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Is this genocide?

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Re: Is this genocide?

Postby Londonrake » Fri Feb 17, 2017 7:35 pm

Double post
Last edited by Londonrake on Fri Feb 17, 2017 8:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Is this genocide?

Postby Londonrake » Fri Feb 17, 2017 8:31 pm

Robin Hood wrote:You bitch about Tim Drayton and his ad hominem attacks on you ..... but just look at this post. It is all about me and then discrediting any sources I use. The subject of the OP is missing completely. As you inevitably do, you don't counter argument, you just try to discredit any thing you disagree with using your own views.


Well, I only "bitch" about Tim's complaints because it was he who moved the debate in that direction in the first place. Clearly, the bloke is very intelligent and I enjoy his posts. IIRC you were supportive. Look on the bright side, I've yet to condemn your posts as "drivel". :D Moreover, I suspect that apart from Brexit he and I might just have a surprising amount of views in common. :shock:

I'm sure that earlier you made some disparaging remarks about me wrt the USA. Probably others. Can't be bothered to look it up TBH. Those particular comments were entirely incorrect, as it happens.

Do you not agree that you often contemptuously dismiss anything which comes from the so-called "MSM"? Yet you post stuff from sites which are stuffed to the gills with anti-western authors. Then, as I have said, you call it objective and talk about it like it's a revelation "the truth". You are trying to narrow the debate down to the very limited area that you find acceptable. It will never work.

With you, posting links is usually nugatory. Which is why I tend to avoid it. Nevertheless, I posted one which clearly shows that Russian involvement in the Ukraine was entirely against the international law that you keep invoking to support their activities in Syria. That's a widely accepted view, which is a couple of minutes Googling away. It's rank hypocrisy. However, you ignore it and ask me to defend the position. Go fish.

Remember, I have an awful lot of stamina. Moreover, I know where all your bodies are buried. :wink:
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Re: Is this genocide?

Postby Robin Hood » Sat Feb 18, 2017 7:37 am

LR
Nevertheless, I posted one which clearly shows that Russian involvement in the Ukraine was entirely against the international law that you keep invoking to support their activities in Syria. That's a widely accepted view, which is a couple of minutes Googling away.

You posted something that ‘clearly showed’ nothing. You made a statement without foundation.

The interference of the US and the instigation of a coup by them to overthrow a legitimately elected President, is also against International law, a fact that you conveniently choose to exclude from your assesment. You also completely ignore the agreement that Russia had with the elected government for their use of the base in Sevastopol which had 25 years to run. That was under threat, would the US accept such a threat on any of their 880 military bases outside the USA?

Evidence: Not that you will read any of it because it runs contrary to your rose coloured spectacles view of events. As you suggest ........ all available, and many more with ‘....a couple of minutes Googling away’:

http://www.washingtonsblog.com/2015/02/new-video-evidence-americas-coup-ukraine-means.html

http://www.activistpost.com/2015/04/us-backed-techcamp-color-revolution.html

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MSxaa-67yGM

https://gpforecasts.wordpress.com/2014/02/28/yanukovychs-removal-was-unconstitutional/
[url]
http://www.washingtonsblog.com/2014/05/ ... -news.html[/url]

But of course if you exclude any sites that you deem ‘unreliable’ or express contrary views, or authors you deem to be anti-West, or sites that do not support your perspective, ...... then you can whittle it down to just the sites that support your view ....... so you are left with the completely unbiased Washington Post and The New York Times. Yes .... a really objective way of determining events. :roll:

The US did in Ukraine what they did in Iran in the 1950’s and after 50 years of denial the US and UK finally admitted it. They have repeated the same in country after country since WWII. Ukraine will be the same, a late and very low key admission as they did with Iran...... except by then there will very likely be no independent journalists or independent news sites ...... just The Ministry of Information. :roll:
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Re: Is this genocide?

Postby Londonrake » Sat Feb 18, 2017 11:07 pm

Robin Hood wrote:LR
Nevertheless, I posted one which clearly shows that Russian involvement in the Ukraine was entirely against the international law that you keep invoking to support their activities in Syria. That's a widely accepted view, which is a couple of minutes Googling away.

You posted something that ‘clearly showed’ nothing. You made a statement without foundation.


"Without foundation" :lol: :lol: :lol: What is, - with foundation? That's a pat expression that you use all the time. Do you dispute that Russia's activities in the Ukraine did not break the international law that you use when it suits?

It seems that anything which contravenes that is ...................."without foundation". Then you post something from a man that used to be involved in Syrian affairs a decade ago, his opinion, and present that as definitive. With foundation?

BTW. Phil and Paul send their regards. It all adds up. :wink:
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Re: Is this genocide?

Postby Robin Hood » Sun Feb 19, 2017 10:06 am

LR
"Without foundation" What is, - with foundation? That's a pat expression that you use all the time. Do you dispute that Russia's activities in the Ukraine did not break the international law that you use when it suits?

The only International Law they broke was to use the forces they had in Crimea legally by agreement with the elected Government, to leave the Sevastopol base to protect their own interests and prevent the slaughter of the population of Crimea. They did NOT invade! They did NOT destroy! They did NOT kill anyone! Their ‘illegal’ actions prevented all that.

The Autonomous government of Crimea decided to detach from Ukraine by a popular vote in favour of doing so! When they declared unilateral independence the people then held a referendum for reunification with Russia. The vote was overwhelmingly in favour of annexation! I believe this is what a democracy is all about isn’t it ...... the right to self determination?

The current Government of Ukraine has no legitimacy as they were NOT voted into power. They were put into power by a US inspired, financed and organised coup.

The President was elected with the mainly ethnic Russian Eastern Ukraine denied the right to vote ..... but the US accepted the choice even though it was a vote by less than 40% of the population although they deemed the Crimea referendum ..... illegal!.

This is what I would deem .... ‘some foundation’ as all of it is recorded in various official reports. Your comment is a sweeping statement ‘ .... Russia broke International Law’ for which you provide no explanation, nor do you explain what Laws the Russians are supposed to have broken.
It seems that anything which contravenes that is ...................."without foundation". Then you post something from a man that used to be involved in Syrian affairs a decade ago, his opinion, and present that as definitive. With foundation?

You toy with words as you always do in any post on any Forum! The ex-UK Ambassador was commenting; he made no accusations just observations ..... if you consider that to be presented as a ‘definitive’ opinion, then you need to get an education! There was no foundation required, he expressed an opinion; he did not make an accusation ..... YOU ARE but do not substantiate it, i.e. you provide no foundation for your accusation ......... but then you never do! You have spoken!!! :roll:

It’s a continuation of the ‘Peace-loving-Islamic-Republic-of-Iran’ theme, same old comment ...... an accusation with nothing to back it even though reality stands as witness to the sarcastic and false impression you like to promote! :x
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Re: Is this genocide?

Postby Paphitis » Sun Feb 19, 2017 3:34 pm

Robin Hood wrote:Paphitis:

This meets your requirements for standards of journalism it is from the New York Times....... :roll:

Why Readers See The Times as Liberal

Even the NYT itself admits it is biased and is haemorrhaging readers ......... they are trying to recover their credibility.

The final sentence says ....... “Imagine a country where the greatest, most powerful newsroom in the free world was viewed not as a voice that speaks to all but as one that has taken sides.Or has that already happened?”

https://www.nytimes.com/2016/07/24/public-editor/liz-spayd-the-new-york-times-public-editor.html?_r=0


In America, anyone is free to write a letter to the Editor and air their gripes with articles and opinion pieces.

They publish them too.

That is what the NYT is all about and that is what a Demicracy is all about.

Not every reader is going to agree with every single report the NYT published or with their editorials. That is impossible for a news service in the free world. There is pluralism in the American media and press and no one gets into trouble from airing their views. Even the websites you get information from use American hosting to post their garbage whereas there is no chance you can open a website in Russia criticizing Pootin and expect to get away with it.

Russia and America are not the same.
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Re: Is this genocide?

Postby Paphitis » Sun Feb 19, 2017 3:36 pm

Robin Hood wrote:LR
Nevertheless, I posted one which clearly shows that Russian involvement in the Ukraine was entirely against the international law that you keep invoking to support their activities in Syria. That's a widely accepted view, which is a couple of minutes Googling away.

You posted something that ‘clearly showed’ nothing. You made a statement without foundation.

The interference of the US and the instigation of a coup by them to overthrow a legitimately elected President, is also against International law, a fact that you conveniently choose to exclude from your assesment. You also completely ignore the agreement that Russia had with the elected government for their use of the base in Sevastopol which had 25 years to run. That was under threat, would the US accept such a threat on any of their 880 military bases outside the USA?

Evidence: Not that you will read any of it because it runs contrary to your rose coloured spectacles view of events. As you suggest ........ all available, and many more with ‘....a couple of minutes Googling away’:

http://www.washingtonsblog.com/2015/02/new-video-evidence-americas-coup-ukraine-means.html

http://www.activistpost.com/2015/04/us-backed-techcamp-color-revolution.html

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MSxaa-67yGM

https://gpforecasts.wordpress.com/2014/02/28/yanukovychs-removal-was-unconstitutional/
[url]
http://www.washingtonsblog.com/2014/05/ ... -news.html[/url]

But of course if you exclude any sites that you deem ‘unreliable’ or express contrary views, or authors you deem to be anti-West, or sites that do not support your perspective, ...... then you can whittle it down to just the sites that support your view ....... so you are left with the completely unbiased Washington Post and The New York Times. Yes .... a really objective way of determining events. :roll:

The US did in Ukraine what they did in Iran in the 1950’s and after 50 years of denial the US and UK finally admitted it. They have repeated the same in country after country since WWII. Ukraine will be the same, a late and very low key admission as they did with Iran...... except by then there will very likely be no independent journalists or independent news sites ...... just The Ministry of Information. :roll:

Once again you post junk links I couldn't be bothered wasting my time with.

Where are those credible links from reputable services like NYT, Washington Post or SMH? Give us something we can actually read please!
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Re: Is this genocide?

Postby Robin Hood » Sun Feb 19, 2017 4:56 pm

Paphitis wrote:
Robin Hood wrote:LR
Nevertheless, I posted one which clearly shows that Russian involvement in the Ukraine was entirely against the international law that you keep invoking to support their activities in Syria. That's a widely accepted view, which is a couple of minutes Googling away.

You posted something that ‘clearly showed’ nothing. You made a statement without foundation.

The interference of the US and the instigation of a coup by them to overthrow a legitimately elected President, is also against International law, a fact that you conveniently choose to exclude from your assesment. You also completely ignore the agreement that Russia had with the elected government for their use of the base in Sevastopol which had 25 years to run. That was under threat, would the US accept such a threat on any of their 880 military bases outside the USA?

Evidence: Not that you will read any of it because it runs contrary to your rose coloured spectacles view of events. As you suggest ........ all available, and many more with ‘....a couple of minutes Googling away’:

http://www.washingtonsblog.com/2015/02/new-video-evidence-americas-coup-ukraine-means.html

http://www.activistpost.com/2015/04/us-backed-techcamp-color-revolution.html

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MSxaa-67yGM

https://gpforecasts.wordpress.com/2014/02/28/yanukovychs-removal-was-unconstitutional/
[url]
http://www.washingtonsblog.com/2014/05/ ... -news.html[/url]

But of course if you exclude any sites that you deem ‘unreliable’ or express contrary views, or authors you deem to be anti-West, or sites that do not support your perspective, ...... then you can whittle it down to just the sites that support your view ....... so you are left with the completely unbiased Washington Post and The New York Times. Yes .... a really objective way of determining events. :roll:

The US did in Ukraine what they did in Iran in the 1950’s and after 50 years of denial the US and UK finally admitted it. They have repeated the same in country after country since WWII. Ukraine will be the same, a late and very low key admission as they did with Iran...... except by then there will very likely be no independent journalists or independent news sites ...... just The Ministry of Information. :roll:

Once again you post junk links I couldn't be bothered wasting my time with.

Where are those credible links from reputable services like NYT, Washington Post or SMH? Give us something we can actually read please!


The post was not addressed to you!

You opinions are an irrelevance on almost any subject, as your posts are driven only by an irrational hatred of anything 'Russian'. :roll:

But you won't find any reference to these facts in the NYT or WP as they would spoil a good propaganda story. Better you remain in the dark as additional facts that paint a slightly different picture would only confuse you! :roll:
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Re: Is this genocide?

Postby Paphitis » Sun Feb 19, 2017 5:16 pm

Your posts are irrelevant because all you do is post junk material no one can take seriously.

You formulate an opinion which has a clear anti West pro Pootin and Assad agenda and like ok for sources which agree with your opinions.

Some of the websites you post from are actually hosted in USA, and Canada as well which says a lot about the plurality, democracy and freedom of speech in those countries. There is no Stasi ready to knock their door down and take the site owners to a Gulag where they will pull their finger nails off one by one for being contrarian or anti West.

In Russia however, they don't have that plurality, freedom of thought or freedom of speech as journos there not towing the Pootin line are liable to disappearing or murder. That is the reality of it.

Now, where are those NYT links? Go on, humour us and just give us one credible link please. Something we can open and actually have in a web browser history.
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Re: Is this genocide?

Postby Robin Hood » Sun Feb 19, 2017 6:14 pm

Paphitis wrote:Your posts are irrelevant because all you do is post junk material no one can take seriously.

You formulate an opinion which has a clear anti West pro Pootin and Assad agenda and like ok for sources which agree with your opinions.

Some of the websites you post from are actually hosted in USA, and Canada as well which says a lot about the plurality, democracy and freedom of speech in those countries. There is no Stasi ready to knock their door down and take the site owners to a Gulag where they will pull their finger nails off one by one for being contrarian or anti West.

In Russia however, they don't have that plurality, freedom of thought or freedom of speech as journos there not towing the Pootin line are liable to disappearing or murder. That is the reality of it.

Now, where are those NYT links? Go on, humour us and just give us one credible link please. Something we can open and actually have in a web browser history.


As I said ...... your posts are an irrelevance.
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