Cyprus-Forum.com

[TonyC]

I think there is a background element to what's going on.
I think the muslim world maybe has an inferiority complex in its relations to the West. They look for insults in every way the western world relates to them. All their failures are blamed on the west or on the jews. "It's not my fault I don't have a job, it's the filthy jews" - "I don't have a good standard of living because of a christian plot against Islam", "why shouldn't I have nuclear weapons, am I not as good as the Americans?" etc.

"However, if one considers the old adage that "actions speak louder than words"....
- In islamic countries from Palestine to Pakistan we see news reports of huge mobs screaming inarticulately, practically foaming at the mouth whilst they burn an destroy in a frenzy of violence resulting in deaths and chaos.
- In Western countries we see debates about freedom of speech, and attempts to understand the muslim reactions.

Doesn't the Islamic world see that there are reasons for the Western impression of Islam

[maewing]

TonyC, I agree.

I also find that few moderates within the Middle East speak up as they should--though it is probably because of fear. I cannot imagine working, living and worshipping with people whom you fear would kill you or your family if you disagree--especially if one of them is your cleric! Whilst after every bombing or violent action there is someone who maintains that Islam is not a violent religion, the actions from every Muslim country at this point (except maybe Brunei and UAE) suggest otherwise. If Christianity were this way (differing so widely in dogma versus practice) I would not be a Christian. Why then do alert, well-meaning and warm-hearted Muslims (probably the majority) not question Islam and the effect it has on them? It destroys them along with their fictitious enemies.

I do a lot of work in the Middle East and generally find people not only pleasant but a pleasure to work with--this is especially the case in places like Iraq, actually. However, even many of the educated with whom I work--many and most of whom went to school or were certified in the West--seem pulled easily and irrationally into hatred of the West. Someone (I do not know whom) has brainwashed them into thinking that people in the West despise and want to destroy them (Muslims and/or Arabs) but there is no where I can think of that this is the case. I think you are right in asserting that there is a bit of jealousy going on but I speak lightly on this point because I am American and most Americans do think a bit too highly of themselves and of their country. However, I can honestly say that we are not brought up hating Muslims and Arabs (or even thinking about them at all); black versus white is another matter...

[Michael]

It is all a smoke screen. The Muslim cleric, Ahmad Abdul Laban that advertised these cartoons has a very dubious past. Last December, two months after the cartoons were published some of his henchman at the mosque were arrested on terrorism charges. He is also a suspect. I don’t think the Danes were going to let him back in. Anyway he then trots round some Arab capitals with the cartoons and stirring up trouble. Even worse was to come. He claimed some pictures of Mohammed wearing a pigs head or acting as a paedophile were also published by the poor Danes. This was presented as facts but then when challenged; he back peddled saying that they merely been included for context, to show how hateful Danes are of Muslims. Well if they didn’t hate Muslims before, they certainly hate them now.

[djtrax98]

Exactly, i couldnt agree more with what anyone has said since last night.
Muslim people it seems are victims of theirselves. They have started the entire process of alienation from the rest of the world, sad thing is they actually agree with what they are doing to their own lives and to the reputation of their faith and religion.
I have never met a nasty muslim. In my time at university many of my friends were and still are Muslims from all backgrounds. They are lovely honest god fearing genuine warm people who will do anything for their fellow man. THEY ARE REAL MUSLIMS who condemn the actions of their fellow Muslims who behave in such a way. It has been documented in history, that during the Ottoman Empire, the Turks driven by a thirst for expansion and religious wantings of a totally Muslim world, ravaged countries killing everything in sight, causing huge devastation raping women and children, and destroying everything they could get their hands on. Nothing was said then. When the planes hit the twin towers, anger was sparked but once the wounds healed, the world realised that what happened on that fateful day was not carried out by Muslim people on behalf of Muslim people, it was carried out by a group of fanatics with a brainwashed view caused by Osama Bin Ladens cult that what they were doing was honourable and that they would go to heaven for doing it. The wolrd united Muslims and Christians alike to conedmn terrorism hand in hand.
NOW- A couple of cartoons have been published and the Muslim people have launched a vendetta against the west for the way their prophet was portrayed.
DID WE GET UP IN ARMS every time we saw mass protests in Muslim countries where they burnt our flags, shouted 'death to christianity' power to Muslim people and the rest of it?
NO. We didnt. Becuase we are more tolerant. Its time Muslim people realised they are persecuting themselves using the west as an excuse to do so. Sooner or later, it will become the case whereby if this continues, the west WILL begin to persecute them, and it wont be long until what was seen in america in the 1960's between black and whites, starts happening between all faiths and muslims all around the world. I would not like to see it, but like many things in life, this is beyond my control.
MUSLIM PEOPLE need to understand that what they are doing is wrong, that they will cause their religion to be hated and that they will become a minority sooner or later.

[TonyC]

It is all a smoke screen. The Muslim cleric, Ahmad Abdul Laban that advertised these cartoons has a very dubious past.

I don't think anyone is surprised that there are evil individuals among moslems, just as there are plenty of evil christian fanatics of the KKK type around
The difference lies in how societies react to the actions of individuals.
In the west, a man is arrested and tried if he breaks the law, and western countries do indeed have laws against racism and blasphemy, although not as extreme as in moslem countries.
In moslem countries an individual risks being stoned to death or some other barbaric punishment.
If he's not "available" to be slaughtered (for example if he lives in Denmark), whole countries rise up and are ready to slaughter anybody who happens to have the same nationality as the culprit. They flout international law and agreements concerning protection of diplomats. And we're not talking about individuals breaking the law, but whole movements of people, in many cases directed by the authorities, as in the cases of Iran, Palestine and Syria.

But it does seem to be a geographical thing more than a religious thing. Muslims who live in Norway don't run around bloodying the streets and screaming for Allah's revenge - they try to sort out the differences in a civilized manner, and do indeed succeed - the Norwegian editor who published the cartoons has apologized.

[maewing]

I guess what has surprised me is the feeling among Muslims--even moderate ones--that they NEED to react; that they NEED to protest. If every group that was the butt of some cartoonist, satirist or comedian protested (especially violently) traffic would never move on the streets of any city.

BTW, did anyone here about the protests in Nigeria? They killed 15 Christians. At least one man had a tire tied around him, was beaten senseless and then doused with gasoline and set afire. This is an incredible act but apparently carried out--not by crazed fanatics on the fringe or a small gang--but a crowd of thousands. Almost by definition this would have to represent the "average" Muslim there.

One point I would make as a followup is that I think the difference between this situation and racial episodes in the US has been the actions of the oppressed group. People take a disliking to African, Latino and Asian Americans because they are not in the majority--lifestyle differences of the few are then blown up through sterotyping and hatred and ignorance ensues. There has never been a need to behave differently or fan the flames of prejudice in these cases. Before you could follow a negative stereotype you were excluded from jobs, mortgages, schools, etc.

In this situation, there was little presupposed belief that Muslims would attack the World Trade Centre, hijack planes, etc.--even though they had done so on many other occasions. There was always, as djtrax98 said, a belief that it was a minority of fanatics with little reflection on the larger group. Indeed, prior to 911, there was probably more of a prejudice "sentiment" against the Northern Irish as being IRA than against Muslims as terrorists--at least in the US. Now, as you have mentioned, they have "created something out of nothing". However, while I agree Muslims in many geographic locations are "calmer" these locations are few and far between. Even in Virginia they have staged aggressive protests (such as when that young man was caught in Saudi Arabia going to some sort of "terror school".) I think if there is a large enough community to not be grossly outnumbered (locally, that is) they will commit violence--at least from the record.

[Simon]

What people seem to be overlooking is that in fact, the cartoons were actually first published in Egypt (a Muslim dominated country), months before Denmark published them. This is just being used as an excuse by the extremists to get more people to sympathise with their cause.

[Michael]

There not doing a very good job of it .

[NeverSayGoodbye]

I believe it was all planned out.It is the interest of certain groups from both east and west for hostility to grow.
Was something like "Hey lets publish this so the world can see how crazy these Islamists really are"
Certain people knew exactly what they were doing and the events that followed.

[NeverSayGoodbye]

I believe it was all planned out.It is the interest of certain groups from both east and west for hostility to grow.
Was something like "Hey lets publish this so the world can see how crazy these Islamists really are"
Certain people knew exactly what they were doing and what reaction it would of had.