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THE ALEVI OF ANATOLIA

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Re: THE ALEVI OF ANATOLIA

Postby Demonax » Mon Aug 19, 2013 3:58 am

kimon07 wrote:Am 100% sure the Alevi issue will become the new "kurdish issue" of Turkey. Regardless of what the Turks say, the Alevis consider themselves to be not only a religious but also and ethnic minority and it seems that they intend to press for the recognition of this status and of their rights.

P.S. If the Alevis are as much Turkish a any other Turk in Turkey, why are they being murdered and harassed and persecuted by the Turkish state and the other Turks?


Alevis are seen as religious heretics. Their faith is not recognised nor are their places of worship. Alevis lose their jobs, symbols are painted on their doors and they are attacked in the street.

Erdogan’s project is to consolidate the social and political dominance of Sunnism in Turkey. His support for Syria’s Sunni rebels is further widening the gulf between him and the Alevi minority. A lot of Alevis live in the cities that border Syria and they have a kinship with the people.

The Alevis were heavily involved in the Gezi Park Protests. This issue is not going away...
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Re: THE ALEVI OF ANATOLIA

Postby repulsewarrior » Mon Aug 19, 2013 5:27 am

i would like to learn more about Ataturk...

...and i do believe the Alevi will express themselves more forcefully against the forces which deny this Identity.

...where is the Greek Minority, in that long list Turkey recognises, are there no Greeks in Turkey?

interesting thread.
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Re: THE ALEVI OF ANATOLIA

Postby stpier » Mon Aug 19, 2013 9:08 am

kimon07 wrote: Regardless of what the Turks say, the Alevis consider themselves to be not only a religious but also and ethnic minority and it seems that they intend to press for the recognition of this status and of their rights.



How many times have you been to Central Anatolia and how many Alewites have you met in person? First time I've heard that Alewites consider themselves as an ethnic minority. Show us proof.

Leader of the main opposition party, Ataturk's party CHP, is Alewite and this party is supported by millions of Turkish Sunnis and Alewites. He's a proud Turk. You've hit an all time low by your genious lies.
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Re: THE ALEVI OF ANATOLIA

Postby kimon07 » Mon Aug 19, 2013 10:30 am

stpier wrote:
kimon07 wrote: Regardless of what the Turks say, the Alevis consider themselves to be not only a religious but also and ethnic minority and it seems that they intend to press for the recognition of this status and of their rights.

How many times have you been to Central Anatolia and how many Alewites have you met in person? First time I've heard that Alewites consider themselves as an ethnic minority. Show us proof.


You are so ignorant you can not distinguish between Alevi and Alewites who are Arabs. As for proof, I think the sources I linked you to in my first post are more than enough.
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Re: THE ALEVI OF ANATOLIA

Postby kimon07 » Mon Aug 19, 2013 10:47 am

kimon07 wrote:
stpier wrote:
kimon07 wrote: Regardless of what the Turks say, the Alevis consider themselves to be not only a religious but also and ethnic minority and it seems that they intend to press for the recognition of this status and of their rights.

How many times have you been to Central Anatolia and how many Alewites have you met in person? First time I've heard that Alewites consider themselves as an ethnic minority. Show us proof.


You are so ignorant you can not distinguish between Alevi and Alewites who are Arabs. As for proof, I think the sources I linked you to in my first post are more than enough.



Alawites
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The Alawites, also known as Alawis (ʿAlawīyyah Arabic: علوية‎) are a prominent mystical religious group centred in Syria who follow a branch of the Twelver school of Shia Islam……... Today, Alawites represent 12% of the Syrian population and are a significant minority in Turkey and northern Lebanon. There is also a population living in the village of Ghajar in the disputed Golan Heights.

They are often confused with the Alevis of Turkey, another Shia sect.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alawites
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Re: THE ALEVI OF ANATOLIA

Postby Tim Drayton » Mon Aug 19, 2013 10:59 am

Things are not as cut and dry as you think. If you speak to Turkish Alevis, they will tell you that the people known in English as 'Alawites' are also Alevis just like them, and even wonder why you are asking.
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Re: THE ALEVI OF ANATOLIA

Postby stpier » Mon Aug 19, 2013 11:00 am

There is no such word as Alevi in English. Just go to google translate and search for Alewite and look for the Turkish translation. :D Dumb Rum.

Now back to my unanswered question: How many times have you been to Central Anatolia and how many Alewites have you met in person? Show us proof that they consider themselves as a separate ethnic group :!:
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Re: THE ALEVI OF ANATOLIA

Postby kimon07 » Mon Aug 19, 2013 11:14 am

repulsewarrior wrote:i would like to learn more about Ataturk...


Are you sure? Well, if you insist!

Mustafa 1.png


1. “The Burial of Atatürk”
Atatürk’s Jewish Family Background
August 13, 2012

Mustafa Kemal Atatürk (pronounced [musˈtäfä ceˈmäl ätäˈtyɾc]; 19 May 1881 (Conventional) – 10 November 1938) was an Ottoman and Turkish army officer, revolutionary statesman, writer, and the first President of Turkey. He is credited with being the founder of the Republic of Turkey. His surname, Atatürk (meaning “Father of the Turks”), was granted to him (and forbidden to any other person) in 1934 by the Turkish parliament.
Modern Turkey and its Jewish Founders
_________________________________
Subject: This is from a Jewish publication exploring the truth about Mustafa Kemal and the current (Kemalist) regime in Turkey. The secret Jews, called Doenmeh, took over the power after the fall of Ottoman rule and they exerted control over the people of Turkey from that time on. The below article clarifies many things.
Source: Kulanu quarterly newsletter, Summer 1999, Volume 6 Number 2
(Kulanu is an organization which reflects the community of interests of individuals of varied backgrounds and religious practices dedicated to finding and assisting lost and dispersed remnants of the Jewish people)

The Turkish – Israeli Connection and Its Jewish History.

By Joseph Hantman
http://turkishwrestling.wordpress.com/t ... f-ataturk/

Mustafa.png


2. TRUTH ABOUT TYRANT DICTATOR MUSTAFA KEMAL ATATURK
http://antikemalist.blogspot.gr/

3. Who Was Jewish Dictator Mustafa Kemal And What Was His Mission?

4. Jewish Dictator Mustafa Kemal Was GAYhttp://www.atajew.com/2000/06/gay.html

5. When a Jewish Dictator rules in Muslim Turkey!

Ataturk confesses his Jewishness
Do you know that "Mustafa Kemal Ataturk ", the dictator and the so-called founder of "Republic of Turkey", was jewish?

To this date, there is extreme confusion among Muslims and non-Muslims alike regarding who was Mustafa Kemal, the dictator of Turkey. Recently, new evidence has surfaced that Mustafa Kemal, the ruthless dictator of Turkey, was not only a non-muslim, but a secret Jewish descendant of the Jewish Sabbati Zevi! The evidence comes not from tracing his genaology, but from the statements he himself made. Check out the following:
________________________________________
Source: FORWARD, A Jewish Newspaper published in New York, January 28, 1994
________________________________________

When Ataturk RecitedShema Yisrael
"It's My Secret Prayer, Too," He Confessed
By Hillel Halkin
From: Forward | January 28, 1994 | Author: Hillel Halkin
http://www.radioislam.org/ataturk/jewish.htm
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Re: THE ALEVI OF ANATOLIA

Postby Tim Drayton » Mon Aug 19, 2013 11:19 am

Just to corroborate my above claim, the following quote comes from an interview with Ali Kenanoğlu, head of the Hubyar Sultan Alevi cultural society in Istanbul.

But Aykanat says while there are some religious and cultural differences between Syrian Alawites and their Turkish cousins, they share a common identity.

He says his people are Anatolian Alevis and those in Syria are Arab Alevis. But he says wherever you go in the world, if you use the word Alevi or Alawite, you are connected by a brotherhood.


http://sofiaecho.com/2012/03/16/1789263 ... a-conflict

On the other hand, to show that there are other views:

Are Syrian Alawites and Turkish Alevis the same?

http://globalpublicsquare.blogs.cnn.com ... -the-same/

I would disagree with the assertion that the term 'Alevi' is not used in English. One frequently encounters it in articles about Turkey. In fact, there is a Wikipedia article with 'Alevi' as its title: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alevi
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Re: THE ALEVI OF ANATOLIA

Postby kimon07 » Mon Aug 19, 2013 11:50 am

Tim Drayton wrote:Things are not as cut and dry as you think. If you speak to Turkish Alevis, they will tell you that the people known in English as 'Alawites' are also Alevis just like them, and even wonder why you are asking.



Indeed, SOME people in Turkey will tell you that, as almost all my sources agree. However, according to the same sources below, people confusing Alevis with Alawites are wrong and the relevant belief is the result of ignorance:

Alevi vs. Alawite
Gettleman’s most basic mistake is to overstate the similarities and links between Syria’s “Alawites” and Turkey’s “Alevi” – as they are called in Turkish – community. While the groups are almost eponymous and non-Sunni, they are essentially distinct. According to Soner Cagaptay, senior fellow at the Washington Institute for Near East Policy, the Syrian Alawites are Arabs who practice a religion that is an offshoot of Shia Islam. (They are also known as Nusayris in both Turkish and English.) Alevism, on the other hand, is an Islamic sect rooted in Turkey that is neither Sunni nor Shia. And although some (Alevis and non-Alevis) in Turkey do equate Syrian Alawites with Turkish Alevis as Gettleman suggests, Capaptay states this is a result of ignorance rather than fact: “Alevis are not Alawites, just as Protestants are not protestors.”
http://trackingturkey.wordpress.com/201 ... t-matters/


Who are the Alevis?

'Alevi' is a blanket term for a large number of different heterodox communities, whose actual beliefs and ritual practices differ much. Linguistically four groups may be distinguished. In the eastern province of Kars there are communities speaking Azarbayjani Turkish and whose Alevism differs little from the 'orthodox' Twelver Shi`ism of modern Iran. The Arabic speaking Alevi communities of southern Turkey (especially Hatay and Adana) are the extension of Syria's `Alawi (Nusayri) community and have no historical ties with the other Alevi groups. Like the first group, their numbers are small and their role in Turkey has been negligeable. The important Alevi groups are the Turkish and Kurdish speakers (the latter still to be divided into speakers of Kurdish proper and of related Zaza); both appear to be the descendants of rebellious tribal groups that were religiously affiliated with the Safavids.
http://islam.uga.edu/alevivanb.html

Around eighty percent of the world’s Muslims are Sunnis and another fifteen to twenty percent are Shiites. Other groups, such the Alevis, make up such a relatively small portion of the Muslim faith that many are simply unaware of them. This leads to a fallacy: Many assume that because the Alevis are not Sunnis, they must be Shiites, confusing them with the similarly named Alawites. This myth is common even among some Muslims who assume that the Alawites and Alevis are identical.
Surprisingly, this misconception even exists among the Turkish Alevis. It is not unlikely to meet Alevis who, due to their lack of religious education because of their deep secularization in the twentieth century, assume that Alawite is just another name for Alevi.
http://globalpublicsquare.blogs.cnn.com ... -the-same/


In any case, the subject of this thread is not about whether Alevis and Alawites of Syria are the same but whether the Alevi minority of Turkey will be the next "Kurdish Problem".
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