Cyprus-Forum.com

[Lordo]

what gcs are only 7.3 greak. now theres a turn up for the books.

You are 100% idiot.

which bit of you is greak boy your anus?

[Sotos]

The argument of Stud, GR, Lordo etc is that Greek-Cypriots are not Greek and it is the false logic of that argument which I attacked.

Either GC in Cyprus share a greater dna commonality with those in Greece, than they do with either TC or others in other areas or they do not. If they do not, and really personally I could not care less either way, then dna wise it seems to me that claims that GC are genetically Greek, that they are descendants of Greeks and genetically no different from mainland Greeks, would seem to be undermined by such information ?

What does "genetically Greek" mean? The DNA varies from person to person and the averages are different from region to region of the same nation. Cyprus doesn't have any huge differences with mainland Greece. Sardinia has far greater differences with mainland Italy and so does Corsica with mainland France. Sicily is close to South Italy but very different from north Italy. The how close our DNA is with TCs is also irrelevant. Our problems and conflicts were not caused by DNA differences!

Earlier you responded to me and claimed "I do not recall STUD ever saying that DNA should determine who can or should be a member of given nation?", but you are wrong. That is EXACTLY what they believe (selectively, just for Cyprus) and what they are trying to argue for.

Well that is not my perception of what stud has said but if you can be arsed to give a quote / link of where stud has said something that shows this is what he believes / is saying, I will certainly read it and review my view as appropriate.

I think it is pretty clear what they are saying, but in any case they are reading these posts so they can clarify their position themselves.

[erolz66]

What does "genetically Greek" mean?

As I have said this is not a subject in which I have much personal interest to be honest. What I mean by 'genetically Greek' is to what degree does someone descend from ancient Greeks. I assume location wise the group that today most, on average, descends from ancient Greek forebears, is somewhere in Greece, though that is an assumption only.

[GreekIslandGirl]

On the whole, autosomal and haplotype DNA studies do confirm the (unrevised) history books. Be it our migration out of Africa, through the middle East and via Cyprus/Crete/Aegean into Europe and then circumnavigating around Europe back down to Cyprus through Greece/Sicily (and other later Hellenic outposts) to introduce the rich European mixtures or fingerprinting individuals without any other information and being able to locate them via their autosomal DNA to a specific European country/countries! Lovely stuff.

[Get Real!]

Greeks and Turks (TCs included) have a lot more in common (DNA wise) than Greeks with Cypriots.

Cypriots are Middle Easterners as I have always known/believed and as the PLOS genetics studies below have conclusively proven.

http://journals.plos.org/plosgenetics/a ... en.1003316

Now, if Sotos has “picked up formatting” from elsewhere that’s *his* problem because the vast majority on this island are EXACTLY what the PLOS genetics studies prove.

End of story!

[Get Real!]

Not even contemporary "Greeks" have any linkage with the so-called “ancient Greeks” these fools claim to be related to, let alone Cypriots!

When Greece was created in the early 1800s, they took 2 million Ottoman turncoats and two million mixed regional people (Bulgarians, Slavs, Gypsies, Albanians, etc) and invented a nation!

They then set about to form an IDENTITY by pinching myths and garbage from the region which they put together to give their bastardized kids some value. Or so they thought…

[Get Real!]

Oracle, even though I’ve known you for 10 odd years I’ve kept a horrible “secret” from you because I didn’t want to hurt your feelings but the truth is you’re the biggest BASTARD in Europe.

Your DNA is a cocktail of Albanian + Turk + Bulgarian + Gypsy + Slav.

In other words girl, you are a BALKAN.

*That* is your true ethnicity, *that* is your origin, *that* is your makeup and you need to acknowledge and accept that. Now deal with it!

[GreekIslandGirl]

Oracle, even though I’ve known you for 10 odd years I’ve kept a horrible “secret” from you because I didn’t want to hurt your feelings but the truth is you’re the biggest BASTARD in Europe.

Your DNA is a cocktail of Albanian + Turk + Bulgarian + Gypsy + Slav.

In other words girl, you are a BALKAN.

*That* is your true ethnicity, *that* is your origin, *that* is your makeup and you need to acknowledge and accept that. Now deal with it!

If I am "Balkan" then so are 85% of Cypriots! However, it's zero percent Turk/Albanian/Gypsy/Slav here!

- The difference between me and you GR! is that I deal in facts and you deal in confabulations!

[GreekIslandGirl]

Greeks and Turks (TCs included) have a lot more in common (DNA wise) than Greeks with Cypriots.!

Really? Which computer game did you get this off? JackassGetReal!?

[supporttheunderdog]

You are doing your usual trick of trying to lie about what a report says or rather does not say with your visual selective quoting and distortion.

It was a direct quote that was the completion of the statement you truncated. Why are you hissing now?

Please be warned that each and every time you try to claim something

I'm not claiming anything. I quoted what was in your report that you left out.

Further I will point out that if 80% of the whole is Anatolian or Levantine it follows that 87% of a part cannot represent 87% of the whole as you claim,

" ....the actual Greek contribution stood out for the Cypriot E-V13 (87 %), J2a-M67 (74 %), R1b-M269 (48 %), and G-P15 (17 %) components."

I didn't make any numbers up. Do those components add up to 100% ? Those were in the report and it proves you don't know how the distributions are represented. Pack up now, idiot!

You are the idiot as the contributions do not add up to 100%, but more, and that shows the fallacy of your argument. Below is the full paragraph from which you have selectively quoted, ignoring the bits, highlighted, you do not like, cherry picking what you find are attractive numbers and putting your own interpretation on certain points which you wish proved your pet theorem, but which in the first line plainly sets out the position .

As it plainly says E-V13 is only 7.3% of the whole

Ancestry of male Cypriot lineages
Comparing the entire set of Y-chromosome haplogroups with those from regional populations surrounding Cyprus revealed a high Anatolian influence (mY = 66 %), followed by the Levant (mY = 24 %) then the Balkan regions (mY = 13 %, Table 2). A putative Roman contribution to Cyprus using data from Italy and Sicily [32] also showed negative values of mY (data not shown). A closer look at specific proxy lineages permitted us to dissect these results further (Table 2). Anatolia would have generated up to 83 % to the Cypriot G-P15 and up to a quarter (range, 22–25 %) of Cypriot J2a-M67, J2b-M12, and R1b-M269 related lineages. Danube Balkans would have provided most of the Cypriot J2b-M12 (67 %) and all Cypriot I2-M423 (99 %). Although, when using the entire set of Y-chromosome haplogroup frequencies, the composition of Cyprus can be explained by contributions from Anatolia, Balkans, and Levant, the actual Greek contribution stood out for the Cypriot E-V13 (87 %), J2a-M67 (74 %), R1b-M269 (48 %), and G-P15 (17 %) components. Lastly, Levant contributed up to 30 % of the Cypriot R1b-M269 and to a lesser extent regarding the Cypriot J lineages (3–8 %).

We are in fact back into serious deficiency type arguements where once sgin you are ignoring what the report plainly says, ie.

Comparing the entire set of Y-chromosome haplogroups with those from regional populations surrounding Cyprus revealed a high Anatolian influence (mY = 66 %), followed by the Levant (mY = 24 %) then the Balkan regions

No mention of Greece's contribution, but where Greece is distinguished from other areas and where they were looking for a Greek contribution one must ask why?

I would incidentally point out that Professor Deltas has stated elsewhere that there is little to genetically distinguish Pre 1974 Turkish Speaking Cypriots from Greek Speaking Cypriots, that this was likely through conversion to Islam and adoption of Turkish language (for tax reasons?) of Greek Speaking Cypriots and if so to me that too makes them Cypriot natives, not Ottoman remnants to be evicted.