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cyprus talks to resume may 15,2015

How can we solve it? (keep it civilized)

Re: cyprus talks to resume may 15,2015

Postby Lordo » Fri May 29, 2015 2:02 am

Nikitas wrote:The general goal for most Cypriots is to avoid a repeat of 1963 and 1974, and for that they are prepared to agree to BBF.

In practice they will see that the now equal minority will not be content to stay within its region and be happy with their autonomy. Bizonality cannot be long sustained when the major business centers are all in one region, not by design, they always were, and if Famagusta opens up then all major employment centers will be in the south, south Nicosia, Limassol, Famagusta, Larnaca. There will be a daily influx of people to work there and soon they will want to live where they work, which is natural, and the result will be a new "minority" in the south and we are back to square one. One salient question is will there also be a new minority in the north?

I want to see how they will try to prevent this natural erosion of the bicommunal and bizonal aspect of BBF.

Akinci is from Limassol, he visits his home town, he can see that this one city is the economic equivalent of the whole north. He knows TCs will move there in time.

Imagining the future as a static situation contained within artificial divisions is not so wise especially for an island inhabited by educated ambitious people.

it will be decided at the federal government level as to what happens. they should be able to give incentives to companies to set up in the north especially foreign ones to raise the economy. if you apply the economic policies of terggy towards the kurds you will reap the benefits of division. If you try to be fair to both communities why on earth would the tcs want to separate. if nothing else the Turkish companies will be able to help too. you will not know till you try and it is criminal not to try.
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Re: cyprus talks to resume may 15,2015

Postby Kikapu » Fri May 29, 2015 8:19 am

Lordo wrote:
Nikitas wrote:The general goal for most Cypriots is to avoid a repeat of 1963 and 1974, and for that they are prepared to agree to BBF.

In practice they will see that the now equal minority will not be content to stay within its region and be happy with their autonomy. Bizonality cannot be long sustained when the major business centers are all in one region, not by design, they always were, and if Famagusta opens up then all major employment centers will be in the south, south Nicosia, Limassol, Famagusta, Larnaca. There will be a daily influx of people to work there and soon they will want to live where they work, which is natural, and the result will be a new "minority" in the south and we are back to square one. One salient question is will there also be a new minority in the north?

I want to see how they will try to prevent this natural erosion of the bicommunal and bizonal aspect of BBF.

Akinci is from Limassol, he visits his home town, he can see that this one city is the economic equivalent of the whole north. He knows TCs will move there in time.

Imagining the future as a static situation contained within artificial divisions is not so wise especially for an island inhabited by educated ambitious people.

it will be decided at the federal government level as to what happens. they should be able to give incentives to companies to set up in the north especially foreign ones to raise the economy. if you apply the economic policies of terggy towards the kurds you will reap the benefits of division. If you try to be fair to both communities why on earth would the tcs want to separate. if nothing else the Turkish companies will be able to help too. you will not know till you try and it is criminal not to try.


Federal government does not dictate to anyone where one should place his or her businesses, domestic or foreign companies, in the north or south of the island. It is decided by the business owners themselves and whatever agreement the business owner can negotiate with that state and city. This is how things work in democratic countries.
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Re: cyprus talks to resume may 15,2015

Postby Lordo » Fri May 29, 2015 10:33 am

read what i said carefully my man and dont forget to take your headache tablets. governments have been sweetening corporations to invest in their country and each area in the country would also give concessions to these corporations to invest in their area. its called capitalism. i thought you is the expert, obviously not.

but in reality given the education of the workforce in the area i have no problem trusting the corporations to decide which part of the island to invest in. you and nikitas obviously believe they would move to the south federation and pay more for land, or rent and more for wages for their workforce for the same quality.

you have been found light in your understanding of economics before in another thread and you are shining through as per usual in this one too. you beginning to give me a headache now, i think a decent pair of shades is the order of the day.

thats better.
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Re: cyprus talks to resume may 15,2015

Postby Nikitas » Fri May 29, 2015 2:59 pm

I was not thinking of the large corporations, more of the TC who might want to expand his shop into a chain of similar sized shops. His natural market is in the large urban centers of the south. His staff will want to live near their work. It only takes a dozen such cases to create a new "minority" in the south and then we are facing a challenge to this BBF construct.

In other words you cannot have the characteristics of an international state division within the context of a federation or even a confederation. That is why I am curious about what will come out of these talks.
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Re: cyprus talks to resume may 15,2015

Postby Lordo » Fri May 29, 2015 3:46 pm

Nikitas wrote:I was not thinking of the large corporations, more of the TC who might want to expand his shop into a chain of similar sized shops. His natural market is in the large urban centers of the south. His staff will want to live near their work. It only takes a dozen such cases to create a new "minority" in the south and then we are facing a challenge to this BBF construct.

In other words you cannot have the characteristics of an international state division within the context of a federation or even a confederation. That is why I am curious about what will come out of these talks.

you carry on thinking about that, have you seen some the supermarkets in the north lately. i am talking about a pool of university graduates who would cost less than half to employ and can do as good a job as any in the western hemisphere.
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Re: cyprus talks to resume may 15,2015

Postby B25 » Fri May 29, 2015 3:59 pm

Nikitas, I wonder if they also want to share the RoC debt. After all it does pay out to the TCs.

I wonder !!!!!!
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Re: cyprus talks to resume may 15,2015

Postby Lordo » Fri May 29, 2015 7:41 pm

B25 wrote:Nikitas, I wonder if they also want to share the RoC debt. After all it does pay out to the TCs.

I wonder !!!!!!

ha ha ha ha ha ha ha hahaha ahah ahahahahahahahahaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah

yes where were we your debt
well the debt collectors will be knocking on the door soon you better be in.
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Re: cyprus talks to resume may 15,2015

Postby Pyrpolizer » Fri May 29, 2015 11:39 pm

Nikitas wrote:The general goal for most Cypriots is to avoid a repeat of 1963 and 1974, and for that they are prepared to agree to BBF.

In practice they will see that the now equal minority will not be content to stay within its region and be happy with their autonomy. Bizonality cannot be long sustained when the major business centers are all in one region, not by design, they always were, and if Famagusta opens up then all major employment centers will be in the south, south Nicosia, Limassol, Famagusta, Larnaca. There will be a daily influx of people to work there and soon they will want to live where they work, which is natural, and the result will be a new "minority" in the south and we are back to square one. One salient question is will there also be a new minority in the north?

I want to see how they will try to prevent this natural erosion of the bicommunal and bizonal aspect of BBF.

Akinci is from Limassol, he visits his home town, he can see that this one city is the economic equivalent of the whole north. He knows TCs will move there in time.

Imagining the future as a static situation contained within artificial divisions is not so wise especially for an island inhabited by educated ambitious people.


BBF is not sustainable. Within maximum 40 years we will have a BDaMCF (Bi-District and Mixed-communal Federation.)
The important thing is to make a start.
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Re: cyprus talks to resume may 15,2015

Postby Lordo » Sat May 30, 2015 12:18 am

Pyrpolizer wrote:
Nikitas wrote:The general goal for most Cypriots is to avoid a repeat of 1963 and 1974, and for that they are prepared to agree to BBF.

In practice they will see that the now equal minority will not be content to stay within its region and be happy with their autonomy. Bizonality cannot be long sustained when the major business centers are all in one region, not by design, they always were, and if Famagusta opens up then all major employment centers will be in the south, south Nicosia, Limassol, Famagusta, Larnaca. There will be a daily influx of people to work there and soon they will want to live where they work, which is natural, and the result will be a new "minority" in the south and we are back to square one. One salient question is will there also be a new minority in the north?

I want to see how they will try to prevent this natural erosion of the bicommunal and bizonal aspect of BBF.

Akinci is from Limassol, he visits his home town, he can see that this one city is the economic equivalent of the whole north. He knows TCs will move there in time.

Imagining the future as a static situation contained within artificial divisions is not so wise especially for an island inhabited by educated ambitious people.


BBF is not sustainable. Within maximum 40 years we will have a BDaMCF (Bi-District and Mixed-communal Federation.)
The important thing is to make a start.

in 40 years all going well we will have unitary state gavole ma en ixeris dibbode esuni. ise delya san don cluelesspu.
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Re: cyprus talks to resume may 15,2015

Postby Nikitas » Sat May 30, 2015 1:17 am

"BBF is not sustainable"

Pyro is right. There obviousl is a reason why the two communities were interspersed all over the island in the past, and my guess is that they gravitated to places where they could make a living. It will be the same in the future. Obviously all those involved have consulting social scientists and other experts who probably say as much and they too know BBF is a temporary mechanism. And if they know it won't last then we must assume they have contingency plans ready for the time it expires.

In the meantime we will have a multilayered civil service and a new bicommunal class of civil servants who hopefully will not make life intolerable for the rest of us. The jockeying for "positions" in the federal government will be something to watch when the time comes. They will probably ask and get special tax status as federal employees and the demand will have bicommunal force, not something to be trifled with. This BBF thing has its funny side too.
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