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What do the Yanks have that the CNG needs?

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Re: What do the Yanks have that the CNG needs?

Postby kurupetos » Sun Nov 29, 2015 12:14 am

Get Real! wrote:Useless junk! None of our Russian radars and electronic equipment is compatible with American junk and not to mention that Americans can never be trusted with their dodgy export equipment.

I agree. We should be installing an S-400 system soon. :mrgreen:
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Re: What do the Yanks have that the CNG needs?

Postby Oceanside50 » Sun Nov 29, 2015 3:22 am

Why not deploy the s300 system that Cyprus has and stored in Crete ?.... There are surplus m1 Abrams sitting in the desert in Arizona that would look real good with the cng emblem..dirt cheap.. And some apaches about 100 of them ...500/.600 poutounta cruise ...kamia dthkiashia f16...ferte mas jai kamposos pyravlous...jai dthkiashous shilades heribillides/ mavrous/jai .mexicanous ...ean thelete .tipote alo varte to pastin lista
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Re: What do the Yanks have that the CNG needs?

Postby Paphitis » Sun Nov 29, 2015 3:23 am

Cap wrote:
Paphitis wrote:
Cap wrote:
A lot of money for Cyprus.


Of which the grecoturkish banana brothers have none.
Why?


No you have enough to buy if you wanted too. The order will be fulfilled over a couple of years.

But Cyprus would sacrifice other areas and it would be a dramatic amount of expenditure for a small place.



I like how you use the word 'you' when referring to Cyprus Paphitis?
Why is that?
The CNG can use your knowledge.

Back in my day on the force, the CNG took advantage of the South African Cypriot's expertise who fought in the Angolan bush war.
They were only a few but lessons were learned.

That's the difference between us and Israel.
The Israelis operate together as a unit across the globe for a common cause.

We backstab each other for foreign nationalism and political favour.
i don't fault Paphitis at all.


Come on Cap.

Of course I would be happy to help the CNG. There are hundreds of Cypriots in the Diaspora who can help the CNG with this process. There are more than a few Cypriots who are Pilots. Engineers on these aircraft and there are even Cyprikts who work for the Anerican firms who design and test these very systems.

Unfortunately, Cyprus is not as clever in seeking out these people like Israel does.

Procurement of fighters would be a major undertaking for Cyprus and there will be problems along the way, but it is seriously worth it. The money is a lot. About 12 fighters will be about a Billion. But life cycle is about 20 years before a replacement is needed so it's not bad return for the investment.
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Re: What do the Yanks have that the CNG needs?

Postby Paphitis » Sun Nov 29, 2015 3:40 am

Get Real! wrote:Chinese backdoors in military chips used by the US…

http://www.information-age.com/technolo ... itary-chip
http://defensetech.org/2012/05/30/smoki ... -infected/

So these Chinese backdoors are ON TOP of the American backdoors! :lol:

Good luck with your export version! :lol:


There is no export version.

Let's say Cyprus buys F-18F. The design and integration will be for Cypriot requirements. For instance, it is unlikely Cyprus will need long range fire and forget strike like some of the other countries so you might get a watered down version of the radar and weapon systems which concentrate on air to air and short range strike. The radar is still state of the art. The price will be cheaper too.

I know the RAAF had a bunch of journalists take a joy ride in one. The RAAF wouldn't let the journalists approach the aircraft from certain angles so they could see the Radar module and the ECCM electronics modules which are highly secretive. Cockpit photos were not allowed either.

The Australian F-18Fs are the EXACT same as the USN ones. They are also capable of landing on aircraft carriers with foldable wings.

Also, many of the systems are joint collaborations. They are not merely American. There are a stack of Australian and British firms involved in the electronic systems such as Tenix, BAE, Raytheon etc. there are probably 100 or so firms involved with the F-18F and not all are American.
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Re: What do the Yanks have that the CNG needs?

Postby Paphitis » Sun Nov 29, 2015 6:13 am

The American option is probably a very good option for Cyprus. In fact it's the best option politically.

Imagine Cyprus places an order for American Fighters. The Turks will kick up a stink 100% like they did with the S300 we ended up wasting our money on.

Now assuming Congress approve it, and there are question marks as to whether they will or not, the Americans will offer Cyprus a lot more political support in seeing the delivery and deployment of the Fighters as well as offer Cypriot Pilots conversion training. Everything will be set out and organized including the procurement of missiles and bombs.

If Turkey creates any issue, Obama would just call Erdogan and tell him to shut the fuck up bitch and Turkey is not to interfere.

In the end, the fighters will make their way to Paphos, with American support and resources in helping the CNG utilize the technology in the most efficient manner. They would want zero problems because they will be wanting to sell more.

This is in contrast to Russia that pretty much did stuff all in the S300 saga.
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Re: What do the Yanks have that the CNG needs?

Postby Nikitas » Sun Nov 29, 2015 10:24 am

Before you get an air force is it not wise to develop anti aircraft means to defend the airfields where the planes are parked?

I recall reading that in the 1973 Arab Israely war, most aircraft losses were not to sophisticated SAM systems or other planes, but to the the "dumb" 30mm cannon that put a lot of metal up ahead of fast planes.

In addition to the air thing that seems to give people the flutters it might be useful to shop for some smart munitions capable of being used in existing artillery, like the Strix anti armor mortars etc. And also some land based torpedo systems that can reach out beyond the 12 mile limit and prevent any blockade of the island.

An old general told me that defence capability is like an onion, multi layered and is built from the inside out, you start with the defence of the perimeter and build outwards. That was the lesson ignored with the S300, we went for the outermost layer of the onion, did not have the means to defend the base for the S300 and lost the plot.

Though where they are now they provide an umbrella that covers the vital area between Cyprus and Crete and most of the Aegean. I wonder if that was not the plan from the beginning.
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Re: What do the Yanks have that the CNG needs?

Postby miltiades » Sun Nov 29, 2015 1:07 pm

What we need more in Cyprus is a comprehensive solution that will ultimately lead to withdrawal of the Turkish troops.

First we must neutralize the T/Cs need for protection by the T/A. They, the T/Cs must be convinced that their future is in a united Cyprus that they must embrace as their only true and natural motherland. Of course we too must do the same.
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Re: What do the Yanks have that the CNG needs?

Postby GreekIslandGirl » Sun Nov 29, 2015 1:20 pm

miltiades wrote:What we need more in Cyprus is a comprehensive solution that will ultimately lead to withdrawal of the Turkish troops.

First we must neutralize the T/Cs need for protection by the T/A. They, the T/Cs must be convinced that their future is in a united Cyprus that they must embrace as their only true and natural motherland. Of course we too must do the same.


The TCs will be used as human shields by Turkey and so we should pre-empt this loss and say goodbye to any nice ones we know. :P
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Re: What do the Yanks have that the CNG needs?

Postby Paphitis » Sun Nov 29, 2015 3:25 pm

Nikitas wrote:Before you get an air force is it not wise to develop anti aircraft means to defend the airfields where the planes are parked?

I recall reading that in the 1973 Arab Israely war, most aircraft losses were not to sophisticated SAM systems or other planes, but to the the "dumb" 30mm cannon that put a lot of metal up ahead of fast planes.

In addition to the air thing that seems to give people the flutters it might be useful to shop for some smart munitions capable of being used in existing artillery, like the Strix anti armor mortars etc. And also some land based torpedo systems that can reach out beyond the 12 mile limit and prevent any blockade of the island.

An old general told me that defence capability is like an onion, multi layered and is built from the inside out, you start with the defence of the perimeter and build outwards. That was the lesson ignored with the S300, we went for the outermost layer of the onion, did not have the means to defend the base for the S300 and lost the plot.

Though where they are now they provide an umbrella that covers the vital area between Cyprus and Crete and most of the Aegean. I wonder if that was not the plan from the beginning.


The S300 was a great Air Defence Sustem and still is although the S400 is better. The S300 is probably on par with the American Patriot which is fantastic but the Russians are a little better at Air Defence than the Americans. The Americans don't see the value in investing as much in Air Defence because they don't believe that their Airfields are that much under threat to the point where they can't get their planes in the air. They also have hundreds of landing options. To a smaller European country, like Cyprus, Air Defence is very important.

Cyprus has the TOR and BUK and should have had the S300 too. They are important because you need to protect Paphos Airport, Larnaca perhaps and Lakatamia.

But still, Cyprus will need to presume that Paphos Airport will be destroyed within minutes. The TAF will throw everything at it. So what can be done? Several things such as:

1) Highway Landing areas. Sweden is the expert at this. You can even build hangars in mountains and store fuel as well as munitions there.
2) base the fighters in Crete where an F-18F will easily be able to fly to Cyprus, loiter for about an hour, hit targets on the ground and engage threats in the air and have enough fuel to return back to Crete.

The mere fact that Cyprus will have this capability is an enormous deterrent to Turkey as Turkey will not automatically control the skies.

Now if they collaborate with the HAF or someone else and had air to air refueling, then the fighters are able to loiter for 3 to 4 hours.

But if it is a big issue, then maybe some Patriots would be invaluable too.

Cyprus already has some highway ALA so all it has to do is make sure it has a few locations it can utilize with bunker space, shitloads of fuel and weapons storage.

Turkey would be furious if Cyprus had these capabilities.
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Re: What do the Yanks have that the CNG needs?

Postby Paphitis » Sun Nov 29, 2015 3:35 pm

As with anything collaboration is key as a force multiplier.

Everyone collaborates, even fairly strong countries like France, UK, Australia and Canada. You never see any one of these countries deploy on their own. Everyday, they refuel of each other and even piggy back AWACS or AEW.

So for Cyprus, I would say that Israel is someone we will need to completely integrate with and ensure that the IDF and CNG are able to operate effectively together.

Greece might be another.

So the fighters will need to have joint exercises with Israel on a regular basis. But why will Israel want to help. Well if it has common interests it will. If not, then you're all alone.
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