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IN MEMORY OF 9/11 VICTIMS 15 YEARS ON.

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Re: IN MEMORY OF 9/11 VICTIMS 15 YEARS ON.

Postby Paphitis » Thu Sep 15, 2016 4:43 am

Lordo wrote:the yanks have just anounced they wil give 38 billion dollars in aid to israel. how legal is that considering the yanks have a law that prohibits giving of aid to a country that has neuclear weapons.


That is military aid and it will be given over a period of 10 years.

It is very legal.

Greece and Turkey have received much more aid throughout the 50s, 69s, 70s, 80s and 90s.

They use to just handover ships and fighters for nothing under the FRAM1, 2 and 3 programs.
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Re: IN MEMORY OF 9/11 VICTIMS 15 YEARS ON.

Postby Paphitis » Thu Sep 15, 2016 4:55 am

Kikapu wrote:
B25 wrote:I rest my case.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0ptvvbaR0-U

US BS eaters just carry on and swallow all you can.


I'm sorry B25 but, ALL the buildings were "controlled demolishing", including WTC7, EXCEPT for the Twin Towers, and your video proves it despite what the voice says. When "controlled demolishing" takes place, the buildings collapse from ground up. When it's not "controlled demolishing" like the Twin Towers, the buildings collapse from top to bottom, unless you want us to believe that every floor on the Twin Towers were rigged with explosives to go off in a timely fashion from top to bottom at the speed (almost) of gravity! :wink:


There were uncontrolled fired on 13 floors of WTC7 and structural damage was sustained by flying debris. Just prior to the collapse, a massive bulge was observed between floors 13 to 15.

There is absolutely no reason for the controlled demolition of WTC7.

Even if you must believe in thonspiracies, the other 2 towers and attack on the pentagon was more than enough for the US Government to just about justify anything they wanted to and then some.

But even that logic doesn't hold to logic. The US Government could achieve the same results if they did something about 100 times smaller resulting in less loss of life, less loss to the economy and financial markets.

It is just simply unnecessary. Plus, US Government just won't do False Flags killing its own people. They are not Assad or anything similar.
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Re: IN MEMORY OF 9/11 VICTIMS 15 YEARS ON.

Postby Paphitis » Thu Sep 15, 2016 5:09 am

No matter which way you slice it, this was a very smart terrorist attack against the USA and an unprovoked one at that politically speaking. The only motive for Al Qaeda was the Western World's way of life and that encapsulates all western countries not just America.

Even if these individuals were known and were being monitored because the authorities had knowledge of their identities, it is difficult to apprehend because up to that point there is nothing apart from conspiring to commit a violent act. The accused would have a Defence and before you know it, the arrests will be seen as a racist and Islamophobic act by the Bush Administration. Even if found guilty, it will be on some minor charges and they will be out in a few months unless the authorities could prove they were planning a terrorist attack on a massive scale.

Having intelligence is not the same as having evidence. Quite often, the source of the intelligence is from a foreign government, in this case likely to be Saudi Arabia.

I also doubt the Americans would have any names, but only know that a terrorist attack is likely or imminent. So security would be stepped up at airports.

But the hijackers were not carrying weapons or bombs. Just box cutters and razors. It was clever and brazen. Even the Americans admit that!

Now you can't walk on a plane with small scissors or a tiny screw driver set for your sunglasses.

Intelligence Agencies monitor people at home all the time. Doesn't mean they can just arrest them on suspicion. Our legal system doesn't work that way. Prosecutors have to prove allegations with evidence. A judge is just going to language the prosecutors if they present nothing but suspicion.
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Re: IN MEMORY OF 9/11 VICTIMS 15 YEARS ON.

Postby Robin Hood » Thu Sep 15, 2016 7:51 am

Kikapu:
I'm sorry B25 but, ALL the buildings were "controlled demolishing", including WTC7, EXCEPT for the Twin Towers, and your video proves it despite what the voice says. When "controlled demolishing" takes place, the buildings collapse from ground up. When it's not "controlled demolishing" like the Twin Towers, the buildings collapse from top to bottom, unless you want us to believe that every floor on the Twin Towers were rigged with explosives to go off in a timely fashion from top to bottom at the speed (almost) of gravity!


You are only partially correct about the twin towers 1 & 2 ! Look at the videos of the collapse........ the TOP sections i.e. that above the point of impact in both towers, COLLAPSED FROM THE BOTTOM UP, the rest of the structure collapsed FROM THE TOP DOWN, section by section ......... in a very controlled manner.

There is a sound reason for that if you apply the laws of physics. To collapse from the bottom a structure that had a unpredictable asymmetric load would simply topple because the load on one side was greater than on other sides ......... the tower would tilt toward the path of least resistance directly you removed the bottom of the structure, (The Laws of Motion – Newton), small sections had had to be removed in sections, to keep the descent motion as near vertical as possible.

Did you watch the video that followed the one you linked? The explanation is there!

There was no section of the vertical column steel work recovered from the debris that was more than 11m long ..... which just happens to be the vertical distance between two floors. Look at the people hanging out of the building in the video, the windows were open/smashed and you notice a white vapour/smoke coming from EVERY OTHER FLOOR! That was not jet fuel or furniture burning ..... that was very likely smoke from cutting agents melting steel!

You get clouds of white smoke from cutting agents such as Thermite/Thermate which would take several seconds to cut through the steel of the vertical columns, thus weakening them at specific intervals. The cuts are made at an angle to ensure the column moves inwards or outwards and this is visible in some pictures taken of the rubble at the base after the collapse. A fairly clean cut at an angle of about 20 deg.

I am not going to waste time going any further ....... but there is a logical explanation for the events! Not a conspiracy ...... but a previous commercial/H&S decision taken after the 1993 attempt. I am happy to explain this in more detail if you wish ...... and it all makes sense! :roll:
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Re: IN MEMORY OF 9/11 VICTIMS 15 YEARS ON.

Postby Robin Hood » Thu Sep 15, 2016 7:53 am

Paphitis wrote:
Robin Hood wrote:Very early this morning on BFBS (Radio 5 UK) there was a guy who I think was either ex-CIA or ex-FBI, who explained that there was a cock-up in communications between the two services. The CIA was working with Saudi intelligence and had an agreement they would just keep tabs on these guys but not arrest them. The intent was to take them and hand them over to the Saudi’s for ‘re-programming’ in Saudi, then events took over. This is apparently covered in the withheld 28 pages of the 9/11 Commission evidence that have recently been released.

NOTE!: There is a programme on ITV (?) this evening that covers the story. No conspiracy, just a case of inter-service secrecy to hang on to the case as CIA jurisdiction rather than a domestic FBI case. CIA didn’t tell the FBI until it was too late!

BTW: Paphitis .... we are both right about the manifests! The one you posted was the original as was at the departure gate but apparently, when the FBI became involved they took all the manifests and released them some hours later with the hijackers names removed. Sounds feasible ............. to protect ‘National Security’ and all that? :wink:


Yes it is very feasible.

Once this terrorist attack took place, the CIA and NSA would have taken over and shut down the country, airports, government, secured the President and they would have over arching superiority over the FBI, FAA and NATSB. Sounds like common sense to me that they would have commandeered all the manifests and removed names before publishing them in the public arena. They would be deciding what is released and what is not. Why? Well they would be thinking that the hijackers had accomplices and they would not be sure if there will be other attempts not necessarily involving planes.

This stuff is not public information. The public do not have a right to know when hundreds more lives could be lost. The USA was under attack. This was probably one of the biggest attacks since Pearl Harbour and the Americans didn't even know what was going to happen next.

When the first 2 aircraft went in, the Australian PM was enroute to Wahington in his RAAF Jet. The USAF scrambled jets for its protection and escorted it to Canada as it could no longer land anywhere in the USA, not even at a Military base. The meeting with Bush was cancelled and even he was evacuated as if WW3 had just been declared.

It was chaos and Bedlum. Millions of passengers stranded and thousands more who can't get into America, including US citizens.

The only plausible conspiracy I see is that names were removed to also hide the alleged connections of 1 or 2 of the hijackers to some powerful people in Saudi Arabia, which is aside to the operational necessities of doing this. We also know that Osama Bin Laden had strong Saudi connections. Still a long stretch to be saying that the Saudi Government was involved but it is not impossible.

You can bet that US Intelligence will however know. Whether they choose to reveal that information is another matter. Of course they are withholding information and they will continue to do this for some years to come. They are paid by the taxpayer to do some rather very spooky job. Not an easy job to do either when your entire life is lived under false pretenses and your entire family think you're a life insurance salesman.


Absolutely ....... all perfectly feasible.
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Re: IN MEMORY OF 9/11 VICTIMS 15 YEARS ON.

Postby Robin Hood » Thu Sep 15, 2016 8:13 am

Paphitis:
There were uncontrolled fired on 13 floors of WTC7 and structural damage was sustained by flying debris. Just prior to the collapse, a massive bulge was observed between floors 13 to 15.

There is absolutely no reason for the controlled demolition of WTC7.

Then how come it collapsed from the basement up? With what you have described ...... Newton’s Laws of Motion says it would have collapsed/toppled toward the side of least resistance ..... the side you have described with damage, bulging and fires. But look at the video ...... no argument ..... the centre columns were removed first (you see the penthouse topple into the building before the rest of it) then the building starts disappearing from the bottom up and hardly a visible sign of fires or damage to the side facing the camera.

Even if you must believe in thonspiracies, the other 2 towers and attack on the pentagon was more than enough for the US Government to just about justify anything they wanted to and then some.

I don’t think The Government per se was involved! There may have been some people involved in government that were involved but IMO this was not set up by the US Administration. CIA involvement? .... almost certainly ..... Cheney/Rumsfeld and other high ranking officcials? .... most probably. :roll:

But even that logic doesn't hold to logic. The US Government could achieve the same results if they did something about 100 times smaller resulting in less loss of life, less loss to the economy and financial markets.

It was not the Government ........... it is assumed that as the actual attacks were by terrorists, that what happened next was ‘part-of-the-plot’ ......... I don’t think the two were directly related!

Of course, only my opinion but I think as good as any other. :roll: :wink:
It is just simply unnecessary. Plus, US Government just won't do False Flags killing its own people. They are not Assad or anything similar.


Sorry mate but ..... history is littered with false flag operations by the US/Israel but also other governments as well.
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Re: IN MEMORY OF 9/11 VICTIMS 15 YEARS ON.

Postby Paphitis » Thu Sep 15, 2016 8:48 am

Why it collapsed?

Because it was a friggin blazing inferno! Collapsing from the basement up sounds feasible to me if the reinforced load supporting steel structure was being heated to a couple thousand degrees Celsius or more. Probably the entire weight would be supported by the bottom and it collapsed.
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Re: IN MEMORY OF 9/11 VICTIMS 15 YEARS ON.

Postby Tim Drayton » Thu Sep 15, 2016 9:17 am

This is just the author's view, of course, but I post it here because it is relevant to this discussion:

9/11: the unanswered questions
Johan von Kerkoff
http://cyprus-mail.com/2016/09/11/911-u ... questions/
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Re: IN MEMORY OF 9/11 VICTIMS 15 YEARS ON.

Postby Paphitis » Thu Sep 15, 2016 9:24 am

Tim Drayton wrote:This is just the author's view, of course, but I post it here because it is relevant to this discussion:

9/11: the unanswered questions
Johan von Kerkoff
http://cyprus-mail.com/2016/09/11/911-u ... questions/



It's not true to claim that the US Government report makes no mention about the reasons why WTC7 collapsed. The report deals with it over some hundreds of pages, including an assessment why it collapsed.

The media didn't give it as much airtime as the other 2 buildings. But the US Government has and was obligated to because people were killed in that building too. Firefighters were killed in that building as well.

I haven't read the report and it is massive. In addition, a lot of it is an engineering analysis about its construction and other things like load bearings and thermal tolerances which is beyond my capability or even willingness to read. I don't have a background in it.!
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Re: IN MEMORY OF 9/11 VICTIMS 15 YEARS ON.

Postby Paphitis » Thu Sep 15, 2016 9:39 am

In addition, I find the general publics slanted views about the USA extremely ill informed.

For instance, the commonly held idiocy expressed by many people that America needs to sell its military hardware and is dependent on it and that they will start wars to sell weapons.

Well if that is the case, then I would expect the USA to send Australia's ambassador back to Australia and cut all ties. Maybe even bomb the crap out of Australia and invade. Maybe declare Australia as an evil axis for signing the biggest Defence contract today and which is even far larger than any American, Russian or Chinese Defence procurement contract for 80 billion dollars or about 4 times the RoCs entire GDP to construct 12 submarines.

Instead, the Americans have said nothing and even support the contract. Granted, the subs will include many American and Australian technologies so they get a piece of the pie.

There shouldn't be any issues with the French economy now.
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