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a victory for human rights and freedom of speech

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a victory for human rights and freedom of speech

Postby bg_turk » Mon Jan 23, 2006 2:50 am

http://today.reuters.com/news/newsArtic ... ived=False

ANKARA (Reuters) - A Turkish court dropped a controversial case against best-selling author Orhan Pamuk for insulting Turkish identity after the justice ministry said it had no authority to try him, CNN Turk TV said on Sunday.

Ruling on a case that has been condemned by the European Union, the justice ministry told Istanbul's Sisli court it had had no authority under the revised penal code to pursue the trial.
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Postby akiner » Tue Jan 24, 2006 7:16 am

LoL

i am waiting to hear another silly restrainless arguments from him, at the end he has decoded by the society which will give him the appropriate punishment so nothing much left to say
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Postby bg_turk » Wed Jan 25, 2006 11:55 pm

akiner,

society may punish him by not reading his books, and by ignoring him, but NOBODY should be imprisoned for expressing their views. Th
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Postby Lala_Mustafa_Pasha » Thu Jan 26, 2006 4:12 am

His carreer is over, he comitted professional suicide, he could have approached the subject much differently, been less biased and tried to explain it to the Halk in a way they would sympathise and understand.

Instead he started blabbering playing up to his foreign sponsers and pretending he had a P.H.D in history talking about the Armenian issue when he's just an author, its not up to him to make historical decisions, he hasn't presented any research, facts, or shown his studies in the field.

He only has himself to blaim.

Its good they dropped the charges, theres no need for the courts to get involved or do anything, society will punish him enough.

I wouldnt be suprised if he made a formal apology and tried to edit up his remarks of course his sicerity would be totally lost but I bet he does it things like this always turn out like this.

Ahmet Kaya once upon a time proclaimed hatred for Turkey and left, soon he got home-sick and returned apologised to the Turkish nation and in this Music Video's says I love this Land from Edirne(Thrace) to Kars(The most Easternly point) many Leftists have also done the same lol

People really should think before they resort to actions, a big problem with some of our people, they simply dont think and are very emotional and just act spontaneously on the spot and think later, crazy Turks :lol:
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Postby Piratis » Thu Jan 26, 2006 5:40 am

This is a good example when I say that Turks are trying to change on paper but not in practice.
The reactions of akiner and Lala are enough to prove my point.

I predict that this person will either:
1) Be forced to take back what he said
2) Forced out of Turkey
3) Be murdered

I am sure my prediction will come true, especially if something goes wrong in Turkey's EU accession and Turkey will not care to have a nice image for the foreigners anymore.
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Postby akiner » Thu Jan 26, 2006 8:16 am

bg_turk wrote:akiner,

society may punish him by not reading his books, and by ignoring him, but NOBODY should be imprisoned for expressing their views. Th


Did i say anything different above?!


This is a good example when I say that Turks are trying to change on paper but not in practice.
The reactions of akiner and Lala are enough to prove my point.

I predict that this person will either:
1) Be forced to take back what he said
2) Forced out of Turkey
3) Be murdered

I am sure my prediction will come true, especially if something goes wrong in Turkey's EU accession and Turkey will not care to have a nice image for the foreigners anymore.


We all know your imagination has no limitations so go on predicting ,piratis, that is the best thing u can serve to humanity...
And if closing "Pamuk"'s case is not an example for u which shows changing is at practise as its in paper u must question your perception level
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Postby Piratis » Thu Jan 26, 2006 1:39 pm

Imagination? Here is from 2 posts ago from Lala:

Ahmet Kaya once upon a time proclaimed hatred for Turkey and left, soon he got home-sick and returned apologised to the Turkish nation and in this Music Video's says I love this Land from Edirne(Thrace) to Kars(The most Easternly point) many Leftists have also done the same lol

People really should think before they resort to actions, a big problem with some of our people, they simply dont think and are very emotional and just act spontaneously on the spot and think later, crazy Turks


Need I say more? The Turkish administration can obviously not tolerate the ones that voice their disagreement with the dictatorship in Turkey. They are either forced to leave from Turkey, take what they said back, or murdered.

The best Pamuk can hope is that he will never be allowed to speak again. If he does speak then it will be an apology and nothing more.
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Postby akiner » Thu Jan 26, 2006 3:00 pm

Piratis , do u know who Ahmet Kaya is?

I dont think it is fair to compare Pamuk with Kaya, Pamuk is a silly Nobel seeker making restrainless arguments to fulfill his dream, on the other hand Kaya was a ppk sympathizer whose action had been documented via a video record!!!?!

As a moderator u shouldnt repeat lala's mistake, should u?
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Postby bg_turk » Thu Jan 26, 2006 3:06 pm

Piratis,

The question about the inability to tolerate Pamuk's views has nothing to do with the Turkish administration but everything to do with Turkish society.

There are very strong nationalist elements in the Turkish society that will continue their hate campaign against Pamuk and will challenge his views, sometimes using very mean methods and personal attacks. I fail to see how this is very different from Greece, where people airing a view that Macedonia is not greek but slavic, are also subject to hate campaign and marginalised.

Orhan Pamuk is marginalized from Turkish society becuase his views do not conform to what the majority of people believe. If he is strong enough to stick to his point of view I applaud him, otherwise he will have to acknowledge that his views are not right.

I personally admire Orhan Pamuk for his courage to express what he believes, and I am sure that the Turkish state will guarantee his freedom of speech and allow free discussion on the armenian allegations.

Let me remind you that today in Switzerland and France it is a crime to question the so-called genocide, and people may face persecution for airing their views and even imprisonment. In Turkey this is not the case as the Pamuk trials have shown.

Of course you will say but the genocide actually happened, how can you question something that happened, but let me remind you that me, 70 million other turks some of whom have personally experienced those events and many other academicians question this thesis, and we strongly believe that part of the truth is hidden from the west, and we are determined to make our views known to the west. I firmly believe that Turkey is on the right course considering the issue. Turkey must uphold freedom of speech, unlike some hypocritical EU countries, because the only way to defeat propaganda is by telling the truth, the WHOLE truth.
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Postby Lala_Mustafa_Pasha » Thu Jan 26, 2006 4:36 pm

Well what this shows is that Turkiye is a changed place, I mean its proof that Freedom of Speech is now being defended, a great decision, well done.

Ahmet Kaya ofcourse isnt a comparison, I was just highlighting Turkey of the past and Turkey of today, things have changed this is proof, Pamuk would not have been able to get away with this 30 years ago, its more proof of the pudding about Turkey's real change.

Wether I agree with the man is neither here nor there, he has a RIGHT to express his opinion and I have a RIGHT to challenge it, let him speak I say and let historians answer, who is more credible of course someone who dedicated their life to history.

Pirastis your living way way way back in the past, Turkiye is so different then how you think it is. Even I was shocked when I last went, theyre actually really moving forward, Istanbul looks sparkling, still very cultural and middle eastern but modern at the same time a beaufiful mix. I also went to SanliUrfa and was even more shocked, the amount of crap I heard about how terrible it is. Damn its beautiful, fully re-furbished, people are lovely, it looks like Beirut in its hey day, the architecture, culture, food, people I had a great time, next stop will be Hatay I also loved Cappadoccia in the Central part.

Let me remind you that today in Switzerland and France it is a crime to question the so-called genocide, and people may face persecution for airing their views and even imprisonment. In Turkey this is not the case as the Pamuk trials have shown.


Hehe, I know its a joke, well France is trying to overturn the law now cos if they dont theyll have to accept the genocides they did in North Africa and Western Africa.

Brave Halacoglu, he went there and spoke his mind and went to court with a ton of facts and documents, when faced with the Historical truth the Swiss courts could do nothing but free him, if there's any justice that means that you have to listen to the TUrkish side aswell, justice isnt one-sided lol :wink:
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