Should Britain be held responsible?
 | Should Britain be held responsible? |  |
 Posted: Sat Aug 13, 2005 11:03 pm |
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| Greekmaniac |
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| Joined: 11 Aug 2005 |
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| I think in this whole Cyprus issue we forget that the British held the strings , and called the shots , creating this problem having a huge debt and business interest in the well being of Turkey. The Annan plan not only forgives Turkey for their crimes but forgives Britain also , and to add fuel to the fire it actually rewards Britain by givin them control of the sea that is adjacent to the bases. If we dont resolve these problems before a solution and accept responsibility are we not just repeating 1960 all over again. |
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| Posted: Sat Aug 13, 2005 11:19 pm |
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| ChomskyFan |
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| Joined: 05 Aug 2005 |
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British bases out of Cyprus!
Simple as that.
British interefere and hate Greeks. |
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| Posted: Sat Aug 13, 2005 11:22 pm |
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| cannedmoose |
| professor |
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| Joined: 01 Mar 2004 |
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| Location: England |
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If you read Section III of the Treaty of Guarantee, you'll see that the UK has always had rights over the sea adjacent to the bases. What was written in the AP is nothing new.
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SECTION 3
1. The Republic of Cyprus shall not claim, as part of its territorial sea, waters lying between Line I and Line II as described in paragraph 2 of this Section, or between Line III and Line IV as described therein.
2. The lines for the purposes of paragraph 1 of this Section shall be as follows:—
Line I: From the position on the low-water line Iying in a 163º direction from Point No. 57D/ 1, as defined in Schedule A to this Annex, in a 163º direction for 6.85 miles; then in a 207º direction for 3 miles; and then in a 204º direction.
Line II: From the position on the low-water line Iying in a 108½º direction from Point No. 59A/5, as defined in Schedule A to this Annex, in a 108½º direction for 7.8 miles; and then in a 136º direction.
Line III: From the position on the low-water line Iying in a 170º direction from Point No. 41B/10, as defined in Schedule B to this Annex, in a 170º direction for 3.8 miles; then in a 136º direction for 3.1 miles; and then in a 156º direction.
Line IV: From the position on the low-water line Iying in a 103º direction from Point No. 42B/3, as defined in Schedule B to this Annex, in a 103º direction for 0.9 miles; then in a 150º direction for 6.3 miles; and then in a 176º direction.
3. In paragraph 2 of this Section, the distances quoted are in sea miles reckoned at 1,852 international metres to one sea mile, and the bearings are referred to the True North and are given in degrees reckoned clockwise from 000o (North) to 359•.
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| Posted: Sat Aug 13, 2005 11:22 pm |
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| Greekmaniac |
| advanced member |
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| Joined: 11 Aug 2005 |
| Posts: 144 |
| Location: new york |
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| ChomskyFan wrote: |
British bases out of Cyprus!
Simple as that.
British interefere and hate Greeks. |
We cant even get them to accept resposibility , Chomsky im with you man, I feel the same way you do but unfortunatelly Cyprus got no army so its gonna have to be diplomatically. |
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| Posted: Sat Aug 13, 2005 11:24 pm |
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| ChomskyFan |
| instructor |
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| Joined: 05 Aug 2005 |
| Posts: 347 |
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| Greekmaniac wrote: |
| ChomskyFan wrote: |
British bases out of Cyprus!
Simple as that.
British interefere and hate Greeks. |
We cant even get them to accept resposibility , Chomsky im with you man, I feel the same way you do but unfortunatelly Cyprus got no army so its gonna have to be diplomatically. |
I have always been a great admirer of diplomatic genius, such as the first genius behind unification of Italy, Count Cavour, he was a diplomatic genius and played nations off against one another to secure unified Italy. The same should be done with Greece and Cyprus, I think we should be working with the Chinese, such as, we offer the Chinese a small portion of Unified Cyprus land for a base, the Americans and British will throw fits, and we say, we will only stop this if you relinquish control of the bases, if they don't give China a base, and my god, China with a base right in Europe close to the Middle East. They will do anything to prevent it. |
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| Posted: Sat Aug 13, 2005 11:24 pm |
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| Greekmaniac |
| advanced member |
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| Joined: 11 Aug 2005 |
| Posts: 144 |
| Location: new york |
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| cannedmoose wrote: |
If you read Section III of the Treaty of Guarantee, you'll see that the UK has always had rights over the sea adjacent to the bases. What was written in the AP is nothing new.
| Quote: |
SECTION 3
1. The Republic of Cyprus shall not claim, as part of its territorial sea, waters lying between Line I and Line II as described in paragraph 2 of this Section, or between Line III and Line IV as described therein.
2. The lines for the purposes of paragraph 1 of this Section shall be as follows:—
Line I: From the position on the low-water line Iying in a 163º direction from Point No. 57D/ 1, as defined in Schedule A to this Annex, in a 163º direction for 6.85 miles; then in a 207º direction for 3 miles; and then in a 204º direction.
Line II: From the position on the low-water line Iying in a 108½º direction from Point No. 59A/5, as defined in Schedule A to this Annex, in a 108½º direction for 7.8 miles; and then in a 136º direction.
Line III: From the position on the low-water line Iying in a 170º direction from Point No. 41B/10, as defined in Schedule B to this Annex, in a 170º direction for 3.8 miles; then in a 136º direction for 3.1 miles; and then in a 156º direction.
Line IV: From the position on the low-water line Iying in a 103º direction from Point No. 42B/3, as defined in Schedule B to this Annex, in a 103º direction for 0.9 miles; then in a 150º direction for 6.3 miles; and then in a 176º direction.
3. In paragraph 2 of this Section, the distances quoted are in sea miles reckoned at 1,852 international metres to one sea mile, and the bearings are referred to the True North and are given in degrees reckoned clockwise from 000o (North) to 359•.
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Hey moose willing to help me with the responsibility issue , since ive seen as such a big advocate on British imperialism and all its values , and culture it has spread to the world. |
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| Posted: Sat Aug 13, 2005 11:25 pm |
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| cannedmoose |
| professor |
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| Joined: 01 Mar 2004 |
| Posts: 4281 |
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| Greekmaniac wrote: |
| We cant even get them to accept resposibility , Chomsky im with you man, I feel the same way you do but unfortunatelly Cyprus got no army so its gonna have to be diplomatically. |
I'm with you on the fact that the SBAs should not be sovereign British territory, but should be leased to the UK. The diplomatic route is also likely to fail as it's in no-one's interests beyond Cyprus to see these bases liquidated, much of the intelligence on Middle East radio traffic and military activity across the Middle East and beyond is routed through these bases. Any attempt through the EU or UN will fail. |
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| Posted: Sat Aug 13, 2005 11:29 pm |
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| Greekmaniac |
| advanced member |
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| Joined: 11 Aug 2005 |
| Posts: 144 |
| Location: new york |
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| cannedmoose wrote: |
| Greekmaniac wrote: |
| We cant even get them to accept resposibility , Chomsky im with you man, I feel the same way you do but unfortunatelly Cyprus got no army so its gonna have to be diplomatically. |
I'm with you on the fact that the SBAs should not be sovereign British territory, but should be leased to the UK. The diplomatic route is also likely to fail as it's in no-one's interests beyond Cyprus to see these bases liquidated, much of the intelligence on Middle East radio traffic and military activity across the Middle East and beyond is routed through these bases. Any attempt through the EU or UN will fail. |
How about the fact that there is some form of payment that needs to be paid to the Cyprian government , and the British refuse to pay it. They sure know how to demand , cheat , steal you know what i mean (read below)
The Annan-5 proposals included a most pernicious provision slipped in by Great Britain which granted the British the right to unilaterally define the continental shelf and territorial waters along their two base areas and to claim potential mineral rights. Under the 1959-1960 London Zurich agreements, Britain did not have such rights (see the 2nd annex to the Additional Protocol to the 1959 Treaty of Establishment). |
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| Posted: Sat Aug 13, 2005 11:30 pm |
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| ChomskyFan |
| instructor |
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| Joined: 05 Aug 2005 |
| Posts: 347 |
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GreekManiac, these bases make us target for attack because of the world's anger at US and Britain Imperialism. Greece's economy stabilize since 1995, steady growth at 3-4%, going through transitional phase of changing into education based economy, this is a good thing. Perhaps in 20 or so years, Greece will have enough clout (if it keeps on expanding military budget) to tell the British where to go  |
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| Posted: Sat Aug 13, 2005 11:34 pm |
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| Greekmaniac |
| advanced member |
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| Joined: 11 Aug 2005 |
| Posts: 144 |
| Location: new york |
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| ChomskyFan wrote: |
| GreekManiac, these bases make us target for attack because of the world's anger at US and Britain Imperialism. Greece's economy stabilize since 1995, steady growth at 3-4%, going through transitional phase of changing into education based economy, this is a good thing. Perhaps in 20 or so years, Greece will have enough clout (if it keeps on expanding military budget) to tell the British where to go |
One problem the second we entered the EU those bases became non negotiable , but as all things that seem to good to be true the EU will not last and hopefully we have the resources to claim whats ours. |
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