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Turkey should forget about the privileged partnership also

Benefits and problems from the EU membership.

Postby eracles » Thu Nov 02, 2006 8:22 pm

Viewpoint, Talat and Turkey are saying the EU hasn't got anything to do with the problem of Cyprus so surely it won't make any difference if Turkey are in or out??
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Postby Mickleham » Thu Nov 02, 2006 10:38 pm

eracles wrote:Viewpoint, Talat and Turkey are saying the EU hasn't got anything to do with the problem of Cyprus so surely it won't make any difference if Turkey are in or out??



The EU is looking for a solution along the European Union principals.

The UN is an irrelevant and ineffective organisation according to the US.

There are difficult choices for Turkey. If the government of Turkey is unable to make hard decisions, then perhaps the military will perhaps step in and make these decisions
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Postby Piratis » Fri Nov 03, 2006 7:06 am

Viewpoint wrote:You getting nothing with hope and leverage is better than you getting nothing and having no hope or any leverage dont you think?


If such leverage exists, then this leverage will work now. If it doesn't work then it means this "leverage" is not strong enough to move Turkey from her position in the Cyprus issue. Therefore, I repeat, between us getting nothing and Turkey getting everything, and us getting nothing and Turkey getting nothing as well, we much prefer the second.

Now it is up to Turkey to indicate to us, by implementing the requirements of EU, if they care about EU (and therefore the leverage exists) or not.

If Turkey is bluffing we are definitely not. We don't need to.
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Postby Viewpoint » Fri Nov 03, 2006 9:03 am

eracles wrote:Viewpoint, Talat and Turkey are saying the EU hasn't got anything to do with the problem of Cyprus so surely it won't make any difference if Turkey are in or out??


A disinterested Turkey will mean no solution or even effort to find a solution full stop. But a Turkey with EU aispirations will mean a Turkey interested in resolving things through both bodies the EU and UN.

Which do you prefer? and what will you do to keep Turkey interested?
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Postby Viewpoint » Fri Nov 03, 2006 9:15 am

Piratis wrote:
Viewpoint wrote:You getting nothing with hope and leverage is better than you getting nothing and having no hope or any leverage dont you think?


If such leverage exists, then this leverage will work now. If it doesn't work then it means this "leverage" is not strong enough to move Turkey from her position in the Cyprus issue. Therefore, I repeat, between us getting nothing and Turkey getting everything, and us getting nothing and Turkey getting nothing as well, we much prefer the second.

Now it is up to Turkey to indicate to us, by implementing the requirements of EU, if they care about EU (and therefore the leverage exists) or not.

If Turkey is bluffing we are definitely not. We don't need to.


Turkey has to make some tough decisions and she will take the consequences good or bad but your leverage which is clearly what you are using now, only joining the EU has given you leverage over Turkey which never existed before and you are causing her problems from day 1 whether it works or not we will all see. If your leverage/demands are to strong for Turkey then she will walk/be sent away. We all realize that if Turkey wants the EU she will have to swallow the pills necessary and make the changes demanded of her.

Its when you use this leverage to want extent you are will to go to push/lever Turkey into doing what you want, are you willing as you say not to bluff and push Turkey off the cliff in round 2 or will you be imo clever and wait for Turkey to get closer to her EU aspirations where your leverage is worth much more and when you can extract more of your demands remain to be seen.

The GC side should be more concerned what they will do if Turkeys EU dream ends??? I personally feel they will be a far worse situation than they are now and can kiss any solution in any of the live times of people now reading this post.
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Postby Piratis » Fri Nov 03, 2006 9:31 am

Viewpoint, "day 1" was last year. So far we didn't use the "EU leverage" for things that we had every right to: The end of the occupation, the removal of the Turkish troops, the settlers issue etc.

The EU has just asked Turkey to do a tiny step in the right direction. They refuse to do even that, thinking that that they can always take, and give nothing of what they are obligated to give. They think they can continue acting illegally and aggressively against an EU country and at the same time continue their EU accession, something which is a paradox.

Do you think that giving Turkey one more chance will change anything? We gave them this chance last year and since then they haven't moved one bit. If we had any indications that giving her one more chance would change something we would.
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Postby miltiades » Fri Nov 03, 2006 9:48 am

VP WROTE :

""A disinterested Turkey will mean no solution or even effort to find a solution full stop. But a Turkey with EU aispirations will mean a Turkey interested in resolving things through both bodies the EU and UN. ""

I agree wholeheartedly , Turkey must carry on the arduous process leading of membership of the EU .
I have always considered the Turkish politicians to be diplomatically astute and determined to do what best serves the interests of their people , just look at their alliances and compare to those of Greece.
Turkey will join the EU because it wants to and concessions will be made but only under a climate of negotiations that will lead to the reunification of our troubled island.
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Postby Viewpoint » Fri Nov 03, 2006 9:55 am

I think you know my views on Turkeys EU accession, I don't think they will make full membership but I would like to see them adopt certain EU standards to improve everyday life in Turkey.

What I am having problems understanding is that you fail to see that your entry in the EU is the leverage at whatever level you use it, if you were not there then they would not be facing any issue with ports, am I right? then this to is leverage to get Turkey to open her ports to a country which she does not recognize. Turkey is not saying she will not open ports she is only stating that without resolve in Cyprus she cannot recognize the GC run south and thus allow her ships to enter her ports. The solution does not look as if it is on the table so Turkey has asked for the EU to make good on their promise at the same time as her opening her ports because the EU has a knack of not keeping her word but using delaying tactics for eternity.

Don't you think that Turkey wanting a solution to the Cyprus issue before opening her ports a positive move to put pressure on your own leadership to move forward. I really don't see the same amount of pressure being placed on your leaders to find an overall solution. its obvious form this side of the fence that your leader is playing for EU piecemeal tactics today the ports tomorrow the army and so on. Where will this end? back to the 1960 agreements? I cant really see us or Turkey accepting this and if Turkey walks aways then you will imo be up the river without a paddle.
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Postby pitsilos » Fri Nov 03, 2006 11:03 am

you are missing the point VP, but as always you never let us down with humour.
lets look at this again.
1...turkey, yes turkey voluntarilty without what soever pressure, signs the EU protocal.
2...after oodles and oodles of time she refuses to implement it.
3...the roc comes to turkey's aid to see if she could help and turkey refuses to acknowledge the roc
4...the only time turkey does acknowledge the roc is when a yes is required...funny isn't?

yes vp the protocal is not about the roc and turkey, its about the EU and turkey...the roc was more than willing to accomodate turkey to break the deadlock between turkey and the EU...you would do well to remember this.

now if turkey decides to take a walk in the park, its not because of the roc, but because turkey couldn't/not willing to adopt EU basic harmonization laws...you would do well to remember this one too

the report is not just about the roc vs turkey...lets wait and see :lol:
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Postby Viewpoint » Fri Nov 03, 2006 1:11 pm

But Turkey do not recognize the GC run "RoC", how can they open their ports ot country they do not recognize? Its like you opeining your ports to the TRNC.
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