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THE DEATH OF THE POUND IS IMMINENT

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Re: THE DEATH OF THE POUND IS IMMINENT

Postby Robin Hood » Fri Oct 06, 2017 4:01 pm

Pyrpolizer:
Catalonia voted but nothing that would have an economic impact happened. Nor is expected to happen in the near future. So why should the Euro get affected??


That is exactly the same as happened with the UK referendum vote and the resulting vote to Brexit ...... NOTHING HAPPENED due to the vote! The vote in the UK complied with the rules, there was never an intent to leave the EU within a few days , it was a planned exit over time .... i.e. controlled to avoid sudden financial or structural and legal changes, primarily intended to keep the impact to a minimum.

But the value of the pound dropped anyway ...... not due to the vote but due to political revenge ..... led by the ECB ad EU Commissioners so that others would not follow suit and that can only be achieved through the money markets ..... i.e. SPECULATORS!

The Catalonian vote has been deemed illegal (although ‘illegal’ seems to depend on which rule book you read from. International and UN rules say citizens are entitled to self determination ) Their actions were intended to be an instant split from Spain and, thus just as would have happened in Scotland, they would have to re-apply for membership of the EU as a new sovereign State. So presumably they would be instantly outside of the customs union and single market ...... overnight and with its own sovereign currency. Spain would remain a member of the EU but with the most prosperous part of it gone.

So, explain why the GBP dropped almost instantly and the Euro in similar circumstances didn’t? The answer can only be that it was not the vote that caused the drop but the actions of those that control the value of currencies ..... and they are they speculators.

OTOH the Brexit vote and Teressa's official application to leave the EU, is expected to have a negative impact on the British economy when it actually occurs.


Exactly ..... it’s called speculation and currency speculation is not an exact science, far from it. ‘Expected’, ‘when’ ...... give me a break here, they really have no more idea of what will happen than any of us, it is all guesswork.

However speculators still take into account that the UK might NOT eventually leave the EU. Therefore the STG is currently in it's midway from where it would be one day after the UK actually breaks ties. Watch it falling and falling as long as the Brexit negotiations progress.


They speculate that the UK ‘eventually might not’ leave ...... surely that is not speculation, that is wishfull thinking. The decision has been made ..... Art. 50 and all the negotiations?

It may fall even more after that if the British economy won't make it.


If’, ‘won’t’ ...... again speculation, as valid as me saying “......when the GBP recovers on the back of a booming economy!” I don't have a clue and neither do they! :roll:

The more I look at the Brexit and the decline of the GBP the more i am convinced that strings are being pulled by the ECB and the EU Commission and the intent is to make bloody sure that the UK leaving the EU is as painful as possible for the UK. They cannot do the same with Catalonia as it will collapse the Euro and the EU .......... so what has happened has been a behind the scenes political intervention, not economic.

This is what the EU is now afraid of .......... and exactly why they set up to make the UK pay dearly for leaving their club.

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Re: THE DEATH OF THE POUND IS IMMINENT

Postby Pyrpolizer » Fri Oct 06, 2017 5:18 pm

wrote: That is exactly the same as happened with the UK referendum vote and the resulting vote to Brexit ...... NOTHING HAPPENED due to the vote! The vote in the UK complied with the rules, there was never an intent to leave the EU within a few days , it was a planned exit over time .... i.e. controlled to avoid sudden financial or structural and legal changes, primarily intended to keep the impact to a minimum.


Like I said is expected to happen.
Define "minimum impact".

wrote: But the value of the pound dropped anyway ...... not due to the vote but due to political revenge ..... led by the ECB ad EU Commissioners so that others would not follow suit and that can only be achieved through the money markets ..... i.e. SPECULATORS!


Do you have any evidence for the involvement of the ECB and EU commissioners, or is this just a conspiracy theory?

wrote: The Catalonian vote has been deemed illegal (although ‘illegal’ seems to depend on which rule book you read from. International and UN rules say citizens are entitled to self determination )


Absolutely not. We’ve discussed this issue ad nauseum in the Cyprus problem section. Individual citizens or even groups of citizens don’t have the right of self determination unless they fulfill the criteria of "a people". Catalonians don’t fulfill the criteria to be "a people".
TCs and GCs didn’t in 1960 either. Together as Cypriots yes," as the people of Cyprus’.

wrote: thus just as would have happened in Scotland, they would have to re-apply for membership of the EU as a new sovereign State. So presumably they would be instantly outside of the customs union and single market ...... overnight and with its own sovereign currency. Spain would remain a member of the EU but with the most prosperous part of it gone.


The EU has already announced both them and Scotland would be expelled from the EU.

wrote: So, explain why the GBP dropped almost instantly and the Euro in similar circumstances didn’t? The answer can only be that it was not the vote that caused the drop but the actions of those that control the value of currencies ..... and they are they speculators.


This is just a hypothesis.
The STG dropped because of the relative certainty that Britain would leave, and that would have negative effects on it’s economy.
The risk of Catalonia ever leaving is almost zero for the moment. Even if this ever happens what impact is it going to have on the overall Euro economy? 1% ?


wrote: Exactly ..... it’s called speculation and currency speculation is not an exact science, far from it. ‘Expected’, ‘when’ ...... give me a break here, they really have no more idea of what will happen than any of us, it is all guesswork.


Excuse me but the majority of people believe, and are ready to bet their money on it, that London will no longer be a Financial center. Similarly that Britain in isolation from the rest of Europe will do worse than today, no matter what. So if the majority of people believe that, why shouldn’t the speculators?

wrote: The more I look at the Brexit and the decline of the GBP the more i am convinced that strings are being pulled by the ECB and the EU Commission and the intent is to make bloody sure that the UK leaving the EU is as painful as possible for the UK. They cannot do the same with Catalonia as it will collapse the Euro and the EU .......... so what has happened has been a behind the scenes political intervention, not economic.

This is what the EU is now afraid of .......... and exactly why they set up to make the UK pay dearly for leaving their club.


How will they pay dearly?? The falling of STG Vs the Euro has nothing to do with the UK paying anything. On the contrary it makes British products cheaper and more attractive to the European markets. As long as the EU does not have the tools to influence the British economy it will not pay anything. Except of course the price for their self imposed isolation and loss of position as Financial center.
Last edited by Pyrpolizer on Fri Oct 06, 2017 6:00 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: THE DEATH OF THE POUND IS IMMINENT

Postby Pyrpolizer » Fri Oct 06, 2017 5:56 pm

most people think Britain will be worse off after leaving the EU, and the tendency is rising in the last 1.5 years

https://whatukthinks.org/eu/questions/d ... ve-the-eu/

GREEN:Worse off
BLUE:Better off
RED: No Real Difference
GREY:Don't Know
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Re: THE DEATH OF THE POUND IS IMMINENT

Postby miltiades » Fri Oct 06, 2017 6:20 pm

For crying out loud man, the pound dropped and continues to drop because of BREXIT . NOT SPECULATORS.
You Robin have steadfastly. Refuse to accept this.undeniable FACT. BREXIT FUCKED. STERLING.
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Re: THE DEATH OF THE POUND IS IMMINENT

Postby Robin Hood » Fri Oct 06, 2017 8:05 pm

Pyrpolizer:
Like I said is expected to happen
.
Speculation ..... nobody knows!
Define "minimum impact".

You know the impact is coming so you tighten your seat belt! Anticipation of a known event and taking steps to minimise damage.
Do you have any evidence for the involvement of the ECB and EU commissioners, or is this just a conspiracy theory?

It is speculation and applying logic on my part ..... there is no evidence but on the scale of probability it is at the higher end of the scale. Looking at events and comparing them with the idea it was all caused by a vote is not clever thinking. How? The only positive link between the two is speculators who (IMO) are being controlled politically.

I will pass on the Cyprus link on the grounds I know little or nothing about it.But self determination is contained in the UN Charter I believe (?).
The EU has already announced both them and Scotland would be expelled from the EU.


They’ as a separate entity were never in the EU! It is being part of a member State of the EU that gives them the benefits. If they leave they lose the benefits from the day they leave. In my eyes that says a instant departure would have a far greater impact than a planned exit (Brexit) as each step can be engineered to minimise damage to both parties.

Again I ask you, why did Brexit cause the pound to drop when a far more disastrous exit, maybe even leading to a civil insurrection (Syria????) by Catalonia declaring an UDI, seems to have had little effect on the Euro?

This is just a hypothesis.
The STG dropped because of the relative certainty that Britain would leave, and that would have negative effects on it’s economy.

Speculation .... nobody know what will happen!

The risk of Catalonia ever leaving is almost zero for the moment. Even if this ever happens what impact is it going to have on the overall Euro economy? 1% ?


It is not the leaving but what happens when what is effectively a fascist Spanish government tries to enforce their will on the people of Catalonia. Far more likely it will trigger a separatist terror campaign. You think that will have only a 1% effect of the EU economy? It will be greater than that and an even greater impact on the Spanish economy.

Excuse me but the majority of people believe, and are ready to bet their money on it, that London will no longer be a Financial center. Similarly that Britain in isolation from the rest of Europe will do worse than today, no matter what. So if the majority of people believe that, why shouldn’t the speculators?


Firstly; If the investment banks go to Frankfurt or Paris ...... it will have very little effect of the UK economy or its GDP. Secondly; The second part is simply speculation! The British, in spite of all their faults, are a resilient breed and I have confidence that they will confront and deal with the changes and the UK could well lead the way in reforming the Global economy ..... but that is another subject completely.

How will they pay dearly?? The falling of STG Vs the Euro has nothing to do with the UK paying anything. On the contrary it makes British products cheaper and more attractive to the European markets. As long as the EU does not have the tools to influence the British economy it will not pay anything. Except of course the price for their self imposed isolation and loss and loss of position as Financial center.


They will be made to pay ..... not in monetary terms but in the damage the EU Commission would deliberately invoke to drag down British industry ..... which will HAVE to go through a period of recovery i.e. getting back to making what we require rather than buying it from overseas. The EU will do anything in their power to screw the British as their anticipated failure will deter others from taking the same route.

This economic recovery has happened in Russia since the imposition of US sanctions ...... their economy is growing as they do just that. It has backfired on the EU who have suffered far more from the sanctions than Russia. :wink:
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Re: THE DEATH OF THE POUND IS IMMINENT

Postby Robin Hood » Fri Oct 06, 2017 8:09 pm

Pyrpolizer wrote:most people think Britain will be worse off after leaving the EU, and the tendency is rising in the last 1.5 years

https://whatukthinks.org/eu/questions/d ... ve-the-eu/

GREEN:Worse off
BLUE:Better off
RED: No Real Difference
GREY:Don't Know


Define 'Most People'. Are these the majority that voted for Brexit. Again nobody knows and in my World negative thinking is not the attitude that wins ......... ask any football manager! :roll:
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Re: THE DEATH OF THE POUND IS IMMINENT

Postby Robin Hood » Fri Oct 06, 2017 8:18 pm

miltiades wrote:For crying out loud man, the pound dropped and continues to drop because of BREXIT . NOT SPECULATORS.
You Robin have steadfastly. Refuse to accept this.undeniable FACT. BREXIT FUCKED. STERLING.


You have expressed this opinion many times but as yet you have failed to explain how. Now we have a similar situation with Catalonia ..... where the currency didn't drop on the negative result of the referendum!

You don't have to be a genius to work out why ...... and it is because the speculators have been given instructions (I suspect) to ensure the Euro is not the subject of their speculation. The ONLY way currency changes value in the short term is through speculators on the currency markets ...... a vote does NOT alter the value of a currency ...... it is an impossibility! :roll:
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Re: THE DEATH OF THE POUND IS IMMINENT

Postby Londonrake » Fri Oct 06, 2017 8:33 pm

Sterling dropped today because Theresa May made a bad speech. :roll:
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Re: THE DEATH OF THE POUND IS IMMINENT

Postby Pyrpolizer » Fri Oct 06, 2017 9:06 pm

Robin Hood wrote:
Pyrpolizer wrote:most people think Britain will be worse off after leaving the EU, and the tendency is rising in the last 1.5 years

https://whatukthinks.org/eu/questions/d ... ve-the-eu/

GREEN:Worse off
BLUE:Better off
RED: No Real Difference
GREY:Don't Know


Define 'Most People'. Are these the majority that voted for Brexit. Again nobody knows and in my World negative thinking is not the attitude that wins ......... ask any football manager! :roll:


When we say define something that is vague, we attach numbers to it. :wink:
The numbers are on the chart 4 out of 7.
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Re: THE DEATH OF THE POUND IS IMMINENT

Postby Pyrpolizer » Fri Oct 06, 2017 9:42 pm

Robin,

So far you have posted countless of links describing the speculators as senseless people that abide to nobody and have no moral restrictions towards their ultimate goal of making money out of money.The Bankers motto "give us control of the money creation and we don't care who's behind the law, or something similar to that effect, is still fresh in my mind.

Now you want us to beleive that speculators/Bankers are politically driven by the EU commission to destroy the UK by driving the exchange rate of it's currency downwards. Don't you understand this is impossible, because a)speculators are an international group that doesn't depend neither controlled by politicians and b) even if the EU had managed to convince the big European Banks to speculate against the STG the Asian and American ones wouldn't have any reason to follow, resulting to a loss for the European speculators/Banks?

For me it's very clear that the fall of STG is simply because of negative expectation.
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