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Brexit ..... The Movie

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Re: Brexit ..... The Movie

Postby Paphitis » Thu May 19, 2016 11:58 am

Tim Drayton wrote:
Paphitis wrote:At least the Brits will have their say. Puts the issue to bed once and for all.

If I was a voter I would vote for BREXIT. I think it is extremely powerful to have your own currency and Central Bank able to manipulate its own fiscal policies and the value of its own currency as well as inflation.

All EU countries like Cyprus and Greece don't have these luxuries and they paid the price for that!

Put it this way! If Australia was in Europe, would I want Australia to join the EU?

The answer to that is an emphatic NO FRIGGIN WAY! Not in a million years! No way would I want another layer of Government telling me what I can and can't do.

Can't see any benefits of being in the EU. Only disadvantages!


In the first place, the UK DOES have its own currency (it's called the pound) and its own independent central bank, and as a member state prior to the introduction of the euro, is not obliged to adopt the latter, so that is a non-issue.

As to the analogy with Australia, I think a more appropriate way of looking at things, given that Australia (area 7 692 024 km2) covers an area about three-quarters that of Europe (area 10 180 000 km2), would be to ask whether Australia is better off as a federation with a strong central government, uniform rules and regulations, a single currency and free movement of goods and people across the entire continent, or would it be better off as seven constantly squabbling independent states that go to war with one another from time to time, have different fluctuating currencies and are separated by barbed wire border fences with crossing points where there are passport and customs checks. Is it better for a businessman in Brisbane who wants to sell goods to a customer in Perth to be able to do the deal in the same currency and subject to the same legal system and to be able to transport the goods without having to pay customs duty and knowing that the lorry will not be stuck for hours or even days while waiting to cross national borders? I think so. For the same reason, we are better off in a Europe that is united and at peace where free trade and movement is possible.


Tim,

I can see the day when Britain will be blackmailed. I see big dangers with this single currency.

My analogy is correct. Australia is a Federated Country, much like Germany is I guess. I would sincerely hate it if Australia were to join something like the EU. I want to see small Government and countries like Australia already have BIG Government because of the sheer size of the country. We have a Federal Government, and on top of that we have 6 State Governments and 2 Territory Governments, hundreds of Councils and so on. Can you imagine the cost of running this BIG State apparatus.

Then we have, 8 jurisdictions, 6 State Police Departments, 1 Territory Police Department and the Federal Police. Each jurisdiction is different and Police can't cross State Lines.

The last thing I would want is having another layer of Bureaucracy! It would be madness!
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Re: Brexit ..... The Movie

Postby Paphitis » Thu May 19, 2016 12:01 pm

Tim Drayton wrote:Believe it or not, there is seriously a movement calling for independence for Western Australia. See, for instance:

https://www.buzzfeed.com/alexlee/big-st ... lfWVEOwXe3


That's not gonna happen. There is always a small element who make that claim whenever the Federal Tax mix is being cut up for the States, but it quickly dies down.

It's not serious at all. In addition, a referendum is required and they will be lucky to get 3% support for it.

I am not sure if you are aware, but the States are highly independent as it is. They run their own Health Systems, Education Systems, Police and Judicial System. They even have their own Governments and Parliaments.

We have 9 Parliaments and 9 Senates! We have 9 Police Forces, 9 Education Systems, 9 Health Systems and so on. It could be worse. The USA has 52 of everything!

We have 1 politicians for every 2,000 people. :lol:
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Re: Brexit ..... The Movie

Postby supporttheunderdog » Thu May 19, 2016 2:54 pm

Looks like we have about 1 wanabee for the House for about 1000 voters...
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Re: Brexit ..... The Movie

Postby Robin Hood » Thu May 19, 2016 3:30 pm

TD:
In the first place, the UK DOES have its own currency (it's called the pound) and its own independent central bank, and as a member state prior to the introduction of the euro, is not obliged to adopt the latter, so that is a non-issue.

I would not consider the Central Bank (BoE) to be independent. It is part of the banking system and is ‘controlled’ by commercial banking interests not independently owned by the people i.e. government. The pound is also an internationally traded reserve currency which puts it ‘at risk’ to market forces. The Brits do not have control of its value, but of course the same applies to all reserve currencies ..... they can be attacked, which is why control of the system is essential to the Worlds only Super power whose banks dominate the global banking system......... the USA.

If you look at any large land mass it is broken down into smaller parcels and can be called Provinces, Counties, regions etc and each with its own local government. That applies to the US, Russia, China, Europe, Australia etc. and each geo-defined area has its own form of local administration but is applied to matters that are usually related to each individual geographical entity, but internally. When you get a central government that is a layer of administration over several smaller administrations, where collective policies are applied, it has to be considered as Federal, at least in form. One tune .... one conductor?

IMO: I don’t think what they have in the US is healthy as you have some 50 odd smaller administrations but a single seat of international political and military power. They are the political/military equivalent of ‘too-bid-to-fail’ banks, as the smaller entities have insufficient control over what their central government does to affect their international influence/interference. A single or even a few dissenting voices can be squashed by the sheer weight of influences the majority can exert. That now happens on the grand scale ..... one power attempts to overrule all others. Because of this, I believe this should be avoided at all costs in Europe as it is already becoming an extension of the US global sphere of influence and is why I believe Obama came to the UK to carry the message to Cameron that the UK WILL remain in the EU ........... primarily for the benefit of the US.

The problem I see for the UK is that it has an economy which is dominated by banking and financial interests. It is almost a one-horse economy.

I saw this growing in the mid 80’s when, as an engineer I found myself redundant after some 12 years with the same company. Much of my time was spent in Europe on company plants, so I was no novice to working away from home. When I started looking there were very few jobs in the UK in the wealth creating industries, to be had. I had to follow the work to survive, the UK Govt. didn’t help as they would not allow people whose jobs were transitory (say 6-18 months) to get tax relief on travel and subsistence costs of working around the country to obtain work. Unfortunately, Mr. Tebbit’s advice to get on your bike to find a job was OK in theory, but they taxed you on your bike! All the jobs that were available were those in the greatly expanding financial sector and these were not wealth creating .... something Mrs. Thatcher managed to over look. So I reluctantly went abroad to work. I never returned to the UK to work.

The UK economy is now very much dependent of the financial sector for its survival. In spite of comments here to the contrary, things are not all hunky-dory in the global financial and banking system.

The fact that the financial system is based primarily on computer transactions, that happen very quickly and over a global net work, it would not be too difficult, for instance, for the Germans and the French to take that dominance away from the City of London. If this was backed by a major power with whom we supposedly had a ‘special’ relationship, the UK would be finished and simply an historical has been, in all spheres of influence.

The economy in the UK is about as secure as the shell of an egg! The UK has very little industry left and would be unable to even remotely counter an attack on its financial/banking sector. The alternative for the UK is to change how the banking and financial system works and greatly reduce its influence on the real economy. This has been recognised by many politicians ...... even Trump, but that is a taboo subject, not only on the forum but in the international political/diplomatic sphere of influence.

I still believe the UK will stay in the EU even if it means fiddling the result of the referendum ..... but either way, the UK and eventually Europe is in for a very rough few years ..... maybe even globally.


Australia is already greatly under the influence of the US and will follow the US no matter what as a de facto member of the US/NATO alliance. It also has an economy that is greatly dependent on a single source of income. Natural resources, that it sells mainly to China. If the Chinese/Asean economy collapses, this will have a great effect on the Australian economy. Although it is nothing like the degree of dominance the financial/banking system has on the UK economy ........ as the Australians do have other goods to export!
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Re: Brexit ..... The Movie

Postby Paphitis » Thu May 19, 2016 4:36 pm

I would suggest people ignore the troll!

Firstly, Federations are a great form of Government and the Australian Federation is a fantastic form of Administration. The Apparatus is however, expensive to maintain. The EU is an oversized version of it. And not all States will be equal. Although, Britain will have a great deal of influence in the EU, others like Greece and Cyprus won't.

As I told everyone before, everything gets changed to Banking. Robin Hood is on a crusade. He only wants the destruction of Banking Institutions, NATO, EU, Britain, Australia, USA and all their allies.

I don't advocate for mayhem and economic obliteration of Britain and or the world. We are all allies, friends and the USA has no control of the EU, anymore than it does Britain or Australia. We are however in it together and we all support each other for the greater good and to preserve our own interests.

Britain has its opportunity to have its say. There will be no train wreck after whether Britain stays or exits the EU. Life and the economy will continue in much the same way as now.

But the Brits will decide on whether they support the EU nor not! Personally I don't! I don't trust them. The EU is about Germany and maybe another 3 or 4 countries one of which is Britain. It is not about any of the other members who are just the dead wood on the bandwagon. It isn't a Union at all. Look at what has happened to Greece in terms of the economic crisis and the illegal migrations from the East!

As a result, I think the EU is on its final legs anyway. Unless the EU changes, it is doomed!
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Re: Brexit ..... The Movie

Postby kurupetos » Thu May 19, 2016 4:38 pm

'Movie' or 'move out'? :lol:
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Re: Brexit ..... The Movie

Postby Paphitis » Thu May 19, 2016 4:56 pm

End of the day we are all one family of Nations which believe in the same values. From all the EU Nations, to NATO, to ANZUS, USA, Canada, NZ, Australia, Singapore, South Korea, Japan and others.

We are powerful, we stick together, support each other and all generally pull in the same direction.

Our Banking Institutions are important. Britain has its own currency and Central Bank. I think this is vitally important. Greece and Cyprus abandoning their's has been proven to be a great mistake. Both have lost their sovereignty! They are no longer free or independent or autonomous no matter if they think they are. They are now little puppet clients.

Britain isn't a puppet. It is a big economy that has power and influence no matter what direction it takes. Yes Britain is still a great power whether anyone likes it or not. I like it because Britain is a friendly country. If Britain is strong, we are strong. The USA is stronger, NATO is stronger. Australia is stronger and so on. The West's power is in our combined collective. Which is why we will always be at the forefront driving the global economy and militarily like no other. No one can threaten us! We are stronger than China and Russia and this will never change. I think this upsets Robin Hood. Not me!

No matter what the Brits decide, it will enjoy all the support, trade and investment from all its global friends. They can rely on it.

The Banks in the UK are doing just fine! The BoE are doing a fantastic job at setting British fiscal policy for its own purposes. Something other EU countries can't do!
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Re: Brexit ..... The Movie

Postby Robin Hood » Thu May 19, 2016 6:09 pm

Paphitis wrote:I would suggest people ignore the troll!

Firstly, Federations are a great form of Government and the Australian Federation is a fantastic form of Administration. The Apparatus is however, expensive to maintain. The EU is an oversized version of it. And not all States will be equal. Although, Britain will have a great deal of influence in the EU, others like Greece and Cyprus won't.

As I told everyone before, everything gets changed to Banking. Robin Hood is on a crusade. He only wants the destruction of Banking Institutions, NATO, EU, Britain, Australia, USA and all their allies.
I don't advocate for mayhem and economic obliteration of Britain and or the world. We are all allies, friends and the USA has no control of the EU, anymore than it does Britain or Australia. We are however in it together and we all support each other for the greater good and to preserve our own interests.

Britain has its opportunity to have its say. There will be no train wreck after whether Britain stays or exits the EU. Life and the economy will continue in much the same way as now.

But the Brits will decide on whether they support the EU nor not! Personally I don't! I don't trust them. The EU is about Germany and maybe another 3 or 4 countries one of which is Britain. It is not about any of the other members who are just the dead wood on the bandwagon. It isn't a Union at all. Look at what has happened to Greece in terms of the economic crisis and the illegal migrations from the East!

As a result, I think the EU is on its final legs anyway. Unless the EU changes, it is doomed!


Ignorance is bliss ..... you talk mainly rubbish!

So, you now direct every one else on what they should think? I think most have more intelligence than to follow your instructions as to which opinions they should agree or disagree with. I am sure most of those on the forum see these comments (highlighted) as a joke! You demonstrate on almost every post just how childish and ill-informed you are. You spout one single philosophy ........... your own arrogant and LOUD opinion. Change the record and grow up!

At least my comments are based on knowledge rather than conceited bravado! It would be impossible to guess at the effect of the UK staying in or leaving the EU without including the banking sector ....... it IS the mainstay of the UK's economy ..........but of course you wouldn't be aware of that. :roll:
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Re: Brexit ..... The Movie

Postby Tim Drayton » Thu May 19, 2016 6:10 pm

Meanwhile, the odds on a vote to stay in have hardened to 1/5 - 1/6! It is as though some people know something that the rest of us don't.

See: http://www.oddschecker.com/politics/bri ... hip-result
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Re: Brexit ..... The Movie

Postby Robin Hood » Thu May 19, 2016 6:17 pm

Paphitis wrote:End of the day we are all one family of Nations which believe in the same values. From all the EU Nations, to NATO, to ANZUS, USA, Canada, NZ, Australia, Singapore, South Korea, Japan and others.

We are powerful, we stick together, support each other and all generally pull in the same direction.

Our Banking Institutions are important. Britain has its own currency and Central Bank. I think this is vitally important. Greece and Cyprus abandoning their's has been proven to be a great mistake. Both have lost their sovereignty! They are no longer free or independent or autonomous no matter if they think they are. They are now little puppet clients.

Britain isn't a puppet. It is a big economy that has power and influence no matter what direction it takes. Yes Britain is still a great power whether anyone likes it or not. I like it because Britain is a friendly country. If Britain is strong, we are strong. The USA is stronger, NATO is stronger. Australia is stronger and so on. The West's power is in our combined collective. Which is why we will always be at the forefront driving the global economy and militarily like no other. No one can threaten us! We are stronger than China and Russia and this will never change. I think this upsets Robin Hood. Not me!

No matter what the Brits decide, it will enjoy all the support, trade and investment from all its global friends. They can rely on it.

The Banks in the UK are doing just fine! The BoE are doing a fantastic job at setting British fiscal policy for its own purposes. Something other EU countries can't do!


In your opinion? More self opinionated boastful propaganda .... Paphitis style! What a load of cobblers! Have you any idea what a clown this sort of post makes you look? :lol: :lol: :lol:
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