Cyprus-Forum.com

[Viewpoint]

Ho my god these GC responses have just reconfirmed that you cannot find a solution with extremist facist ignorant people like them, erol you and I are wasting our time...they are just taking the piss and not worth it(British slang). They deserve the current situation.

This proves my point,

Maximus is your name and maximilist is your stance, you have no middle ground, you will get absolutely nowwhere with this attitude, please stay south where you belong.

[erolz66]

..... you still stole it pure and simple.

And you murdered her husband in 1964, pure and simple. Shall we talk about justice and restitution for both these as part of a settlement or do we only deal with your issue and simply forget ours as 'all being in the past' ?

[Maximus]

The problems does not start in 64, with the murder of one women's husband. Actually, Denktash is probably responsible for most TC deaths. innocent people got caught in the crossfire on both sides.

[erolz66]

The problems does not start in 64, with the murder of one women's husband. Actually, Denktash is probably responsible for most TC deaths. innocent people got caught in the crossfire on both sides.

That Yiorjardis (as well as others) the interior minster of a RoC government that claimed to be the legitimate government representing all Cyprus, had set up and ran illegal ethnic based death squad militias of the type that illegally and in broad day light in front of countless witnesses took Aunt's husband from his place of work and murdered him, is without any doubt. So basically your approach is the injustice of GC loosing their property as a result of the events of 74 must be rectified , redressed and compensated for absolutely but the injustice on my Aunt's husband being illegally murdered in cold blood by agents of the RoC government in 64, who have never had to fear prosecution for their illegal acts, should just be forgotten. This is your approach to a 'just settlement' is it ?

[Viewpoint]

erol I understand your family pain and injustice but dont expect extremists fascists animals to have any humanistic inclin or compassion.

[B25]

The problems does not start in 64, with the murder of one women's husband. Actually, Denktash is probably responsible for most TC deaths. innocent people got caught in the crossfire on both sides.

That Yiorjardis (as well as others) the interior minster of a RoC government that claimed to be the legitimate government representing all Cyprus, had set up and ran illegal ethnic based death squad militias of the type that illegally and in broad day light in front of countless witnesses took Aunt's husband from his place of work and murdered him, is without any doubt. So basically your approach is the injustice of GC loosing their property as a result of the events of 74 must be rectified , redressed and compensated for absolutely but the injustice on my Aunt's husband being illegally murdered in cold blood by agents of the RoC government in 64, who have never had to fear prosecution for their illegal acts, should just be forgotten. This is your approach to a 'just settlement' is it ?

Issac and Solomou you prick, show us the justice you served to you illegal criminal officials and fascists. Talk about hypocrisy. The animals are you that have subjected a nation to constant troubles, evicted them from their homes, stole their lands, populated it with shit from Turkey and still have the nerve to complain about one woman's husband.

What about the 1700 missing men and boys you scum bags, I suppose one TC is worth 1700 GCs a?? Hade F U.

[erolz66]

Talk about hypocrisy.

Indeed.

[boulio]

Police will be stationed in each state and there will also be a federal police force,more than enough. talat incident the police chief fired.what ever whith the murders os Isaac and Solomon?how I'm i going to kick the shit out of you?that police can't handle.

Look if you want political equality it has to be everything not pick and choose now answer please.

deal?

The İssac and Soloman incidents although regrettable happened in a war zone where there was mayhem and danger, Talat was just attending a meeting as your guest, totally 2 different things. Think of it this way do you trust TC police? then times that by 10 and you will understand how much we trust GC police.

This is not political equality its manipulating the system to beat the shit out of the other side and place them in great danger. The guarantors should decide whether intervention is necessary not the waring factions, all they can do is ask for help.

I'm sorry vp you don't want to answer the question.Cyprus will be demilitarized ,in the EU,all foreign troops gone and a good police presence in both states and on the federal level.double majorities for Greece,turkey,GB to intervene.Political equality.If the tc demand political equality on ALL MATTERS the gc should demand it on security.

Double majorites on such a life threatening subject only reconfirms what we Tcs have beening saying all you along, your real aim to remove our safety net and wipe out our effective say, any such acceptence would mean the guarantees would in effect become null and void. There has to be an effective alternative this matter cannot be left to chance.

Blocking budgets VP can be life threatening as we'll.if you can't fund healthcare and the police it could be one a lot for threatening from a aimaginery threat internally and externally as we'll.THere should be a effective alternative to the blocking mechanism as well.The alternative is you get turkey as a guarantor in the north state which will be reduced dramatically since you insists on strict bizonality and you yield for double majorities in everything else.alas the property issue would be solved to agreat degree as we'll.THis is I believe what DEmonex ment by autonomy for atc north entity.

[boulio]

But if it's a rental property your aunt can pay rent to the gc owner.If the gc owner wishes to keep it,if not he can sell it or exchange it.The point is the owner should have the option to do what he wishes with the property.What has become of your aunt properties?if she dosent want them she will sell them to help either buy or rent the property she lives in.

Yes my Aunt could be forced to pay rent but is such a solution really 'just' ? If the RoC had wanted to build a road through this property then it would have been compulsorily purchased and the GC owners forced to accept compensation. Why then is forcing them to take compensation in a case like this as part of a settlement such an anathema ? Right to property is not absolute. Right to life should be absolute but was not. Where is the talk of compensation for the murder of her husband, killed by illegal agents of the RoC ? Where is the talk of justice for her ? My Aunt owns no property in the South, though in the period from 64-74 she twice had to flee homes for fear of her and her children's lives and lived in tent cities for much of this period. It does feel like the demand for 'justice' is to be only for those who lost property as a result of 74, everything lost before that is all to be forgotten, be it property or life. Where is the justice in that ?

Because the roc didn't force the owner out at gun point,it's imminent domain not ethnic cleaning.Again I'm sorry for your loss but two wrongs don't make a right.

[Oceanside50]

Property rights encompass full rights to ones property.

Here we get to the thorny issue of 'just settlement'. Whilst I can understand a perspective that says 'just' re property just means everything goes back to the pre 74 owners I do not think this necessarily is a 'just' settlement. Let me give a personal example. In 1964 my Aunt's husband was taken from his place of work (Barclays bank) in broad daylight and in public by an illegal GC militia (set up and run out of the interior ministry of the RoC) and he was murdered and his body dumped in a well in Ayia Napa (his body was finally recovered and returned some 30+ years later by the CMP). I do have to say he was not an extremist, not a member of tmt, just an ordinary Cypriot doing his best to support his family. In 1974 my Aunt was given a property that was GC prior to 1974 as 'compensation' for the loss of her husband. The history of this property is know, in that whilst it was GC owned prior to 74 it was never a GC home. From the time it was built until 74 it was never the GC owners home and was used exclusively as an income generating rental property from when it was first built to 1974. My Aunt has lived in this house from 74 to the present day. For her it is a 'home' with all the emotional attachment that implies. It is where she raised her three children, without a husband. What is more it represent not just 'home' for her but in a very real and palpable way it represents 'security' and the absence of 'living in fear' that marked the 10 years of her life prior to 74 from the point her husband 'disappeared'. So I have to ask is it 'just' that she, now in her 70s should be forced from this home so that it can be returned to the pre 74 GC owners ? Even if there were some mechanism for compensation for her if she were to be forced to leave this property, which is far from clear anyway given that it was not given to her in exchange for property lost but in exchange for a husband and father lost, is not the most 'just' thing in a scenario like this that the GC owners receive monetary compensation for the lost property that was only ever an income source for them pre 74 and never a home so that she can be allowed to live ut the remainder of her life there for who it really is a home ?

My belief is a 'just settlement' would require a humanistic and compassionate case by case approach to issues such as these that is not compatible with a simple 'everything must return to pre 74 owners' approach. Can you understand why I think this ?

sorry for your loss Erol..and yes there should be cases where determination should be based on mitigating circumstances.