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Why "Reunification" will Always FAIL!

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Re: Why "Reunification" will Always FAIL!

Postby zan » Wed Jun 25, 2014 10:20 pm

repulsewarrior wrote:...again, the question remains, have I piqued your interest, or is this one of these trick questions like Harlem should or shouldn't be an enclave.



Come on RW.... You are beginning to sound like a dodgy salesman. Will your idea stand up to scrutiny or not. My interest is obvious or I wouldn't ask. My scepticism is obvious as well but if you are sure of the product then why the suspicion? I asked a question and you call it a trick :? I honestly did not think such a simple question would be so much trouble for you. The reason I am asking for a map is because you said the enclaves would be along the lines of what we have now and then you mentioned pockets all over the island. It's confusing and I thought a map might be clearer. If I don't like what I see then I will tell you. I am really confused as to what you want :? I will tell you that I googled the subject and could not find anything positive about enclaves. Mostly what feared so what is your spin?
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Re: Why "Reunification" will Always FAIL!

Postby repulsewarrior » Wed Jun 25, 2014 11:33 pm

...Nikitas, I wish I could agree with you, just settle the percentages and move the Green Line accordingly, because Territory is, the, issue, as you say. we may have two (or more Constituencies, where within, one Language is spoken first before another), but Cyprus is not at Peace divided. even more importantly Cyprus remains impotent in its representation, for the island, it will not be as Cypriots we make our important decisions, if as Territorial Jurisdictions "they" are not subject to a Governance that speaks for all Cypriots as Individuals. without one Cyprus, Free, because it represents, not "Greekness", not "Turkishness" (they would have their representation as Constituencies), but as a European State, we won't even have those pleasures as Liberty, the hatred that must stop will continue, what was and is the malice foisted on the island will remain, just on another scale.

...enclaves, provide a wide benefit, by respecting the meaning has a geographic context, and not only a single political aim for which they were used in the past. they secure the Free Movement, Free Association, and Expression we all seek, regardless, because the Green Line ends, as a "border", and in Cyprus their would be many frontiers.

...again, I suggest the a Greek Constituency, if it existed, would do better than the State in the negotiation for Territorial Jurisdictions. I suggest it would be easier to reform the Republic's Constitution, if it was the Constituencies themselves, (since it is not Sovereignty that is the question) which come forward, in unanimity declaring their needs toward this end, to the Federal Government, accordingly. this is a demonstration of a Bicommunal relationship, of Cypriots. and it allows for Cypriots to express their concerns as Human beings, not as Persons, as Individuals, not based on whether they prefer their children to learn one Language or another first, or to be served at the municipal level in one Language or the other, first; do you get the point?

...without a Cyprus, one Cyprus, we loose our Freedom, to the "Greeks" and "Turks" among us, who offer instead the Liberty of being "Greek", or "Turkish", but not Freedom for Cyprus, not Freedom for Cypriots as Cypriots, or true Freedom itself, "they" will forever hold the Agenda.

@zan, I think you can deduce yourself the idea I have, since it is possible that you remain unclear, I will suggest that whatever map I can draw out for you is as good as any other at this point, but I hope you can see how a Constituency can be made up of geographic components, to have as an electorate self representation, effecting their daily lives through the Institutions they create for themselves with their own tax dollars, having as its electorate Citizens of Cyprus, who vote as a body for a superior governance, to defend Individual Rights based on Universal Principals, and our Sovereignty as a People who stand united to this end; imo, about seven enclaves north, and four south, (all of different sizes (best suited)), with the Green line adjusted only slightly, might be a good start.
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Re: Why "Reunification" will Always FAIL!

Postby Oceanside50 » Thu Jun 26, 2014 5:25 am

Cantons are what they are called...the Tc can govern themselves under the umbrella of the ROC and EU...Nicosia, Paphos, Larnaca, Famagusta, Limassol .. Basically where the vast majority of Tc are originally from and where their villages are located. The rest of the Tc can live amongst the Gc, for instance the population of Tc pre 74 in Kyrenia was 358, I'm sure they could blend in
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Re: Why "Reunification" will Always FAIL!

Postby zan » Thu Jun 26, 2014 7:28 am

Oceanside50 wrote:Cantons are what they are called...the Tc can govern themselves under the umbrella of the ROC and EU...Nicosia, Paphos, Larnaca, Famagusta, Limassol .. Basically where the vast majority of Tc are originally from and where their villages are located. The rest of the Tc can live amongst the Gc, for instance the population of Tc pre 74 in Kyrenia was 358, I'm sure they could blend in


That is the whole problem...... Cantons not enclaves..... Either way NO to minority status.
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Re: Why "Reunification" will Always FAIL!

Postby zan » Thu Jun 26, 2014 7:30 am

Nikitas,

Why should we always stay at 18%?
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Re: Why "Reunification" will Always FAIL!

Postby Sotos » Fri Jun 27, 2014 4:19 pm

There can never be an agreed unification because what the Turks want is partition which is why they invaded Cyprus. Cyprus will remain divided until the day that the circumstances will be right to take our lands back.
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Re: Why "Reunification" will Always FAIL!

Postby zan » Fri Jun 27, 2014 4:37 pm

Sotos wrote:There can never be an agreed unification because what the Turks want is partition which is why they invaded Cyprus. Cyprus will remain divided until the day that the circumstances will be right to take our lands back.



Good luck with that. Where can I send a card :lol:
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Re: Why "Reunification" will Always FAIL!

Postby boulio » Fri Jun 27, 2014 6:02 pm

Sotos wrote:There can never be an agreed unification because what the Turks want is partition which is why they invaded Cyprus. Cyprus will remain divided until the day that the circumstances will be right to take our lands back.



the turks dont want partition,they want the status quo or a very week confederal model to try and control all of cyprus.Curerently the control 36% if the other 64% went its way and turkey has no say it would not suit her plans.
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Re: Why "Reunification" will Always FAIL!

Postby repulsewarrior » Fri Jun 27, 2014 6:34 pm

zan wrote:
Oceanside50 wrote:Cantons are what they are called...the Tc can govern themselves under the umbrella of the ROC and EU...Nicosia, Paphos, Larnaca, Famagusta, Limassol .. Basically where the vast majority of Tc are originally from and where their villages are located. The rest of the Tc can live amongst the Gc, for instance the population of Tc pre 74 in Kyrenia was 358, I'm sure they could blend in


That is the whole problem...... Cantons not enclaves..... Either way NO to minority status.


I'm not sure you get it. take a map as it is drawn today and toss some circles of different sizes on it. if there exists a Greek Constituency, as well as others, they could serve their electorate as they see fit, as Persons, within the bounds of their territorial jurisdictions. a set of geographic components would make a National Assembly; for the "Greeks" some 'circles' in the north, and what is not 'circled, south of the Green line, vice versa for the Turkish Constituency. There would be 'circles' for the Maronites, Armenians, Latins, (it would be possible to make an English 'circle' too).

...either way Cyprus is Cyprus, a Republic not unlike others in the Family of Man, with a Government that represents its Citizens as Cypriots, without distinction, or discrimination.
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Re: Why "Reunification" will Always FAIL!

Postby zan » Fri Jun 27, 2014 6:42 pm

repulsewarrior wrote:
zan wrote:
Oceanside50 wrote:Cantons are what they are called...the Tc can govern themselves under the umbrella of the ROC and EU...Nicosia, Paphos, Larnaca, Famagusta, Limassol .. Basically where the vast majority of Tc are originally from and where their villages are located. The rest of the Tc can live amongst the Gc, for instance the population of Tc pre 74 in Kyrenia was 358, I'm sure they could blend in


That is the whole problem...... Cantons not enclaves..... Either way NO to minority status.


I'm not sure you get it. take a map as it is drawn today and toss some circles of different sizes on it. if there exists a Greek Constituency, as well as others, they could serve their electorate as they see fit, as Persons, within the bounds of their territorial jurisdictions. a set of geographic components would make a National Assembly; for the "Greeks" some 'circles' in the north, and what is not 'circled, south of the Green line, vice versa for the Turkish Constituency. There would be 'circles' for the Maronites, Armenians, Latins, (it would be possible to make an English 'circle' too).

...either way Cyprus is Cyprus, a Republic not unlike others in the Family of Man, with a Government that represents its Citizens as Cypriots, without distinction, or discrimination.



So if the Greek circles want to further join with Greece as enclaves outside of Greece they can, the same for Turks and so on? Or would that have to be controlled by a complicated , some say unfair, constitution and maybe guarantor powers? And who IS the government?
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