posted.

RT ..... straight forward reporting ..... no mention of finding US made weapons for instance or references to how the US assisted the ISIS with their retake of the area a few weeks ago. Nothing biased or added to enhance or distort the story. Just a simple factual report of events in Palmyra and, on the TV Channel, from a female reporter on the ground with the Government forces!

The Guardian ...... the report of facts is very much the same but then comes the subtle additions, each a minor point but together clearly intended to make the reader see the event in a slightly distorted way by adding things that are not really a part of the main story. This is a common practice of many MSM outlets.

1) Under the photo .... reference to” The Regime” ..... not Government Forces?
2)”(Palmyra) ...... fell for the second time this year” .... how incompetent of them ?
3) "Led by Iranian-backed militias "....... were they? (It’s those Iranians again .... bloody troublemakers!)
4) "Nearly three months after ISIS took it over "........... how incompetent of the Syrian forces ?
5) “Moscow’s elite military units had been on the ground when Palmyra was recaptured from Isis for the first time last March and were again present over the past month”. ..... were they?
6) “(ISIS) .... was taking advantage of the campaign by the Syrian president, Bashar al-Assad, to retake opposition-held eastern Aleppo” ............. not terrorist held of course, the rebels are the good guys ?
7) “..... overrunning Syrian government troops in less than a day”...... obviously not very good are they, they must rely heavily on the Russians?
8 ) .......... "A loose alliance of Turkish, Russian and US forces are yet to determine the force that will attack Raqqa” ..... so, not a coalition then, just a loose alliance?

Naive .... ME? Never! I may be trusting and take others as I find them and I will admit to that but, being naive and gullible, is not one of my weaknesses.

Russia is not a dictatorship (more dogma), Putin is elected I believe directly by the people(?) just like the US elected their President and he does not ‘Rule’ by signing Presidential Orders and by-passing the elected members of their Duma, as Trump and Obama does/did. Putin has a popularity rating from his own people of over 80% ........ what was Obama’s/Hollande’s/Merkel’s even Teresa’s ? So you are expressing your opinion as a fact .... which it is not, if you bother to check.

You are right, propaganda is very subtle, as you can see from the above. The naivety is with those that rely exclusively on the Western MSM who are daily being exposed as the source of most of the false and fake news stories, but then also demonstrate an aversion to any sources that come from the ‘other side’ that would likely have an opposite view.

“Dogma and confirmation bias.” ? You don’t think that applies to your views then? You seem pretty easily convinced of almost anything simply determined by the source ........ you never require confirmation or some credible evidence. (Simply as an example of your own ‘confirmation bias’: Remember MH17 ? ..... Kerry said that he had evidence it involved the Russian’s, within hours of the event ....... your very first comment was something on the lines of “That seems pretty conclusive!”. We never have seen his evidence .... but it was enough ‘confirmation’ to make your mind up ‘conclusively’!)

[Get Real!]

It looks like you’re on your own now RH. Paphitis, has sent me a PM confirming his departure.

So I guess you can cut down on the hair splitting now…

[Robin Hood]

It looks like you’re on your own now RH. Paphitis, has sent me a PM confirming his departure.

So I guess you can cut down on the hair splitting now…

A bit childish of him but if that's what he wants so be it! I've mostly been on my own ........... the majority of people seem happy to accept what they want to hear ............. I follow RT's advice 'QUESTION MORE'.

An after thought ......

A Cherokee Indian chief was teaching his grandson about life...

"A fight is going on inside me," he said to the boy. "It is a terrible fight and it is between two wolves.

"One is evil - he is anger, envy, sorrow, regret, greed, arrogance, self-pity, guilt, resentment, inferiority, lies, false pride, superiority, self-doubt, and ego.

"The other is good - he is joy, peace, love, hope, serenity, humility, kindness, benevolence, empathy, generosity, truth, compassion, and faith.

"This same fight is going on inside you - and inside every other person, too."

The grandson thought about it for a minute and then asked his grandfather, "Which wolf will win?"

The old chief replied," The one you feed."

[Londonrake]

RH:

Well, a little cherry picked but then we all do that I suppose. I don't like to spend my life on here picking apart posts sentence-by-sentence but that of course is what you have always enjoyed doing.

So, I will do a bit of my own cherry picking on the points I am trying to establish. Not for your benefit of course, rather for anybody of objective mind that happens to be reading this thread.

Much of what I said was in essence supportive. Who would not be pleased at the taking of Palmyra? Or any such place? Well, ISIS I suppose

I'm certainly not going to get into an in-depth debate about the Syrian morass. And let there be no mistake, it's not because of anybody on here telling me to "In future think twice before starting a lame thread.................". or "I think you're finished in here" Rather because I believe the subject is a bottomless pit of intransigence. Thinking about it, like most of our "discussions" actually.

I have not said that everything, or in fact have pointed to any specific thing, that RT reports which is biased or propagandistic - at all. The essence of effective dissemination of a "message" though is the perceived reliability of the messenger. However, the underlying facts are clear and straightforward. RT is not a free-thinking outfit. You may argue differently (and of course you do!) but Vladimir Putin is not a democratic leader, as viewed by Western standards. He holds singular power over all aspects of the State in Russia. So, no, RT is not what you are promoting it as. When it openly criticises Putin - in the same way we see unveiled criticism of Trump/May/Merkel, et al, all the time, then perhaps you might have a reasonable point. The idea itself though is absurd. That not for his manificence but because in Russia you simply don't openly criticise the man - in the media anyway. Not without consequences.

All dictators tend to be immensely popular. Hitler, Mussolini, Franco were elevated to power by high popular votes, maintaining it throughout the peaceful parts of their national leadership They all had parliamentary organisations supposedly to answer to which, like the Duma, were actually nothing more than rubber stamps. Nowadays Kim Jong-un and Bashir Assad both lay claim to being democrats, pointing to popular votes in support. They are plain and simply tyrants though.

Whilst the BBC is State funded of course the idea that it's a government mouthpiece is risible. Does anybody believe that Theresa May has the same hold over the Beeb as Putin over his media outlets? You have only to look at what's going on in the US between Trump and elements of the media to see what a free press means. The idea of such a situation in Russia is beyond fantasy.

I apologise for using the term "naivety". That of course infers a certain innocence which is inappropriate.

Yes - you are dogmatic and invariably pursue confirmation bias. I have shown in a previous thread what the likes of Blacklisted News disseminates (freely and without hindrance from its US base). It's entirely packed with articles written by people with an anti-West axe to grind. That and others similar are the wells from which your views flow. Am I dogmatic? Clearly, you believe so. I do weight things up though and not from a single source. You seem to have this inherent belief that absolutely nothing is true unless you have to dig deep to find the "real" story. You know those places to go in order to authenticate your ready made views. It really is X Files stuff.

As far as MH 17 goes. You really, really don't want me to go there, I'm sure. Plus of course - didn't you get the memo?

I see your charming little friend has turned up. FWIW, it seemed to me that Paphitis became somewhat disillusioned over the past few weeks. He kept referring to various posts in that tone anyway. It would be a great pity, after so long and so many posts if that's the way it goes. I would think I wouldn't be the only one to miss his input and not just because you appear to keep wanting to present us as engaged. I imagine though that you will just clock it as another one "shot down". Like the others.

What I'm going to do now is bail out of this thread. Not because of anything put up against me, now or in the future but simply that it isn't one I'd planned to enter. Of course your reference to RT and the Guardian was a pretty unmistakable invitation. Despite your efforts to drag the thread into that conflagration the media aspect has been what my posts here were about.

I hope Paphitis changes his mind after a bit of a break. I have seen a few good men dispatched by your efforts and not because of the merit and weight of your views. More a case of bloody-minded bludgeoning. He seems to contribute to a wide variety of subjects on the Forum and I'm sure would be greatly missed by some. Nil illegitimi carborundum mate!

[Londonrake]

"Expert says Islamic State has badly damaged major Palmyra monument"

http://cyprus-mail.com/2017/03/05/exper ... -monument/

.

[Robin Hood]

"Expert says Islamic State has badly damaged major Palmyra monument"

http://cyprus-mail.com/2017/03/05/exper ... -monument/

.

LondonRake

What I'm going to do now is bail out of this thread.

Blimey! That was a short lived bail out! Must have been a HALO bail out?

This drone footage was taken by RT/Ruptly just hours after the Syrian Army drove ISIS out of the site. Mind you ..... I don’t really have a clue what it looked like before but some of the damage in the amphitheatre looks fresh.

https://ruptly.tv/vod/20170303-032

Some Syria related videos with Eva Bartlett a free lance Canadian Journalist and fairly frequent visitor to Syria particularly to Aleppo before and after the Eastern area was liberated .... a few home truths from on the ground.

Eva Bartlett ........ video of presentation at the UN

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TjHniRRgOao

This is a ‘must watch’ quite entertaining .......... this Muslim guy is based in Bedford, that’s nearly as far from Syria as Australia.
[url]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3JFEmCKHVME[/url]

She politely puts down a Norwegian journalist ....... from Jimmy Dore Show ......... I think he posts on here!
[url]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z9F-cHc5Qog[/url]