Cyprus-Forum.com

[Paphitis]

I'm sorry but the inaccuracies that have been listed here are way off. Entertaining, but way off.

On the thread generally or just the links above? If you have knowledge I and others don't have why not share it?

No collateral taken into account in the banks books? How do you think their Core tier 1 ratio is calculated if there are no risk weighted assets?

loans created with no capital??? A banks loan to deposit ratio is critical in understanding the condition of a bank. Why would that even be necessary if loans moved independent of deposits?

I'm not sure where to start....it's pretty much all wrong.

g

Am I correct in thinking a lot is covered in Basel II and/or Basel III, in particular risk weighted loans to capital ratios where the ratio has got to be above a limit, the bigger the percent the more capital it has relative to the loans, so theortically bankers cannot keep creating money?

Problem is, he will just say that Bankers don't now how Banking works or how they create money which is not really creating money when you break it down. They are creating debts or IOUs which can be used as money for as long the Banking system can support it all. If they go too far and can't support it, they collapse and I am sure the Banks don't want that. It's quite a intricate system which has its own checks and balances. When you think about it, you can only marvel at the Financial System because overall it is very robust, highly regulated, professional and it all works very well!

[Robin Hood]

Paphitis:

Say bye bye now dude.

All your theories and false narratives are about to be destroyed by a Back Room Financial expert and Banking consultant!

You're fucked now you acrimonious bitter shit!

I hope you learn from this! Because we don't need hundreds of anti Banking threads that you're renowned for.

Seems to me that you have a personal vendetta.

Before you can cook fancy vegetable dishes ............ you need to grow the vegetables first! The rules governing each segment of the whole process are different, you do not mix-n-match. They are separate issues.

Banking is no different; the commodity they run their business on has to be created. I have yet to see packets of seeds to grow your own ‘money tree’, so there must be another way of growing (creating) it? The Bank of England describes the method for those with interest who maybe are not too interested in the finest detail. You obviously cannot read bar charts or comprehend what the BoE 2014 MPC bulletin explained. Werner describes it in a point-to-point manner in great detail, including economic history, and backs his opinion with verifiable evidence but that would certainly be way above your level of understanding.

Once again I refuse to come down to your level and resort to disrespecting another member. I can tolerate your ignorance and misconceptions, but it does not deserve either consideration or a reply because it is all ill-informed garbage............ says the BoE et al!

Yes, I post on money creation because it is something I know about. You will note I do not comment on the Cyprus problem, football or brain surgery because I know nothing about the subjects. As advised before, I don’t talk about things I have no knowledge of and cannot back with credible facts from reliable sources, not just my opinion.

DT: If you are indeed what Paphitis says you are, I look forward to hearing your point of view, just don’t sink to his low level ........... please.

BTW Paphitis,: I thought you were not speaking to me?

[Paphitis]

Right now, the entire world has a buffet and it is up to every individual to eat healthily and be responsible for their health and well being.

Everyone has free choice in an open and transparent market. And the sky is the limit. Some people will soar, others will just cruise and others will get Diabetes and crash.

Oh yes, and since when were you ever interested in an open discussion? Never! You just stoop to the gutter with insults and then you start to troll anyone who has the audacity to not swallow your absolute nonsense. You are the individual who supports Assad and Pootin after all and recently you said that no democracy is perfect when comparing the USA to Syria. Well yes, no democracy is perfect, not even the USA but the USA still has a Bill of Rights, freedoms for all regardless of color, race or religious creed. It has a free press as well. A free press does not exist in Russia. And the freedoms I speak of which exist in the USA do not exist in Syria. So no, Syria is no democracy if you're a Sunni or a Christian. And Assad is an alleged of committing War Crimes. He will answer these allegations. It's inevitable. No one escapes, except through death!

But nevertheless, your idiotic views are on display and DT is going to absolutely destroy the myths you propagate.

And no, I think it is important we put your fixations with the Banks to bed. For your own good! I am really concerned for your sanity.

[miltiades]

" and others will get Diabetes and crash"

I have been a diabetic for almost twenty years, was diagnosed at the age of 52. Still going strong and managing diabetes. My older brother now almost 77 years old has been a diabetic for almost 40 years, we are both still working and both in good health otherwise.

Diabetes can be well managed not only by medication but by careful choice of foods, exercise and a love of life.

In my case, unlike my brother who just does not care, he brushes diabetes aside as he injects insulin, I do my own research into the decease and have memorised the glycaemic value of every single food.

By the way, the best exercise is ....sex!! It is said that if a diabetic indulges in the finer things of life, ie sex on a regular basis . once a day is just fine, he or she will keep diabetes at bay.

As for the subject of this thread as an accountant, not practiced for more than 40 years, may I just say that in the real world, real everyday money does exist, it not only exist but it screams . You may not be able to deposit IOUs in a bank, or time for that matter ( time is money) but you can deposit real money, you can purchase anything that your heart desires, including fine wines, with real money, CASH .

Cash IS King, assets can be converted into real cash or used as collateral in borrowing cash. It is a fallacy to dismiss cash as merely paper money, cash is real, it exists the world over where you no longer have to carry a sack of ...salt, or a burrow of gold and other commodities. Yes folks, Cash is real, try getting an airline ticket to Paradise Island without cash, no fricking way.

May I just add that on my recent trip to PI , I was recovering from a horrid bout of flue accompanied by constant diarrhoea that contributed to a loss of weight and appetite, a few days in PI and I soon became a ...tiger

[Paphitis]

People who are going strong are those who have a high pain threshold. You know, the one's who are able to ignore pain and go through the barrier. It's all mental and I don't think you're going strong. You may think you are but I doubt that you really are. It's the same with finance. Those who work hard, sacrifice and go through the pain barrier will soar.

And when you go through those barriers, you can go up to the buffet and almost eat whatever you want within reason. There are always limitations.

Milti, do look after yourself. Your body is your biggest asset. If you don't have your health, you got nothing.

I am what you would call a NAZI when it comes to eating very well and exercise. I have always been fit, pretty much to an elite level, except for a period where I let myself slumber into some laziness, but I managed to get my fitness back now with body fat of about 15% and declining. I don't drink either. Almost nothing at all! I mean pretty much zilch!

The point is, we all have choices. We are all responsible for the choices we make. Banks are not there to make choices for us. However, they are regulated to follow consumer protection laws to protect the most vulnerable but you can never legislate enough for people who are complete idiots.

That is what I have been saying btw. Everyone's time and Labour is worth something, services, property, business, commodities, shares, cars, boats and whatever else. And virtually everything can be used to apply for credit. A Bank is willing to give you credit if you satisfy the criteria.

[miltiades]

Yes I do take care of my self. I'm not obsessive but I keep fit, eat healthily, drink wine 7 days a week and I work 6 days a week starting at 6.30am and finishing at 5 pm.

Having a young wife does influence my thinking of my self in that I take more personal care with appearance, hygiene etc, although I have steadfastly refused to die my ....hair which is brilliant white and rather short. I dress as I always did, casual mostly and rather conservative.

Some men, and women too, tend to grow old and hating it, in my case I'm very content with my age, never hide it or try and make my self look younger. When recently in Cyprus I went for a haircut at my usual barber, I expressed, jokingly, surprise that the cuttings of my hair were brilliant white, shall I put some colour he asked, yes I said adding do my finger nails too!!

Life is but a short stay on earth, you can extend it greatly by embracing the things you mostly love, starting with family, children. grandchildren, a ....young woman and of course an abundance of red clarets!

You should also be able to laugh at your self, I do so each morning when I take a shower !!

[DT.]

Paphitis:

Say bye bye now dude.

All your theories and false narratives are about to be destroyed by a Back Room Financial expert and Banking consultant!

You're fucked now you acrimonious bitter shit!

I hope you learn from this! Because we don't need hundreds of anti Banking threads that you're renowned for.

Seems to me that you have a personal vendetta.

Before you can cook fancy vegetable dishes ............ you need to grow the vegetables first! The rules governing each segment of the whole process are different, you do not mix-n-match. They are separate issues.

Banking is no different; the commodity they run their business on has to be created. I have yet to see packets of seeds to grow your own ‘money tree’, so there must be another way of growing (creating) it? The Bank of England describes the method for those with interest who maybe are not too interested in the finest detail. You obviously cannot read bar charts or comprehend what the BoE 2014 MPC bulletin explained. Werner describes it in a point-to-point manner in great detail, including economic history, and backs his opinion with verifiable evidence but that would certainly be way above your level of understanding.

Once again I refuse to come down to your level and resort to disrespecting another member. I can tolerate your ignorance and misconceptions, but it does not deserve either consideration or a reply because it is all ill-informed garbage............ says the BoE et al!

Yes, I post on money creation because it is something I know about. You will note I do not comment on the Cyprus problem, football or brain surgery because I know nothing about the subjects. As advised before, I don’t talk about things I have no knowledge of and cannot back with credible facts from reliable sources, not just my opinion.

DT: If you are indeed what Paphitis says you are, I look forward to hearing your point of view, just don’t sink to his low level ........... please.

BTW Paphitis,: I thought you were not speaking to me?

Hi RH, Just so I get this straight are you saying that banks are free to issue as much debt as they wish regardless of liquidity?

[Pyrpolizer]

Hi RH, Just so I get this straight are you saying that banks are free to issue as much debt as they wish regardless of liquidity?

While waiting for RH to reply could you please tell me what was the liquidity of CY Banks in Dec 214 considering that:
deposits reached €46,1 billion in December 2014.
loans reached €61,6 billion in December 2014.
http://www.centralbank.gov.cy/nqcontent ... 13&lang=en

[DT.]

Hi RH, Just so I get this straight are you saying that banks are free to issue as much debt as they wish regardless of liquidity?

While waiting for RH to reply could you please tell me what was the liquidity of CY Banks in Dec 214 considering that:
deposits reached €46,1 billion in December 2014.
loans reached €61,6 billion in December 2014.
http://www.centralbank.gov.cy/nqcontent ... 13&lang=en

Negative liquidity.

There was a 10bn haircut on deposits in 2013 and withdrawals of another 10bn out of the system if you recall.

Banks such as NBG CY that has negative liquidity fund it by gaurantees from the parent in Greece.

[Robin Hood]

Paphitis:

Say bye bye now dude.

All your theories and false narratives are about to be destroyed by a Back Room Financial expert and Banking consultant!

You're fucked now you acrimonious bitter shit!

I hope you learn from this! Because we don't need hundreds of anti Banking threads that you're renowned for.

Seems to me that you have a personal vendetta.

Before you can cook fancy vegetable dishes ............ you need to grow the vegetables first! The rules governing each segment of the whole process are different, you do not mix-n-match. They are separate issues.

Banking is no different; the commodity they run their business on has to be created. I have yet to see packets of seeds to grow your own ‘money tree’, so there must be another way of growing (creating) it? The Bank of England describes the method for those with interest who maybe are not too interested in the finest detail. You obviously cannot read bar charts or comprehend what the BoE 2014 MPC bulletin explained. Werner describes it in a point-to-point manner in great detail, including economic history, and backs his opinion with verifiable evidence but that would certainly be way above your level of understanding.

Once again I refuse to come down to your level and resort to disrespecting another member. I can tolerate your ignorance and misconceptions, but it does not deserve either consideration or a reply because it is all ill-informed garbage............ says the BoE et al!

Yes, I post on money creation because it is something I know about. You will note I do not comment on the Cyprus problem, football or brain surgery because I know nothing about the subjects. As advised before, I don’t talk about things I have no knowledge of and cannot back with credible facts from reliable sources, not just my opinion.

DT: If you are indeed what Paphitis says you are, I look forward to hearing your point of view, just don’t sink to his low level ........... please.

BTW Paphitis,: I thought you were not speaking to me?

Hi RH, Just so I get this straight are you saying that banks are free to issue as much debt as they wish regardless of liquidity?

No absolutely not! There are controls in place that prevent that, like the ratio between loans and reserves.I don't think I have said or implied that? What interests me is that point in the BoE bar chart where a white 'loan' appears and a corresponding red 'deposit'. That bit of BoE information alone shows that the bank has no liability to repay. To me and to BoE and Werner that says that the money just appeared ..... but from where?

Your initial comment was related to a banking operation that occurred AFTER the loan was in place.

On page 31 I posted, more for Paphitis benefit than anything else, the sequence of that process from the loan application up to that point a debt was created, based on both those sources. So unless you can find an error (who knows?) that sequence of events to me explains that process. What happens after that point is the banks doing what banks do and accountants doing what they do ..... to me a sort of accounting acrobatics.

I added the repayment cycle also. As the BoE says repayment of the loan to the bank destroys the new money created when the loan came onto the borrowers account, having previously lodged in another account.

As I see it, how this money was created makes very little difference to the banking operation regarding private loans. NOTHING changes .... only the source. The BoE have managed to do this with printed notes for something approaching 170 years , the last 45 with no collateral back-up except for the states assets. (And who's going to sue the State?) IMO: The Banking Act of 1844 should have prevented the banks from creating currency/money in any form. I think now is the time the act should be revised to include ALL creation of currency!

The benefits of the State's independent bank creating money free of debt and interest very obviously has overwhelming benefits.