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Robot passes self awareness test

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Re: Robot passes self awareness test

Postby Get Real! » Sat Jul 18, 2015 1:25 pm

Sotos wrote:
It’s called artificial because the microprocessor is given lots and lots of pre-declared “lookup tables” full of “knowledge” via the software


Actually it is not like that anymore. It is not merely a ton of pre-programmed "if this then that" statements. It is a very complicated field but it is advancing fast. Advanced AI today can actually learn like a child learns but within more limited worlds. So the Intelligence is true... not faking it. They are just far from human level intelligence, but they are advancing FAST. It took biology billions of years of evolution to get to the point where brains were as intelligent as what we have. It will take just decades to get technology to the same level ... and then we are screwed, because AI will then evolve itself in lightning speed and we will be to them as stupid as insects are to us :?

Microprocessors are just binary number processors and nothing more. In the binary world there are only two states… ON/OPEN and OFF/CLOSED.

There’s nothing else so I cannot see how we can ever replicate the human brain which has billions of neurons that undergo billions of complex chemical reactions with just the two dumb states! (on/off)

Furthermore, the human brain handles completely unknown (to computers) complex conditions such as emotion and that can NEVER be quantified on a binary scale!

Perhaps in the future when we master FLESH and NEURONS + electric current, instead of stupid transistors… but not with our current electro-mechanical technology!
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Re: Robot passes self awareness test

Postby Get Real! » Sat Jul 18, 2015 1:36 pm

GreekIslandGirl wrote:I agree the phrase Artificial Intelligence has taken on a new meaning.

Whereas it was initially impressive merely to have computers storing lots of data/knowledge, AI has come to mean the attempt to create machines that can use the information they acquire in a more human-like way. This means molding information to suit new situations by bending rules or making connections not previously specified.

Most profoundly, as the researchers of this article were concerned with is whether robots can self-develop awareness of their own condition i.e. whether they can speak or not from the fact they do or don't and not because they are pre-informed (pre-programmed to 'know').

This is an application from the studies with lesser apes and dogs to determine if they have emotions of guilt or empathy. With dogs, we now know they love us (a previously human-only emotion) but they do not understand that we can have the same feelings and are capable of loving them back (that's rather sad, don't you think?).

Oracle, anything based on the transistor is extremely limited and can never come anywhere near an ignorant brain let alone a healthy one. In fact a mentally retarded person is still intellectually superior to the world’s most powerful computer.

Man needs to move AWAY from its current bullshit electronics if they want to tap into what you’re talking about. It’s not gonna happen with transistors, resistors and diodes!

Future programming will need to move away from IT people and into the world of geneticists and biologists if we’re to see what you’re describing.
At the moment all we can produce is fantastic calculating machines. In other words…COGS! :)
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Re: Robot passes self awareness test

Postby Sotos » Sat Jul 18, 2015 2:10 pm

Get Real! wrote:
Sotos wrote:
It’s called artificial because the microprocessor is given lots and lots of pre-declared “lookup tables” full of “knowledge” via the software


Actually it is not like that anymore. It is not merely a ton of pre-programmed "if this then that" statements. It is a very complicated field but it is advancing fast. Advanced AI today can actually learn like a child learns but within more limited worlds. So the Intelligence is true... not faking it. They are just far from human level intelligence, but they are advancing FAST. It took biology billions of years of evolution to get to the point where brains were as intelligent as what we have. It will take just decades to get technology to the same level ... and then we are screwed, because AI will then evolve itself in lightning speed and we will be to them as stupid as insects are to us :?

Microprocessors are just binary number processors and nothing more. In the binary world there are only two states… ON/OPEN and OFF/CLOSED.

There’s nothing else so I cannot see how we can ever replicate the human brain which has billions of neurons that undergo billions of complex chemical reactions with just the two dumb states! (on/off)

Furthermore, the human brain handles completely unknown (to computers) complex conditions such as emotion and that can NEVER be quantified on a binary scale!

Perhaps in the future when we master FLESH and NEURONS + electric current, instead of stupid transistors… but not with our current electro-mechanical technology!


For the most part neurons are also binary. They either fire or they don't. Also it doesn't mean that there is only one way to get Intelligence. People were trying to build flying machines for 100s of years and they were trying to do it by building machines that imitate birds, something which was way too difficult, so they failed. But as it turns out you can build a flying machine without imitating biology. Technology can have its own evolution which is separate of that of biology. The same is true for Intelligence. And emotions are overrated ;) There are psychopaths that are unable to experience certain emotions and yet this does not determine their intelligence. And who is to say that AI will not have emotions when it reaches our level of intelligence?
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Re: Robot passes self awareness test

Postby Get Real! » Sat Jul 18, 2015 2:23 pm

Sotos wrote:For the most part neurons are also binary. They either fire or they don't.

You're getting confused with event handlers! :lol:
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Re: Robot passes self awareness test

Postby Get Real! » Sat Jul 18, 2015 2:30 pm

The human brain has a MAYBE which the computer cannot determine. The maybe itself is not a single state/value but a wide range of values. For example it could be a “sort of maybe” or a “Kinda maybe” or an “almost maybe” and so forth.

The human brain can also accept two or more answers like... “Yes and Maybe” or a “No but perhaps”!

But if a computer starts marking things as “pending asynchronous outcomes yet undetermined” then it cannot possibly conclude and process very much.

I really can’t see how our primitive electronics can replicate the human brain. :lol:
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Re: Robot passes self awareness test

Postby GreekIslandGirl » Sat Jul 18, 2015 2:59 pm

Get Real! wrote:
GreekIslandGirl wrote:I agree the phrase Artificial Intelligence has taken on a new meaning.

Whereas it was initially impressive merely to have computers storing lots of data/knowledge, AI has come to mean the attempt to create machines that can use the information they acquire in a more human-like way. This means molding information to suit new situations by bending rules or making connections not previously specified.

Most profoundly, as the researchers of this article were concerned with is whether robots can self-develop awareness of their own condition i.e. whether they can speak or not from the fact they do or don't and not because they are pre-informed (pre-programmed to 'know').

This is an application from the studies with lesser apes and dogs to determine if they have emotions of guilt or empathy. With dogs, we now know they love us (a previously human-only emotion) but they do not understand that we can have the same feelings and are capable of loving them back (that's rather sad, don't you think?).

Oracle, anything based on the transistor is extremely limited and can never come anywhere near an ignorant brain let alone a healthy one. In fact a mentally retarded person is still intellectually superior to the world’s most powerful computer.

Man needs to move AWAY from its current bullshit electronics if they want to tap into what you’re talking about. It’s not gonna happen with transistors, resistors and diodes!

Future programming will need to move away from IT people and into the world of geneticists and biologists if we’re to see what you’re describing.
At the moment all we can produce is fantastic calculating machines. In other words…COGS! :)


I think your vision is limited. Already there are fusions of biological systems with artificial systems. After all, we are just biochemicals orchestrated in an organised way by a blueprint (program) called DNA.
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Re: Robot passes self awareness test

Postby Get Real! » Sat Jul 18, 2015 3:16 pm

GreekIslandGirl wrote:
Get Real! wrote:
GreekIslandGirl wrote:I agree the phrase Artificial Intelligence has taken on a new meaning.

Whereas it was initially impressive merely to have computers storing lots of data/knowledge, AI has come to mean the attempt to create machines that can use the information they acquire in a more human-like way. This means molding information to suit new situations by bending rules or making connections not previously specified.

Most profoundly, as the researchers of this article were concerned with is whether robots can self-develop awareness of their own condition i.e. whether they can speak or not from the fact they do or don't and not because they are pre-informed (pre-programmed to 'know').

This is an application from the studies with lesser apes and dogs to determine if they have emotions of guilt or empathy. With dogs, we now know they love us (a previously human-only emotion) but they do not understand that we can have the same feelings and are capable of loving them back (that's rather sad, don't you think?).

Oracle, anything based on the transistor is extremely limited and can never come anywhere near an ignorant brain let alone a healthy one. In fact a mentally retarded person is still intellectually superior to the world’s most powerful computer.

Man needs to move AWAY from its current bullshit electronics if they want to tap into what you’re talking about. It’s not gonna happen with transistors, resistors and diodes!

Future programming will need to move away from IT people and into the world of geneticists and biologists if we’re to see what you’re describing.
At the moment all we can produce is fantastic calculating machines. In other words…COGS! :)


I think your vision is limited. Already there are fusions of biological systems with artificial systems. After all, we are just biochemicals orchestrated in an organised way by a blueprint (program) called DNA.

And the world of electronics is a world of printed circuit boards (PCBs) that are incompatible with “biochemicals orchestrated by DNA”.

The closest I’ve seen are some electronic gadgets that send electrical impulses (pacemaker, bionic ear, etc) but other than that there’s little or no interaction with the FLESH. But the flesh is where all the secrets lie.
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Re: Robot passes self awareness test

Postby GreekIslandGirl » Sat Jul 18, 2015 3:27 pm

Get Real! wrote:... the flesh is where all the secrets lie.


Good title for a novel! :)

Other than that, you live too much in the moment. As well as having a poor grasp of history, you seem unable to broaden your outlook as to how much is possible.

Flesh is mostly protein, fat, sugars, vitamins, hormones, minerals - all put in their place by the same sort of signals as put together creatures which resemble circuits more than humans.
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Re: Robot passes self awareness test

Postby Oceanside50 » Sun Jul 19, 2015 6:09 am

Get Real! wrote:
Oceanside50 wrote:but isn't it the same way a human learns and understands by building on top of what he already knows like you said (apple) (red apple) etc. therefore isn't the code on the right track when they get this robot to do what it did? Now imagine a robot that can do 1 trillion calculations per second or a quadrillion per second which approaches the human brain, wouldn't a robot be able to think and act like a human?..

No, because humans have a huge advantage over computer software… humans can learn HOW TO LEARN and ADD extra knowledge but software cannot.

That’s the crux of advanced artificial intelligence which aims to make computers learn from existing knowledge and add more knowledge to the existing data, but they cannot!

Nobody has cracked it yet to the best of my knowledge, and I doubt they ever will.

It is excruciatingly complex how the human brain BUILDS and UTILIZES knowledge and we just haven’t been able to replicate that.

The only known way for software is to basically FEED the entire say Wikipedia in there and make it look "intelligent". :)


can a robot be taught to write its own software? for instance if a robot comes up to a big ditch, but doesn't have the code in telling it how to climb down the ditch and then up, if its aware of its capabilities could it teach itself to go down and then up the ditch to the other side, by writing its own code ? isn't that what a human would do?...
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Re: Robot passes self awareness test

Postby Sotos » Sun Jul 19, 2015 8:48 am

Oceanside50 wrote:
Get Real! wrote:
Oceanside50 wrote:but isn't it the same way a human learns and understands by building on top of what he already knows like you said (apple) (red apple) etc. therefore isn't the code on the right track when they get this robot to do what it did? Now imagine a robot that can do 1 trillion calculations per second or a quadrillion per second which approaches the human brain, wouldn't a robot be able to think and act like a human?..

No, because humans have a huge advantage over computer software… humans can learn HOW TO LEARN and ADD extra knowledge but software cannot.

That’s the crux of advanced artificial intelligence which aims to make computers learn from existing knowledge and add more knowledge to the existing data, but they cannot!

Nobody has cracked it yet to the best of my knowledge, and I doubt they ever will.

It is excruciatingly complex how the human brain BUILDS and UTILIZES knowledge and we just haven’t been able to replicate that.

The only known way for software is to basically FEED the entire say Wikipedia in there and make it look "intelligent". :)


can a robot be taught to write its own software? for instance if a robot comes up to a big ditch, but doesn't have the code in telling it how to climb down the ditch and then up, if its aware of its capabilities could it teach itself to go down and then up the ditch to the other side, by writing its own code ? isn't that what a human would do?...


Humans can't rewrite their own "code"... unless we start modifying our DNA to create new species! Our bodies and our brains are limited to what they can do. We need technology to extend our capabilities with external devices. But eventually AI would be able to evolve itself because it doesn't have any biological limitations.
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