Cyprus-Forum.com

Turkcyp, Insan and others:

The Annan plan or any new form of a solution plan, are all meaningless unless both communities accept one of them.
What is the definition of an "acceptable solution plan"?
We all know that no plan can satisfy all the people of all sides. Let's assume that we are "democratic" within our communities and that there is more respect among the people of each community than what we think exists between the people of each community.
The votes were GCs 74% NO and TCs 64% YES, right?
If we assume that the winning plan should be more compromising to the side with the most objectors, without being undemocratic to the side with the most supporters, then we are looking for a plan that would satisfy at least 50+% of the people from each community.
Would you be willing to accept and respect the opinion of both democratic majorities, even if your opinion falls with the 50-% NO voters?
Would a solution of this nature satisfy your definitions of "equality" between the two communities?
Don't you think such a plan may have more chances to succeed, than any other plan, that some third party may concoct and force on the one or the other majority? Could such a plan come to fruition? Who or what group of people could work together, from each community, to negotiate and formulate such a plan?

“YES PLAN" Solution Formula: 50+% GCs (yes) + 50+% TCs (yes) =majority of Cypriots said "YES"

First step:
Do you agree with the formula, or not?


Second step:
(To be developed after the first step is taken.)

I'm not sure what exactly you are trying to say here panteli

I'm not sure what exactly you are trying to say here panteli

I'll explain it to you, after you vote!

im not going to vote without understanding what im trying to vote! what do you think i am ? an american!?

LOL!!! Γαμάτη στιχομυθία!!! (excellent conversation)

But I didn't get what the formula is, either...

Panteli, to be honest I disagree with your formula ... I think a 51% support from both communities is too weak to guarantee commitment to the solution. What we need is something like 65% support from both communities.

You might think here: Is this possible to achieve? In my opinion, YES. The kind of improvements that most Greek Cypriots want, on Security and Property Rights, can be effected in a reasonable and moderate manner without alienating the Turkish Cypriots (except the Denktash clones, who are no more than 35% of TCs anyway). Furthermore, the Plan's economics can be substantially improved in favor of the Turkish Cypriots, thus replenishing the Yes votes of the Denktash clones who would no longer be happy with the plan.

Anyway, these are just the details. I firmly believe we can do a lot better than just 51% on each side.


P.S. For a full analysis of this argument, based on statistical data, you can download the recent report I wrote from my website, at:

http://www.help-net.gr/download.htm


P.P.S. Hey, are you a friend of my "koumparos", Marios Panteli? He told me that he set up an e-mail account just so that he could keep in touch with you!

I agree that 51% is not enough. Usually for such huge changes all countries require what they call "special majority" which usually is around 70-75%.

However I disagree that reaching such numbers (or even 65%) for both communities is possible with the current balance of power.

51% may or may not be 'enough', but I don't think that that was the point of the proposal. I think Pantelis is trying to say something other than 'this is how we'll get 51% of people to vote yes' (or that's what I think). Maybe we should wait till he clears it out a bit more...

Pantelis,

We are talking about a solution plan which interests whole Cypriots. I don't think any solution plan voted in favour by seperate simple majority of each communities would be viable. I believe that at least %70 of each communities should vote in favour of any solution plan then we can consider it as a plan, embraced by vast majority of Cypriots. Otherwise, there certainly would be big difficulties to implement the plan. In other words any solution plan that hasn't been embraced by %70 of each communities is doomed to fail.

I look forward for your next step.

Who or what group of people could work together, from each community, to negotiate and formulate such a plan?

Parliamentarians, civil intitatives, lawyers and alternative intelligentsia can work together from each community to negotiate and formulate such a plan. I don't think any plan that seemingly formulated by those group of Cypriots would be a far cry from any of the draft frameworks proposed by UN. The parameters of the problem and the stances of different groups of Cypriots upon those parameters are known.