The Best Cyprus Community

Skip to content


Le Pen In Cyprus

Benefits and problems from the EU membership.

Postby Black Cat » Sat Nov 05, 2005 4:18 pm

Thanks:) Yes he is a racist aswell i agree..
About the translation, yes sure.
Black Cat
New Member
New Member
 
Posts: 24
Joined: Fri Nov 04, 2005 6:05 pm
Location: planet earth

Postby Sotos » Sat Nov 05, 2005 9:23 pm

No Border No State

No Border I understand. But No State?? If we don't have a state then what will we have? Anarchy?
User avatar
Sotos
Leading Contributor
Leading Contributor
 
Posts: 10703
Joined: Wed Aug 17, 2005 2:50 am

Postby BirKibrisli » Sun Nov 06, 2005 3:07 am

Sotos wrote:
No Border No State

No Border I understand. But No State?? If we don't have a state then what will we have? Anarchy?


Perhaps it should be No Border One Nation,Sotos.
But it is Black Cat's signature after all,he can have what he wants.
User avatar
BirKibrisli
Main Contributor
Main Contributor
 
Posts: 6162
Joined: Tue Aug 16, 2005 4:28 pm
Location: Australia

Postby Black Cat » Sun Nov 06, 2005 3:50 am

Yes anarchy.
Black Cat
New Member
New Member
 
Posts: 24
Joined: Fri Nov 04, 2005 6:05 pm
Location: planet earth

Postby BirKibrisli » Sun Nov 06, 2005 4:01 am

Black Cat wrote:Yes anarchy.


This is a new and interesting concept for Cyprus,Black Cat.
I suspect you would want the same thing for the whole of the EU.
Can you tell us a bit about how it would work in practice?I am asking seriously,not trying to trip you up or anything.Convince us that it can work,if you are serious that is.
User avatar
BirKibrisli
Main Contributor
Main Contributor
 
Posts: 6162
Joined: Tue Aug 16, 2005 4:28 pm
Location: Australia

Postby Piratis » Sun Nov 06, 2005 5:48 am

Anarchy means no laws. If there are no laws nothing can be illegal. Therefore the occupation would not be illegal, even the occupation of the whole Cyprus. Anarchy would mean that the powerful would do the 100% of what they want without even having to give an excuse.

Democracy as we know it is far from perfect but its the best we can have. What we should do is to try to make our democracy better.
User avatar
Piratis
Moderator
Moderator
 
Posts: 12261
Joined: Tue Mar 09, 2004 11:08 pm

Postby Black Cat » Sun Nov 06, 2005 7:13 pm

Im really not good at opening discussions like this in english because i speak mostly greek, because of where i live but..
Anarchism is the world without authority, without laws and is against any kind of racism and use of power against humanity. Most important morality of it is to do to others what you would like him/her to do to you under the same circumstances. Anarchists are against goverments, that have been made to protect the rich and capitalists using laws, violence and propaganda. We seek for a free society because freedom is one of the most important good that a human can have. We seek for a society where every community decides what is right, together, helping each other, creating collectives etc. We want the the communities to own the means of production so they can use it for themselves and for everyone and not for the "masters". We dont believe in borders and states because we believe in the unity of all people. Borders where created over the centuries from the ones who governed so they could mark "their" property and "their" dominance. Our state is earth because all people live on it. Our history, is the history of every culture because we believe everyone is equal and we like taking the positive parts from everyone. Goverments divide people so they cant revolt against them and use national unity for their wars and make people believe we have national enemies. We are against these wars and we stand up for class war. We want to abolish every kind of hierarchy and social discrimination.
Every person should be his own goverment.
To change this system though, a revolution is nessesery..
Black Cat
New Member
New Member
 
Posts: 24
Joined: Fri Nov 04, 2005 6:05 pm
Location: planet earth

Postby bg_turk » Mon Nov 07, 2005 1:58 am

Black Cat wrote:Im really not good at opening discussions like this in english because i speak mostly greek, because of where i live but..

I think your english is perfect.

Anarchism is the world without authority, without laws and is against any kind of racism and use of power against humanity. Most important morality of it is to do to others what you would like him/her to do to you under the same circumstances. Anarchists are against goverments, that have been made to protect the rich and capitalists using laws, violence and propaganda. We seek for a free society because freedom is one of the most important good that a human can have. We seek for a society where every community decides what is right, together, helping each other, creating collectives etc. We want the the communities to own the means of production so they can use it for themselves and for everyone and not for the "masters". We dont believe in borders and states because we believe in the unity of all people. Borders where created over the centuries from the ones who governed so they could mark "their" property and "their" dominance. Our state is earth because all people live on it. Our history, is the history of every culture because we believe everyone is equal and we like taking the positive parts from everyone. Goverments divide people so they cant revolt against them and use national unity for their wars and make people believe we have national enemies. We are against these wars and we stand up for class war. We want to abolish every kind of hierarchy and social discrimination.
Every person should be his own goverment.
To change this system though, a revolution is nessesery..


I certainly agree with most of the things you said. Yet, I think these ideas about a functional anarchist system will remain an utopia. They will fail because they do not take into account fundamental human nature - human being are gready, jealous and egoistic. Human beings are still animals - they tend to flock together like sheep and follow their animalistic instict of following the herd - even if they know what they do is not right. If everybody behaved as they expected others to behave, everything would be fine, but I do not think it will happen. You need some mechanism to punish those that break the law, which of course means giving power to some central authority. But can we avoid giving too much power to one central authoirties? Power can be abused and it corrupts even the most diahard idealists and yet without a central authority I do not think societies can be regulated - at least in their current form.
If we could slowly evolve toward your ideal anarchy state I think we may come close to what you propose, but certainly a revolution would not be helpful - revolutions simply change one regime with another. Trying to achieve peace using violance is like fucking for virginity.
User avatar
bg_turk
Regular Contributor
Regular Contributor
 
Posts: 1172
Joined: Sun Jul 24, 2005 11:24 pm
Location: Bulgaria

Postby BirKibrisli » Mon Nov 07, 2005 2:56 am

Black Cat,
Like bg_turk i agree with your premises,but if human beings cannot live peacefully together withour exploting each other in a lawful state,how would they be if there were no laws and no state.Are we to go back to the survival of the fittest?Jungle law?
I am glad though that there is at least one person more "utopian" than myself in this forum.And you don't have to worry about your English,mate.You are doing fine.Keep trying to convince us,the way things are going in Cyprus,any alternative will be better than the status qou pretty soon. The problem is,who will organise the revolution if anarchy rules? :D
User avatar
BirKibrisli
Main Contributor
Main Contributor
 
Posts: 6162
Joined: Tue Aug 16, 2005 4:28 pm
Location: Australia

Postby zan » Tue Nov 08, 2005 1:57 am

Birkibrisli wrote:Black Cat,
Like bg_turk i agree with your premises,but if human beings cannot live peacefully together withour exploting each other in a lawful state,how would they be if there were no laws and no state.Are we to go back to the survival of the fittest?Jungle law?
I am glad though that there is at least one person more "utopian" than myself in this forum.And you don't have to worry about your English,mate.You are doing fine.Keep trying to convince us,the way things are going in Cyprus,any alternative will be better than the status qou pretty soon. The problem is,who will organise the revolution if anarchy rules? :D


Well thought out mate. :idea:

Anarchy is indeed a return to a primeval state in which survival of the strongest is the determining factor of evolution. It is, however the fact, that generally we as human beings look after the frail and develop ways to enable them to function. We treat diseases and mend broken bones and push the frontiers of medicines to look after our people and our pets. Not all is doom and gloom. I too would love a world in which there were no army or police or government but, everything from the atom to the entire universe has structure.
User avatar
zan
Leading Contributor
Leading Contributor
 
Posts: 16213
Joined: Wed Nov 02, 2005 8:55 pm

PreviousNext

Return to Cyprus and the European Union

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 0 guests