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World War III coming soon?

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Re: World War III coming soon?

Postby Robin Hood » Fri Apr 07, 2017 12:19 pm

yialousa1971 wrote:Russia Suspends Memorandum With US on Flight Safety in Syria - Foreign Ministry

Russia has suspended its memorandum of understanding on air safety over Syria with the United States following the deadly US missile attack on the Sha'irat airfield, the Russian Foreign Ministry said Friday.

"Russia suspends the memorandum on the prevention of incidents and ensuring air safety during operations in Syria reached with the US," the ministry said in a statement.

The United States launched 59 Tomahawk cruise missiles at the Syrian military airfield in Ash Sha'irat near Homs late Thursday. US President Donald Trump said the attack was a response to the alleged chemical weapon use in Idlib on Tuesday, which Washington blames on Damascus.

https://sputniknews.com/politics/201704 ... ht-safety/


Unlike Trump, Putin does not resort to knee jerk reactions, his responses are measured but there is always an underlying warning. If this is true ......... and I hope it is .......... then if a coalition jet is bought down, or US/UK special forces are killed on the ground, unlike this US attack it, will be a legitimate act of defence. So maybe the US coalition will stop their incursions into Syrian air space, recall their ground forces ..... they have been warned and hopefully will heed the warnings ! :? :x
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Re: World War III coming soon?

Postby Tim Drayton » Fri Apr 07, 2017 1:08 pm

Posted on the wrong thread.
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Re: World War III coming soon?

Postby yialousa1971 » Sat Apr 08, 2017 9:58 am

Lindsey Graham hints boots on the ground coming in Syria. War on Iran is next (Video)

Senator Lindsey Graham hints boots on the ground coming in Syria. War on Iran is next (Video)

Alex Christoforou

Senator Lindsey Graham: I'm proud of President Trump.

Tucker Carlson speaks with on Senator Lindsey Graham over President Trump’s decision to strike Syria over a false flag chemical attack staged by ISIS and White Helmets.

The BOMBSHELL: Senator Lindsey Graham admits that we need to remove Syria to destroy Iran. The US attack on Syria has nothing to do with defeating ISIS, but has everything to do with destroying Iran.

And Graham hints (strongly) that boots on the ground are coming to Syria.

This is madness..and a must watch!



http://theduran.com/senator-lindsey-gra ... ext-video/
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Re: World War III coming soon?

Postby Robin Hood » Sat Apr 08, 2017 10:16 am

Tim Drayton wrote:Posted on the wrong thread.


Who posted on the wrong thread? :?: :roll:

I think what happened in Syria, which is where I assume you think Yialousa's post should have been posted, is equally valid on this one? What happens if the US does it again, as Trump is now threatening, and this time Russia reacts instantly and puts a couple of US missile launching warships on the bottom of the Med? :shock:
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Re: World War III coming soon?

Postby Londonrake » Sat Apr 08, 2017 2:57 pm

Robin Hood wrote:What happens if the US does it again, as Trump is now threatening,.................


It seems to me there's an awful lot of the usual media hype going on about this. In extremis, the likes of the Sun's current hysterical: "Only one step from war!!".

Clearly, if you carry out such an attack, supposedly for a very specific reason, nobody is going to say "It will never happen again". The point surely being to convey a message that further acts of that alleged behaviour will provoke a similar reaction? Otherwise, what point was there in it?


Robin Hood wrote:.................. and this time Russia reacts instantly and puts a couple of US missile launching warships on the bottom of the Med?


Do you really regard that as a likely scenario? Do you believe the Russian Rules of Engagement will specify that if any missiles are fired towards Syria then they are to attack and possibly sink the launching ship(s), involving the likely deaths of hundreds of crew? Do you believe that Vladimir Putin has put in the hands of a single ship's Captain the power to decide whether Russia and the USA go to war? No national leader would be so foolhardy and, as you point out, the man is certainly not noted for his spontaneous character or foolish nature. I ignore the fact that a sizeable chunk of the 6th Fleet is wandering around the Eastern Med at the moment. Including the likes of the USS Gerald Ford, which has 94 aircraft embarked. Russia has 24 at Khmeimim Air Base.

So, "what if?".

Russia goes to war with the USA? Over what? A couple of bases in Syria, because that's primarily what their presence in the country is about. I have little doubt personally that Putin quite probably regards Bashir Assad as a liability, a loose-cannon. Russia isn't in Syria for altruistic reasons. After decades of having a host of Med/ME client states ( Algeria, Egypt, Iraq, Libya, South Yemen) with associated trade links and military options Syria's their very last foothold.

Russian and the USA are not deliberately going to war over Syria. Which of course would be the inevitable and unavoidable result of such a premeditated action. Any chance of that I think will be down to some gross miscalculation/error. Even then I can't see it producing such a result.
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Re: World War III coming soon?

Postby Robin Hood » Sat Apr 08, 2017 4:43 pm

LR:
Do you really regard that as a likely scenario? Do you believe the Russian Rules of Engagement will specify that if any missiles are fired towards Syria then they are to attack and possibly sink the launching ship(s), involving the likely deaths of hundreds of crew? Do you believe that Vladimir Putin has put in the hands of a single ship's Captain the power to decide whether Russia and the USA go to war? No national leader would be so foolhardy and, as you point out, the man is certainly not noted for his spontaneous character or foolish nature. I ignore the fact that a sizeable chunk of the 6th Fleet is wandering around the Eastern Med at the moment. Including the likes of the USS Gerald Ford, which has 94 aircraft embarked. Russia has 24 at Khmeimim Air Base.

So, "what if?".

Russia goes to war with the USA? Over what? A couple of bases in Syria, because that's primarily what their presence in the country is about. I have little doubt personally that Putin quite probably regards Bashir Assad as a liability, a loose-cannon. Russia isn't in Syria for altruistic reasons. After decades of having a host of Med/ME client states ( Algeria, Egypt, Iraq, Libya, South Yemen) with associated trade links and military options that's their very last foothold.

Russian and the USA are not deliberately going to war over Syria. Which of course would be the inevitable and unavoidable result of such a premeditated action. Any chance of that I think will be down to some gross miscalculation/error. Even then I can't see it producing such a result.


I agree with you! A very, very unlikely scenario as you point out and your reasons are all perfectly logical and valid. But ............

What if? We saw what happened with the USS Donald in the Black Sea and the Carrier moored up off the Isle of white, although there was never an account that explained why it happened in either case. But the effect filmed by the crew on the Donald showed it to be dead in the water. But let us just suppose that the Russians COULD do that? It does appear, although not verified, that many Tomahawks didn’t make it ........ again nobody is officially saying why.

They could conceivably stop the vessels at sea from a submarine or an aircraft, contact them and give them 30 minutes to abandon ship before the Russians blow them out of the water, which I believe an Iskander is capable of doing. All streamed live ....... maybe even on Twitter or Facebook!

The Russians would be giving the crew a full opportunity to avoid all casualties but two floating weapons platforms would be put out of action ........ permanently and without loss of life. Is that really any different from ringing up the Russians 30 minutes before they attacked the airfield and destroyed the Syrians ‘weapons platform’, the airfield from which they are fighting an enemy?

I would see that in the same way you (and I also) see this event. It seems the airfield is already back in action as little if any damage was done to the field itself. It was a slap on the wrist! Such action would be an act of war, as this attack was, but that fact is being laundered out in the MSM as ”Russia/Assad have claimed it was an act of war” but no suggestion that the western nations supporting Trumps action are recognizing the fact.

What troubles me more than anything is not the event itself but the attitude behind it! Paphitis always spouted about ‘we can do this’ or ‘we can do that’ and ‘....we don’t need any body’s permission” ? That very much seems to be the US’s attitude at the moment and Trump made that very clear on TV. It is normal to gather facts first and then pronounce judgement before taking action. In my book this makes the US every bit as much of a rogue State as North Korea .......... threats are dangerous enough but to demonstrate that the US, as a nuclear power, will actually take unilateral action without the approval of the UNSC or even just the UNGA, I would say could easily trigger a pre-emptive attack from any nation that even feels threatened. What happens if the North Korean fat-man feels threatened and takes down swathes of South Korea or attacks Japan, or Pakistan, India, Israel perceive they are under threat?

The political/diplomatic blunder in this US action is far more serious than the event itself. McCain, Clinton and all the other Hawks are cock-a-hoop and piling praise on Trump for his courageous and prompt, no nonsense actions ....... is the US THAT determined to Start WWIII? So they really believe they would not be affected?

Putin has shown remarkable patience with the endless tirade of unsubstantiated attacks on him by the US/UK/EU and one day he will run out of patience ..... that will be the day the Russian people feel insulted enough to call him to take action.

That is the way this sort of reckless, ill thought out action could so easily lead. :roll:
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Re: World War III coming soon?

Postby Londonrake » Sat Apr 08, 2017 5:37 pm

Robin Hood wrote:I agree with you! A very, very unlikely scenario as you point out and your reasons are all perfectly logical and valid. But ............

What if? We saw what happened with the USS Donald in the Black Sea and the Carrier moored up off the Isle of white, although there was never an account that explained why it happened in either case. But the effect filmed by the crew on the Donald showed it to be dead in the water. But let us just suppose that the Russians COULD do that? It does appear, although not verified, that many Tomahawks didn’t make it ........ again nobody is officially saying why.

They could conceivably stop the vessels at sea from a submarine or an aircraft, contact them and give them 30 minutes to abandon ship before the Russians blow them out of the water, which I believe an Iskander is capable of doing. All streamed live ....... maybe even on Twitter or Facebook!

The Russians would be giving the crew a full opportunity to avoid all casualties but two floating weapons platforms would be put out of action ........ permanently and without loss of life. Is that really any different from ringing up the Russians 30 minutes before they attacked the airfield and destroyed the Syrians ‘weapons platform’, the airfield from which they are fighting an enemy?

I would see that in the same way you (and I also) see this event. It seems the airfield is already back in action as little if any damage was done to the field itself. It was a slap on the wrist! Such action would be an act of war, as this attack was, but that fact is being laundered out in the MSM as ”Russia/Assad have claimed it was an act of war” but no suggestion that the western nations supporting Trumps action are recognizing the fact.

What troubles me more than anything is not the event itself but the attitude behind it! Paphitis always spouted about ‘we can do this’ or ‘we can do that’ and ‘....we don’t need any body’s permission” ? That very much seems to be the US’s attitude at the moment and Trump made that very clear on TV. It is normal to gather facts first and then pronounce judgement before taking action. In my book this makes the US every bit as much of a rogue State as North Korea .......... threats are dangerous enough but to demonstrate that the US, as a nuclear power, will actually take unilateral action without the approval of the UNSC or even just the UNGA, I would say could easily trigger a pre-emptive attack from any nation that even feels threatened. What happens if the North Korean fat-man feels threatened and takes down swathes of South Korea or attacks Japan, or Pakistan, India, Israel perceive they are under threat?

The political/diplomatic blunder in this US action is far more serious than the event itself. McCain, Clinton and all the other Hawks are cock-a-hoop and piling praise on Trump for his courageous and prompt, no nonsense actions ....... is the US THAT determined to Start WWIII? So they really believe they would not be affected?

Putin has shown remarkable patience with the endless tirade of unsubstantiated attacks on him by the US/UK/EU and one day he will run out of patience ..... that will be the day the Russian people feel insulted enough to call him to take action.

That is the way this sort of reckless, ill thought out action could so easily lead. :roll:


I'm at least glad the post was taken in the spirit offered. Non-accusative,"alleged" etc :lol: :wink:

I'm sorry but I've never subscribed to your view that the Russians have developed some planet-busting, death-ray. Capable of immobilising any maritime, or now it seems airborne, platform. On the previous occasions you've talked about it I've not only find the supposed circumstances of this miraculous, world-beating technology a bit questionable but note that what I think have been valid questions about it have gone unanswered. Well, apart from an equivalent of the traditional local shrug of the shoulders that is. :D Why on earth would they demonstrate something so powerful, surely a war-winning technology, in such a ridiculously trivial way? I think you've been reading too much HG Wells Robin. You do have an admirable faith in Russian technology. Both of the people I see regularly who have lived and worked there have said the same thing "Nothing works!" :lol:

Sorry but you're "You have 30 minutes to abandon ship" scenario is - well, I am stuck for a suitable and tactful answer. If such an odd event were to come about though do you not think it would have the same end result?

IIRC the Isklander is a land based short range and mobile theater missile, as recently deployed in Kaliningrad?

I think I'm safe in saying that I've never been a Trump fan. I hated the relentless campaign by the Liberal intelligensia against him though, which started it seemed before the man had even crossed the White House threshold. It was basically the same foot-stamping, dummy throwing and petulant Remain crowd. Nevertheless, I did feel (as I think I commented at the time) that your early fondness for him was quite likely to end up as an act of painting yourself relentlessly into a corner. He was/is clearly - and very much unlike the ditherer-in-chief, Obama - somewhat unpredictable and prone to "action". That's going to be a new experience for the likes of Putin/Rohani (Khameni actually)/Jinping and of course our dear old friend kim Jong-un, who are probably having to go back to the drawing board after an inept Obama. :shock:

Many have praised Trump for his action in Syria. Personally I think it likely a one-off event. Unless there are more chemical weapons thrown around. In which case of course "face" is a factor. I have the same sense of incredulity with the idea that - once again - it's all down to the rebels. If it was regime then I imagine that there will now be a very, very close watch by both Putin and Assad on what's going on in that sphere. No room for doubt surely?

I have no sympathy with Putin when it comes to "the endless tirade of unsubstantiated attacks on him". From my perspective he deserves them. The idea that he is patiently putting up with them but one day will come over the fence and sort everybody out is - sorry again - risible. Your obvious faith in that sort of idea is puzzling in view of the stats. Russian's are not all super-soldiers with super weapons, etc. I don't want to get into one of those fatuous "My Dad's harder than your Dad" squabbles but would urge you, as such a usually punctilious researcher - to take a look at the realities.

My view is, that all of this + ISIS + hundreds of thousands of Syrians killed and millions forced to flee the country + all of the antics we regularly witness with the likes of North Korea and quite a bit more, would quite likely not have occurred if that Twat Obama had refrained from ad-libbing his famous chemical weapons "red line" speech back in 2013, then, when it happened had actually done what he had so rashly threatened. After that his credibility was totally trashed and everything went to Hell in a hand cart. But that of course is - just my opinion. :lol:

On that final point. I'm puzzled why you keep telling people "That's just your opinion". This is a chat Forum. Surely - it's all about people expressing and exchanging opinions? Otherwise we might just as well fire links at each other. In which case GR would never get to read anything. :lol: Not everything is a case of black and white and opinion fills may shades. Much of what you present from article outlets amounts in reality to little more than somebody or other's opinion. Just a thought. :wink:

Off out now to consume my nightly gallon of G&T! :lol:
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Re: World War III coming soon?

Postby Robin Hood » Sat Apr 08, 2017 7:38 pm

LR: I disagree with you .... obviously! :roll:

I think you underestimate the Russians! :roll: They seem to have the capability to influence the choice of US President and seem to hack all the US intelligence agencies at will .... according to 'intelligence' sources in the US, EU and the UK, so I think they could well surprise you. We shall see ...... and maybe sooner rather than later.

Why on earth would they demonstrate something so powerful, surely a war-winning technology, in such a ridiculously trivial way?


Something quite dramatic happened ..... twice ...... and was never explained. Maybe just a glimpse of what they could be capable of? Who knows .... coz I don't and neither do you. I looked at one site that seemed a bit of a tin-foil-hat conspiracy site, but too obviously so to be taken seriously. So it is still not explained.

Sorry but you're "You have 30 minutes to abandon ship" scenario is - well, I am stuck for a suitable and tactful answer. If such an odd event were to come about though do you not think it would have the same end result?


But it seemed sufficient for the US to do it? I assume it is true but the US gave the Russians a 30 minute warning ..... maybe just enough to put up some sort of token defence against what was virtually a saturation attack against one small site ...... and even then some 36 Tomahawks went missing-in-action.

I have the same sense of incredulity with the idea that - once again - it's all down to the rebels.


I watched an interview today with an English somebody (can't remember his name) he was adamant that it was Assad that was responsible. When it was pointed out that Assad had no chemical weapons, the UN conformed they had all been destroyed, he declared there were areas where the inspectors had been prevented from going, the inference being Assad was hiding weapons. When it was pointed out that all of these areas were areas under 'rebel' Al-Nusra control ...... he spluttered his way through an explanation based on US opinions. So, just Like Ghouta turned out to be a very hasty and inaccurate accusation when later all the facts came to light ...... this event will turn out to be the same. Let's face reality ...... the sources for all these allegations comes from the 'rebels' and/or rebel supporters.

....... would quite likely not have occurred if that Twat Obama had refrained from ad-libbing his famous chemical weapons "red line" speech back in 2013, then, when it happened had actually done what he had so rashly threatened.


I think you are doing him a disservice! I have no problem with the US or the UK or even Russia, taking action against someone who has been shown to have used chemical weapons ..... against anybody, not just civilians. But the punishment HAS to come after the investigation to ascertain the facts and guilt is proven, you cannot have one nation ignoring International Law and taking unilateral action just because it can! You would not countenance such action if it were Russia and certainly so if they declared they were above the law? :roll:

Opinion is opinion but should not be stated as if it were fact ...... or do you agree with the idea that the only 'thinking people' were the 48% that opposed to Brexit ...... the inference being that people like you and I are some sort of imbeciles incapable of thought? Well, I can't vouch for you but I still think and am far from being an imbecile. :roll: :wink:
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Re: World War III coming soon?

Postby yialousa1971 » Sun Apr 09, 2017 8:04 am

US aircraft carrier-led strike group headed toward Korean Peninsula

Sat April 8, 2017


" (CNN)- A US aircraft carrier-led strike group is headed toward the Western Pacific Ocean near the Korean Peninsula, a US defense official confirmed to CNN.

The move of the Vinson strike group is in response to recent North Korean provocations, the official said.
Adm. Harry Harris, the commander of US Pacific Command, directed the USS Carl Vinson strike group to sail north to the Western Pacific after departing Singapore on Saturday, Pacific Command announced."

http://edition.cnn.com/2017/04/08/polit ... peninsula/



North Korea’s next in Trump’s crosshairs

April 08, 2017


" President Trump is reportedly weighing plans to place U.S. nukes in South Korea or assassinate North Korea’s brutal dictator Kim Jong Un in response to the rogue nation’s relentless nuclear ambitions, including a potential strike on the West Coast.

The White House National Security Council presented the options as part of an accelerated review of U.S. policy on North Korea, ahead of Trump’s ongoing meetings with Chinese President Xi Jinping, according to NBC News.

The leaked proposals could be aimed at persuading Xi into pressuring North Korea — its ally and trade partner — to face the music and come back to the table over its nuclear weapons program, former U.S. ambassador to South Korea Kathleen Stephens told the Herald. "

http://www.bostonherald.com/news/us_pol ... crosshairs
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Re: World War III coming soon?

Postby Robin Hood » Sun Apr 09, 2017 10:31 am

yialousa1971 wrote:US aircraft carrier-led strike group headed toward Korean Peninsula

Sat April 8, 2017


" (CNN)- A US aircraft carrier-led strike group is headed toward the Western Pacific Ocean near the Korean Peninsula, a US defense official confirmed to CNN.

The move of the Vinson strike group is in response to recent North Korean provocations, the official said.
Adm. Harry Harris, the commander of US Pacific Command, directed the USS Carl Vinson strike group to sail north to the Western Pacific after departing Singapore on Saturday, Pacific Command announced."

http://edition.cnn.com/2017/04/08/polit ... peninsula/



North Korea’s next in Trump’s crosshairs

April 08, 2017


" President Trump is reportedly weighing plans to place U.S. nukes in South Korea or assassinate North Korea’s brutal dictator Kim Jong Un in response to the rogue nation’s relentless nuclear ambitions, including a potential strike on the West Coast.

The White House National Security Council presented the options as part of an accelerated review of U.S. policy on North Korea, ahead of Trump’s ongoing meetings with Chinese President Xi Jinping, according to NBC News.

The leaked proposals could be aimed at persuading Xi into pressuring North Korea — its ally and trade partner — to face the music and come back to the table over its nuclear weapons program, former U.S. ambassador to South Korea Kathleen Stephens told the Herald. "

http://www.bostonherald.com/news/us_pol ... crosshairs


It's a pity they didn't take the same stance with Israel. They have been threatening Iran with a first strike nuclear attack for years but the US does nothing about that!

Fat-boy may have half a dozen or so crude weapons and limited capability for launching them except against Sth. Korea and maybe Japan, but Israel has over 400 including hydrogen bombs and I read somewhere they could well have developed a neutron bomb. No verification for that though. They are also believed to have a vast chemical and biological arsenal as well.

If the Nth. Koreans cannot trust the US, which the latest events in Syria suggest they would be wise to not trust them, they could just strike first at Sth Korea at the first sign of US activity too close to their territorial waters. :x
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