Cyprus-Forum.com

[Paphitis]

Looks like NATO is getting serious.

Possibility of deploying forces in the Black Sea and Eastern Europe. Wonder if the Russians will withdraw now?

[Get Real!]

Looks like NATO is getting serious.

Possibility of deploying forces in the Black Sea and Eastern Europe.

Are you implying that the US may attack Russia?

If not then what exactly renders any of the US' actions with respect to Russia, “serious”?

Wonder if the Russians will withdraw now?

I gotta keep reminding myself that you're Australian...

[Paphitis]

Looks like NATO is getting serious.

Possibility of deploying forces in the Black Sea and Eastern Europe.

Are you implying that the US may attack Russia?

If not then what exactly renders any of the US' actions with respect to Russia, “serious”?

Wonder if the Russians will withdraw now?

I gotta keep reminding myself that you're Australian...

I don't know if they attack Russia. And if they do, Russia is not a match. They will get hit hard. But this is unlikely I would say.

Maybe they will deploy troops to Ukraine at the most and then it gets very serious.

If they deploy to Ukraine then the NATO troops would be welcomed by the legitimate Government. therefore, any further action by Russia can only be viewed as being aggressive and illegal action against not only Ukraine but NATO forces as well.

[Robin Hood]

If they deploy to Ukraine then the NATO troops would be welcomed by the legitimate Government. Therefore, any further action by Russia can only be viewed as being aggressive and illegal action against not only Ukraine but NATO forces as well.

Paphitis: I can’t believe you said that! I thought you were smarter than that and would be able to work it out for yourself. You have obviously been taken in by the western propoganda!

Firstly .... there is no legitimate Government in Ukraine, it was deposed in a coup d’etat organised and at the dictat of US supported extreme right wing group of Nazi/extreme right wing thugs. By the US’s own admission they have been providing funds to the tune of $5bn over the last ten tears to these groups! Can you imagine the US allowing the Russians to support anti-US groups within the US?

Secondly .....Yes,they will be welcomed by the ‘illegitimate’ government because they are the imposed government being supported by the US and their Allies in the EU. It is against the UN mandate to recognise a government or to support a government that comes to power through a coup d’etat, although these rules do not apply to the US apparently, as they consider themselves to be above International Law, when the US acts in its own interests.

Thirdly ..... The ‘action’ taken so far by Russia prevented just what is happening now in Eastern Ukraine, from happening in Crimea. OK, they bent the rules just like an ambulance breaks the rules when it exceeds the speed limit ..... it was for the greater good. The troops they have in Crimea are legitimate and they have not exceeded their ‘allowance’ of 25,000 and there is no evidence (plenty of accusations!) that Russian troops are involved or even that Putin has any direct involvement.

Fourthly ..... The ‘action’ taken by Putin in Ukraine, resulted in no deaths, no destruction and no refugees, which to me seems a better policy than ‘humanitarian obliteration’ as favoured by the US and NATO by the use of massive military force against a virtually unarmed population as practised in places such as Afghanistan, Iraq, Yemen, Somalia, Sudan, Pakistan, Libya and Syria etc. and the other 50 odd conflicts the US is engaged in either directly or more likely by the use of proxy rebels or covert CIA operations.

Fithly .... Russia bent the rules but their action’s came as a result of threats to the Russian population of Crimea and is now being enacted upon the ethnic Russians in the Eastern Ukraine. The first thing the imposed government did was to declare the shut down of all Russian language TV and Radio stations, all publications in Russian and a whole string of what can only be described as ‘Apartheid’ legislation to ’Ukranianise’ the country. They also announced that the y would cancel the agreement for Russia to continue to use their Sevastopol Naval base and that Crimea would no longer be an autonomous state within Ukraine. It was the population of Crimea that through a referendum exercised their rights to self determination and they voted overwhelmingly to remain autonomous but within the Russian federation. I think they call that .... exercising their democratic rights?

Sixthly ...... Contrary to all the doom and gloom from the western press and experts, Russia has not used its military might to interfere in Ukraine. It has its military sitting within its territorial boundaries unlike NATO, who are now flying sorties along the border between Russia and EU and other countries. But of course this is not considered a threat to stability in the region as it is the ‘good guys’ doing the threatening. At least PUTIN is within his own territorial boundaries not building up a military in somebody else's back yard thousands of miles from home!

...... and that’s just for staters!

If anybody is to blame for what is happening in Ukraine and the threat it now constitutes to world peace it is the US backed by the Muppets in the EU to further US/NATO interests. Although Putin’s actions in Crimea were against the rules he stopped a lot of bloodshed. He did it professionally and without the need to interfere unduly in Ukraine's politics.

Don’t believe the propaganda being put out by the western MSM, try the following articles for a broader and more realistic interpretation of what is going on in Ukraine:

Former Kremlin advisor gives Russia's view of the crisis in Ukraine ..... By ABC
http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article38243.htm

Washington Drives The World To War ......... By Paul Craig Roberts
http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article38236.htm

Is Putin Being Lured Into a Trap? .......... By Mike Whitney
http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article38242.htm

...... and the other side of the story from a totally unbiased Daily Mail journalist ......... this is what the majority who don't have the brains to see through the smoke screen use as the basis for their opinions:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2605578/Edward-Lucas-I-hope-Im-wrong-historians-look-say-start-World-War-III.html

[Paphitis]

RH,

I am talking from the point of view that Ukraine has its sovereignty. No matter what internal political issues they have, they should be allowed to sort it out themselves.

Furthermore, Russians in the country have no legal basis to demand that any part of Ukraine cede to Russia and if the previous administration did that then they acted against international law.

This reminds me so much of the Cyprus Problem. Even if there was a Coup, it does not give any country the right to invade and annex any part if a sovereign country.

[Maximus]

RH,

I am talking from the point of view that Ukraine has its sovereignty. No matter what internal political issues they have, they should be allowed to sort it out themselves.

Furthermore, Russians in the country have no legal basis to demand that any part of Ukraine cede to Russia and if the previous administration did that then they acted against international law.

This reminds me so much of the Cyprus Problem. Even if there was a Coup, it does not give any country the right to invade and annex any part if a sovereign country.

Russia did not invade. Those Russians were there along with their navy and troops ever since Crimea was Russian, until 1954. There was an undemocratic decision to cede it to the Ukraine. They just woke up one morning to discover that they are now Ukrainian and they didn't have a say in that either.

The Russians in Crimea did not kill, commit ethnic cleansing or steal other peoples property or demand 'political equality' like the TC's and Turks did in Cyprus. Russia didn't do this either to take it (back).

The west has made Russia out to be the biggest bogey-man on the planet, when I am more inclined to believe the opposite.

[Paphitis]

RH,

I am talking from the point of view that Ukraine has its sovereignty. No matter what internal political issues they have, they should be allowed to sort it out themselves.

Furthermore, Russians in the country have no legal basis to demand that any part of Ukraine cede to Russia and if the previous administration did that then they acted against international law.

This reminds me so much of the Cyprus Problem. Even if there was a Coup, it does not give any country the right to invade and annex any part if a sovereign country.

Russia did not invade. Those Russians were there along with their navy and troops ever since Crimea was Russian, until 1954. There was an undemocratic decision to cede it to the Ukraine. They just woke up one morning to discover that they are now Ukrainian and they didn't have a say in that either.

The Russians in Crimea did not kill, commit ethnic cleansing or steal other peoples property or demand 'political equality' like the TC's and Turks did in Cyprus. Russia didn't do this either to take it (back).

The west has made Russia out to be the biggest bogey-man on the planet, when I am more inclined to believe the opposite.

That's only true if the Russian Forces stayed in their treaty established bases. They ventured out and that constitutes an invasion.

Just like if the British Forces leave the SBAs and start road blocks and taking over RoC Government Buildings and moves onto cities and towns and control them would constitute illegal invasion.

[Maximus]

RH,

I am talking from the point of view that Ukraine has its sovereignty. No matter what internal political issues they have, they should be allowed to sort it out themselves.

Furthermore, Russians in the country have no legal basis to demand that any part of Ukraine cede to Russia and if the previous administration did that then they acted against international law.

This reminds me so much of the Cyprus Problem. Even if there was a Coup, it does not give any country the right to invade and annex any part if a sovereign country.

Russia did not invade. Those Russians were there along with their navy and troops ever since Crimea was Russian, until 1954. There was an undemocratic decision to cede it to the Ukraine. They just woke up one morning to discover that they are now Ukrainian and they didn't have a say in that either.

The Russians in Crimea did not kill, commit ethnic cleansing or steal other peoples property or demand 'political equality' like the TC's and Turks did in Cyprus. Russia didn't do this either to take it (back).

The west has made Russia out to be the biggest bogey-man on the planet, when I am more inclined to believe the opposite.

That's only true if the Russian Forces stayed in their treaty established bases. They ventured out and that constitutes an invasion.

Just like if the British Forces leave the SBAs and start road blocks and taking over RoC Government Buildings and moves onto cities and towns and control them would constitute illegal invasion.

The British government expropriated those bases from the RoC. They did all that venturing into towns and cities before 1960. The SBA's should be dismantled and given back to the RoC because they are not guaranteeing the sovereign integrity of Cyprus. This is just one example of western hypocrisy.

They want to sanction Putin, but give Erdogan money.

[Paphitis]

RH,

I am talking from the point of view that Ukraine has its sovereignty. No matter what internal political issues they have, they should be allowed to sort it out themselves.

Furthermore, Russians in the country have no legal basis to demand that any part of Ukraine cede to Russia and if the previous administration did that then they acted against international law.

This reminds me so much of the Cyprus Problem. Even if there was a Coup, it does not give any country the right to invade and annex any part if a sovereign country.

Russia did not invade. Those Russians were there along with their navy and troops ever since Crimea was Russian, until 1954. There was an undemocratic decision to cede it to the Ukraine. They just woke up one morning to discover that they are now Ukrainian and they didn't have a say in that either.

The Russians in Crimea did not kill, commit ethnic cleansing or steal other peoples property or demand 'political equality' like the TC's and Turks did in Cyprus. Russia didn't do this either to take it (back).

The west has made Russia out to be the biggest bogey-man on the planet, when I am more inclined to believe the opposite.

That's only true if the Russian Forces stayed in their treaty established bases. They ventured out and that constitutes an invasion.

Just like if the British Forces leave the SBAs and start road blocks and taking over RoC Government Buildings and moves onto cities and towns and control them would constitute illegal invasion.

The British government expropriated those bases from the RoC. They did all that venturing into towns and cities before 1960. The SBA's should be dismantled and given back to the RoC because they are not guaranteeing the sovereign integrity of Cyprus. This is just one example of western hypocrisy.

They want to sanction Putin, but give Erdogan money.

Personally, I don't think you have much of an argument. The SBAs and the Russian Bases were established by signed Treaty. That makes them legal and sovereign until further notice. Both the UK and Russia may have forced their hand over Ukraine and Cyprus but at the end of the day, the treaties are binding.

Russia and UK are not allowed to use those bases to invade Ukraine or RoC. In Ukraine, this is clearly what Russia has done.

It is also the second time they have done it in the last 2 years.

[Maximus]

Paphitis,

the British have to guarantee the sovereign integrity of the republic of Cyprus, which they are not doing. Those treaties are worthless and were violated in 1974.

You can bet your last Aussie dollar that if there was a conflict in Cyprus involving the British expats, they would venture out of the SBA's and invade Cyprus.