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Microsoft Has Failed

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Re: Microsoft Has Failed

Postby Sotos » Wed Nov 28, 2012 9:30 am

Demonax wrote:
Sotos wrote:iPhone doesn't have "higher sales" than Windows or Office.

It’s revenues we are talking about here, Sotos. Today, the iPhone brings in more revenue than the entirety of Microsoft. More than Windows, Office, Xbox, Bing, Windows Phone, and every other product that Microsoft has created since 1975. In the quarter ended March 31, 2012, iPhone had sales of $22.7 billion; Microsoft Corporation, $17.4 billion.

In fact, Apple made more money than Microsoft, eBay, Google, Yahoo!, Facebook, and Amazon combined! Apple just recently wrapped up its fiscal year 2012 with a record profit of $41.7 billion and $156.5 billion in revenue. In comparison, the six companies mentioned above combined for a total profit of $34.4 billion. Furthermore, Dell, Intel, Acer, ASUS, IBM, HP, and Lenovo — nearly the entire PC industry — profited a total of only $19.4 billion combined. They make this money on a simple principle. Premium prices for premium products. In other words, people know they are getting what they pay for.


Number of sales, revenues and profits are all very different things. You said that iPhone had "higher sales" which is not true. Apple has more profits because you are not getting what you pay for. If you wanted to get what you pay for then the iPhone etc should have been $200 less and Apple would make normal profits like the other companies. So why are you so happy that Apple is overcharging you? If you care more about how much profits Apple makes than the value you actually get from Apple then maybe Apple should sell iPhone 6 to you for $1200 ... then they will have $100 billion profits and you will be even happier for getting ripped even more :lol:

For Microsoft to collapse people need to have an alternative to switch to. Currently there isn't any real competition to Windows so even if a Windows version is a flop most people just skip that version and upgrade with the next one...they don't buy an iMac.


Actually plenty of Microsoft consumers are planning to switch to Apple products. 42 per cent of Windows users in fact:
http://www.businessinsider.com/windows- ... le-2012-11

Microsoft's other problem is for how long they can stick to their model of locking in and screwing companies:

The problem is that if you are locked in with a choice of 100% Microsoft or 0% Microsoft, once someone goes, it isn’t a baby step, they are gone. Once you start using Google Docs and the related suites, you have no need for Office. That means you, or likely your company, saves several hundred dollars a head. No need for Office means no need for Exchange. No need for Exchange means no need for Windows Server. No need for Office means no need for Windows. Once the snowball starts rolling, it picks up speed at a frightening pace. And that is where we are. The barriers to exit are now even more potent barriers to entry.

Office or no Office there is no real alternative to windows. Businesses will switch from windows and buy their employees all-in-one iMacs? :roll: Maybe Linux, Chrome OS or something new can one day replace windows... But not Apple with their current philosophy "Make devices with nice designs and sell them with huge margins"... that will never work with most people.
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Re: Microsoft Has Failed

Postby cyprusgrump » Wed Nov 28, 2012 10:15 am

Apple's revenues are only of interest to Apple shareholders - I'm not sure why Demonax thinks it is such a big story...

If Apple was in profit while Microsoft was making a loss then THAT would be a story - but it clearly isn't.

Apple needs high margins in order to keep innovating and make the fan boys happy. But it is difficult to see where they go from here - they need another 'killer' product.

Chinese companies already make Aplle-like tablets for less than half the price of an iPad (and devices with Retina screens are available for ~€250). Some Smart phones perform better than iPhones...

Microsoft has a monopoly of the desktop market and there is a huge growth in sales of Android devices...

If Demonax is a share=holder he'd better hope that the Steve Jobs left a list of good ideas on his desk.... :wink:
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Re: Microsoft Has Failed

Postby Me Ed » Wed Nov 28, 2012 11:14 am

Don't forget that every PC/Laptop sold comes with Windows pre-installed and all the recovery media shipped with these machines re-install Windows.

In the UK, all new machines are now shipped with Windows 8 and perhaps this is what Microsoft is banking on.

However, I too am skeptical about installing an OS that looks that its been designed for mobile devices on a desktop computer, because if this is conceptually adopted, this may backfire on Microsoft as manufacturers may provide an ultra-cheap desktop/laptop with Android installed.
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Re: Microsoft Has Failed

Postby Demonax » Wed Nov 28, 2012 3:53 pm

Sotos wrote:Apple has more profits because you are not getting what you pay for. If you wanted to get what you pay for then the iPhone etc should have been $200 less and Apple would make normal profits like the other companies.

In the smartphone sector Apple does not compete on price, it competes on quality. It sells to those who appreciate a premium product, and who are willing to pay a premium for it. It's left the space open for competitors at the cheaper end to compete on price and none of them are making any money - except Samsung.

If things change, Apple has the capacity to lower its prices and give up its huge margins. Right now, Apple are prepared to squeeze the competition and it's a strategy that is working. Look at what's happened to RIM and Nokia...

Office or no Office there is no real alternative to windows. Businesses will switch from windows and buy their employees all-in-one iMacs? Maybe Linux, Chrome OS or something new can one day replace windows... But not Apple with their current philosophy "Make devices with nice designs and sell them with huge margins"... that will never work with most people.

The enterprise is changing at a rapid rate, and more companies than ever are looking toward the cloud to operate their businesses. When that happens, they enter Google's domain. And if they don't require all the power that Office offers, why should they pay for Microsoft's service when they can get access to Google Docs for free? It's a question that Microsoft will need to answer.

Office is expensive. For years, that hasn't mattered, since it was the only viable productivity suite on the market. But today, there are several free alternatives that can deliver a worthwhile experience. How Microsoft plans to compete with free is anyone's guess...
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Re: Microsoft Has Failed

Postby cyprusgrump » Wed Nov 28, 2012 4:15 pm

Demonax wrote:Office is expensive. For years, that hasn't mattered, since it was the only viable productivity suite on the market. But today, there are several free alternatives that can deliver a worthwhile experience. How Microsoft plans to compete with free is anyone's guess...


Lucky for Microsoft that Office didn't have to complete with Open Office since 2002 eh? That would have killed their business for sure... :roll:
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Re: Microsoft Has Failed

Postby Demonax » Wed Nov 28, 2012 4:38 pm

cyprusgrump wrote:
Lucky for Microsoft that Office didn't have to complete with Open Office since 2002 eh? That would have killed their business for sure... :roll:

It's a good thing you're not running Microsoft! Google are a different proposition. They are very good at providing faster and simpler interfaces. And they have a real strength in online collaboration and search.

Google has an edge in some areas already, so if they improve further to make Google Docs more powerful and easy-to-use, this may help them gain a large share of the market.

And this threat to the dominance of Office is a serious threat to Microsoft's profits. They face some immediate risks from the growth of the tablet market and longer-term threats from the potential growth of Google. They will likely lose a significant portion of the consumer market to Google Docs, since many people will be satisfied with Google's free offerings, and will not see the need to pay for Office.

In addition, many consumers already use Gmail, which integrates well with Google Docs. This familiarity of ordinary users with Docs may then cause businesses to also begin using the Google business suite (Google Apps). This growth could then cause a large loss of revenue for Microsoft.

If you think Microsoft are not taking this threat from Google seriously, then you are a bit deluded.
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Re: Microsoft Has Failed

Postby Get Real! » Wed Nov 28, 2012 4:53 pm

Demonax wrote:And if they don't require all the power that Office offers, why should they pay for Microsoft's service when they can get access to Google Docs for free? It's a question that Microsoft will need to answer.

The only computer users who would use software on a server instead of their own are Nigerians at an Internet cafe! Everyone else has a laptop they can carry with them and use their own software! :lol:

Office is expensive. For years, that hasn't mattered, since it was the only viable productivity suite on the market. But today, there are several free alternatives that can deliver a worthwhile experience. How Microsoft plans to compete with free is anyone's guess...

What Ms can do is very simple... drop their price for Office and end up with even more customers! :)
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Re: Microsoft Has Failed

Postby Get Real! » Wed Nov 28, 2012 4:57 pm

cyprusgrump wrote:
Demonax wrote:Office is expensive. For years, that hasn't mattered, since it was the only viable productivity suite on the market. But today, there are several free alternatives that can deliver a worthwhile experience. How Microsoft plans to compete with free is anyone's guess...

Lucky for Microsoft that Office didn't have to complete with Open Office since 2002 eh? That would have killed their business for sure... :roll:

These Apple gays just don't get it... Ms Office is so embedded in the global industry that only a God can shake it! :lol:
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Re: Microsoft Has Failed

Postby cyprusgrump » Wed Nov 28, 2012 5:07 pm

Demonax wrote:
cyprusgrump wrote:
Lucky for Microsoft that Office didn't have to complete with Open Office since 2002 eh? That would have killed their business for sure... :roll:

It's a good thing you're not running Microsoft! Google are a different proposition. They are very good at providing faster and simpler interfaces. And they have a real strength in online collaboration and search.

Google has an edge in some areas already, so if they improve further to make Google Docs more powerful and easy-to-use, this may help them gain a large share of the market.

And this threat to the dominance of Office is a serious threat to Microsoft's profits. They face some immediate risks from the growth of the tablet market and longer-term threats from the potential growth of Google. They will likely lose a significant portion of the consumer market to Google Docs, since many people will be satisfied with Google's free offerings, and will not see the need to pay for Office.

In addition, many consumers already use Gmail, which integrates well with Google Docs. This familiarity of ordinary users with Docs may then cause businesses to also begin using the Google business suite (Google Apps). This growth could then cause a large loss of revenue for Microsoft.

If you think Microsoft are not taking this threat from Google seriously, then you are a bit deluded.


Demonax wrote:Office is expensive. For years, that hasn't mattered, since it was the only viable productivity suite on the market. But today, there are several free alternatives that can deliver a worthwhile experience. How Microsoft plans to compete with free is anyone's guess...


As I suggested above - Microsoft has been competing with 'free' for years...
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Re: Microsoft Has Failed

Postby Get Real! » Wed Nov 28, 2012 5:16 pm

Admin should rename this thread to... “Here’s hoping that Microsoft Has Failed” :roll:
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