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Why 40,000 Turkish Soldiers in Cyprus???

Benefits and problems from the EU membership.

Postby Kikapu » Thu Jun 15, 2006 9:40 am

stuballstu wrote:
Kikapu wrote

Once Turkey leaves Cyprus, and wants to return again for what ever reason, eg. civil unrest, or worse, another civil war, then the RoC would, as a member of EU, would claim to be attacked by Turkey, which the EU block would have no choice but to go against Turkey militarilly. "Attack one Attack all" is the EU's motto. So, don't expect Turkey to leave any time soon, if ever.


Kikapu

The EU dont have such a motto, in fact the EU does not even have an army. You will find if such a thing was to happen in theory (attack by Turkey) it would be up to the UN and NATO to deal with it. Sanctions is probably the most likely thing by the EU that would happen in this situation.


It's true that EU does not have an army ( not yet ), but each member states have plenty fire power. So, do you think, fellow members would stand by and watch one of their fellow state member be attacked, and do nothing other than complain to the UN for resolutions. Turkey invaded Cyprus in 1974 and many UN resolutions were passed, but I don't see any NATO actions against them, so I can't imagine there would be one in the future, if the same event re-occured. Perhaps I'm wrong.?
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Duty or Right ?

Postby CopperLine » Mon Mar 05, 2007 10:08 am

It depends on how Turkish military presence on the island is justified.

If the Turkish authorities justify the military presence as fulfilling a duty to protect - as derived from the 1959 agreement, the 1960 constitution, the treaty of guarantee - then so long as Turkey sees a threat to the TC community they will retain the military presence.

If, in contrast, Turkish authorities justify the military presence as exercising a right to Turkish nationhood, and forcibly exercising that right by bringing Turkish Cypriots into the Turkish 'national' fold then the Turkish military presence will be permanent.

The first justification is defensible - though we might not like it - in international law, even as it applied in the 1960s and 1970s, including 1974. As international law has developed in the 1990s to the present, one would have to conclude that had the Turkish 'intervention'/'invasion' happened today then it would have been a legitimate response. See Bosnian wars, West Africa, and others. On this count, reducing or removing the perceived threat to Turkish Cypriots would allow the possibility for the withdrawal of Turkish troops. Even a slow and gradual force reduction could be contemplated.

Again, by contrast, if Turkey is claiming a national right, then the military presence will be permanent. Since a right, by its very nature, cannot be taken from the holder or given away by the holder it means that Turkey will not give up on its TC national community. In my view this second position is not defensible in international law, and is akin to an occupation.

It is clear that the there are those in Turkey, and a few in Cyprus, whose basic position is the second one. These are usually nationalists, new style republicans and, of course, many in the military.

The first position allows for TCs amongst us to feel protected until we believe it safe. The second position means that TCs will never be allowed, by Turkish nationalists, to be Cypriots. Either way the fate of TCs and all Cypriots remains firmly in some one else's hands.


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Postby humanist » Mon Mar 05, 2007 11:14 am

The question is .... Why 40,000 Turkish Soldiers in Cyprus??? Because they can. Because Turkey is a bully, cares about noone in cyprus not even the same people she is saying she protecting. Because the International Community does not have integrity to say to Turkey "Turkey You Have been found guilty of human rights violations of the cypriot people and to this end you need to get your troops out, we will provide for the safety of the turksih Speaking Cypriots and such tim the Island is Unified. If you do not withdraw your troops in a friendly peaceful manner we will impose an international embargo such as the one that existed in South Africa til the apartheid ended.
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Postby zan » Mon Mar 05, 2007 5:25 pm

humanist wrote:The question is .... Why 40,000 Turkish Soldiers in Cyprus??? Because they can. Because Turkey is a bully, cares about noone in cyprus not even the same people she is saying she protecting. Because the International Community does not have integrity to say to Turkey "Turkey You Have been found guilty of human rights violations of the cypriot people and to this end you need to get your troops out, we will provide for the safety of the turksih Speaking Cypriots and such tim the Island is Unified. If you do not withdraw your troops in a friendly peaceful manner we will impose an international embargo such as the one that existed in South Africa til the apartheid ended.



They have said all of that Humanist. The RoC has done all it can to put an illegal label on the TCs but deep down inside the world knows that there is a world of right on the TRNCs side. Could that be a reason???
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Postby free_cyprus » Mon Mar 05, 2007 6:31 pm

can anyone tell me why cyprus has the biggest millitary per head then anywhere else in the world they is estimated 100 000 or more militery personal on cyprus soil why when we have a population of less then one million thats one soldiar for ever ten people on the island of cyprus ..................in comparison britain combined forces are just over 200 000 to a population ratio of 65 million people .........................dont look at one point in the cyprus problem look at the whole picture ......................thats why it makes me so mad when o hear alot is shit being talked and pointed out in this forum
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Postby humanist » Wed Mar 07, 2007 7:47 am

NO Zan, otherwise the world would have recognised the trnc. I do not think the RoC wants to put an illegal label on tc's but the illegal occupation of the north of the Island by turkey called the trnc.

frankly my dear i couldn't give a damn who lives next door to me, what they eat drink wear of worship, so long they are respectful in the way they do it and accept that i may be the same or different or somewhere in between. :) good try though, need a bit more p[ractice my friend get t it. :)

then again i can only speak for myself.
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Postby zan » Wed Mar 07, 2007 10:43 am

humanist wrote:NO Zan, otherwise the world would have recognised the trnc. I do not think the RoC wants to put an illegal label on tc's but the illegal occupation of the north of the Island by turkey called the trnc.

frankly my dear i couldn't give a damn who lives next door to me, what they eat drink wear of worship, so long they are respectful in the way they do it and accept that i may be the same or different or somewhere in between. :) good try though, need a bit more p[ractice my friend get t it. :)

then again i can only speak for myself.



Still twisting Humanist? The situation of today has a series of events before it. Why is it that you too have chosen to ignore the realities of what happened to bring us to that point and only go on what the Greeks have managed to achieve through the courts. I do blame the Turks though for allowing it to happen. Their inactivity in the past is inexcusable. We have more right on our side than you think and now those idiots in government have an up hill struggle to show the world what really happened and to dispel the Greek propaganda that has been circulating for decades. It has taken years for those of us on the net to persuade some of you to give even an inch as to your part in this mess but time and time again you conveniently forget those discussions in your urgent quest for the so called return of land. We as TCs have lost a lot in these troubles but it seems many GCs are still hell bent on getting what ever they lost at the expense of us. Sorry but there are two sides in this conflict and I clearly do not belong with the GCs and am forced to fight my corner. Your argument about what he world thinks and has passed judgement on needs a rethink because it does not tell the whole story and the unofficial slant. If that slant did not exist then there would not be a single country that would be even thinking about lifting the embargoes let alone the EU or the US.
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