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The Strength of IS.

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The Strength of IS.

Postby Schnauzer » Sun Nov 27, 2016 12:28 pm

One is FORCED to focus on the activities of 'IS' since they are unlike any 'RF' (Retaliatory Force') which may have preceded them and it is very difficult to imagine how the 'Problem' they pose may be resolved.

'Saddam Hussein' described America as 'The Great Satan' when they embarked on their unlawful campaign of destruction ('Shock and Awe') and rained death and destruction (Aerial Bombardment) upon the relatively defenceless sleeping civilians of Baghdad, relatively defenceless because they did not possess the weaponry to counter the 'High Altitude Bombardment' which heralded the onset of the murderous slaughter which was 'Shock and Awe' and was condemned later as an action based upon a tissue of lies.

'Baghdad', the birthplace of 'IS' and the determination of those that rose up (Retaliatory Force) to vent their rage upon 'Western Aggression' (colour it which way you will) which now, on hindsight, is so obvious.

Substitute the term 'Great Satan' for 'Shatan' (the Devil) and the scene is set for a battle twixt the forces of 'Evil' and those who oppose it, 'IS'.

Since 'IS' consider themselves to be 'Dead' already (confirmed on many occasions) they obviously do not fear death, neither will they countenance defeat since (in THEIR perspective) they cannot be defeated.

Since the 'Devil' is associated with the most atrocious acts imaginable, 'IS' is bound to emulate 'Devilish ' responses (as THEY see it) and commit to the atrocities WE have witnessed so regularly since it all began.

With such a formula, it is inconceivable that the 'RF' of 'IS' can be defeated by force of arms and, sooner or later they must be negotiated with (hopefully sooner) and certain of their demands met.

What those demands may be, WE are not privy to BUT, utter defeat is out of the question and the West does not really have a clue about how they can clear up the mess they have created.

Be sure of one thing, negotiations are under way 'At a Pace' and 'I' believe that the main obstacle to peace is, how to extricate oneself (the West) with some degree of credibility.

Perhaps the good old 'Yankee Dollar' (by container-load) might come to the rescue.... I doubt it. :wink:
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Re: The Strength of IS.

Postby Robin Hood » Sun Nov 27, 2016 2:46 pm

All the West can do, having created this monster in the first place, is to degrade IS's ability to wage a military campaign. They can destroy their fighters in battle but that will never destroy their ideology. That ideology will go underground and the West will be fighting a terrorist/guerrilla war for generations.

I do not think you CAN negotiate with people driven by an ideology based on a faith and belief in something for which there has never been any proof that it actually exists. Only time will change their perception but this sort of ideology will always appeal to those that that suffer from oppression and have no way out of it ............. and to those people, the US and its allies are the embodiment of that oppression and thus the embodiment of evil ! :roll: :x
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Re: The Strength of IS.

Postby Schnauzer » Sun Nov 27, 2016 4:51 pm

Robin Hood wrote:All the West can do, having created this monster in the first place, is to degrade IS's ability to wage a military campaign. They can destroy their fighters in battle but that will never destroy their ideology. That ideology will go underground and the West will be fighting a terrorist/guerrilla war for generations.

I do not think you CAN negotiate with people driven by an ideology based on a faith and belief in something for which there has never been any proof that it actually exists. Only time will change their perception but this sort of ideology will always appeal to those that that suffer from oppression and have no way out of it ............. and to those people, the US and its allies are the embodiment of that oppression and thus the embodiment of evil ! :roll: :x


Whereas I agree entirely with most of your perceptions, there is one small area where we might differ in that I do not think 'IS' is either intent (or intending) to wage a 'Military Campaign' against Western forces.

They have no need to resort to such extremes since those Western forces (by their own actions) must surely reach a stage where they realize that the 'IS' cannot be defeated by force of arms.

Conventional warfare is not the answer to the situation the West has created, one could easily compare the 'RF' of 'IS' with the 'Lernaean Hydra' of Greek mythology which sprang two heads each time one was severed, thus, even if there is a 'Hercules' waiting in the wings (Milti perhaps :lol: ) there are now far too many heads to be cauterized and 'Hydra' will continue to expand without full 'Military Engagement'.

End product similar to your own BUT, reached by a different route.

Incidentally, I generally much admire the substance of your posts, certainly you have a great deal more patience than I.........thanks. :wink:
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Re: The Strength of IS.

Postby Schnauzer » Wed Dec 21, 2016 5:30 am

The recent atrocity (the slaughter in the marketplace in Berlin) if proven to be an act of 'Terrorism' (and it probably was) is further warning of what we may expect to become part of our daily lives in the years ahead.

Condemnation of these (and other similar actions) is perfectly justified and it would appear that the same outpourings of sympathy for those who have fallen victim to this atrocity are bound to spring from the lips of the leaders of all the nations like a well rehearsed 'Shakespearean Play'.

The follow up to the usual speeches will be assurances that everything will be 'Tightened Up' and the general public should go about their daily business and remain 'Vigilant', reporting anything or anyone that appears to be 'Suspicious' BUT, not until IS declared themselves responsible, did our 'Leaders' declare (once again) that the "Perpetrators of this Atrocity" will be hounded out and punished for this outrageous action.

Bold words, Bold Ideas, Bold promises BUT, when are they actually going to DO anything other than bomb the hell out of the various locations where there are still thousands of innocent civilians trapped in the places where IS (and other forces) are engaged in battles for some thing which WE (the general public) are not even sure of.

Time to stop 'Frothing at the mouth' and face facts I reckon, IS will never be defeated because they have emerged from OUR society which THEY despise and will resist any attempts to entice them back into it, it is OUR fault (Western Society or 'Culture' if you have the cheek to call it that) that such forces as IS exist and the only way to ease the suffering which will obviously continue is for OUR leaders to admit to their actions and 'Surrender', the alternative is unthinkable. (imho).
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Re: The Strength of IS.

Postby Paphitis » Wed Dec 21, 2016 5:35 am

I recognize Islamic State's fundamental victory in Syria.

Their tenacity is to be recognized, even though the fundamentals for their expansion is all there.

Coalition will still fight them, and deliver them some defeats.

But DAESH as a fighting force can't be beaten comprehensively. Extreme radicalization can't be defeated when thousands of Sunnis are being exterminated with impunity.

Just remember, that whilst DAESH and the West are foes, DAESH has more important targets than the West in the Syrian Regime, Iran, and Russia.

The biggest victor in Syria, is IS! They have fertile grounds now for many decades. The seeds have been sown by the criminal regime.
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Re: The Strength of IS.

Postby Schnauzer » Wed Dec 21, 2016 7:06 am

I agree with you entirely, such a pity that WE (who are so cacooned in lies and deceptions courtesy of our leaderships) are actually powerless to draw any realistic conclusions as to that which is really going on under our very noses.

Were it not for the fact that there is so much death and destruction taking place in so many regions of this troubled world of ours, the whole 'Mish Mash' could be seen as some kind of a bad joke and, if it didn't make you laugh it would make you cry.

Season's greetings to you and your family (and ALL members) God knows we could ALL do with a bit of 'Good Will' in these dreadful times. :wink:

Best Wishes for 2017.................the year which might herald a bit of 'Peace' (with the corner up eh?) :lol:
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Re: The Strength of IS.

Postby Robin Hood » Wed Dec 21, 2016 8:17 am

Paphitis: ...... up to this point I tend to agree with you but .......

Extreme radicalization can't be defeated when thousands of Sunnis are being exterminated with impunity.


Do you have any links that explain/confirm this deliberate and targeted ‘extermination’ theory? Surely if a particular political/religious group take up arms against the elected Government then they are the ones that will die as the Government, acting on behalf of the rest of the people, take up arms against them?

Just remember, that whilst DAESH and the West are foes, DAESH has more important targets than the West in the Syrian Regime, Iran, and Russia.


I think you will find that DAESH do not differentiate ......... I don’t see many reports of IS attacks on Christmas Markets or other public gatherings in Iran or Russia? Their main target is Europe and also Australia as well as other Muslim countries where THEIR brand of Islam is not practised, at least only by a minority ! :x

The biggest victor in Syria, is IS! They have fertile grounds now for many decades. The seeds have been sown by the criminal regime.


Sorry .... but you have the wrong villain! The seeds of DAESH/IS/ISIL/ISIS were sown by US intervention, along with their various allies, in these Muslim countries, particularly in Iraq. The same applies to Al-Qaida, the US created them as well.

Assad has a secular State where Sunni’s are included in Government and where Sunni and Shia managed to live side by side and still do even now in the Government controlled areas. The Sunni vs Shia aspect is something the West has promoted .......... but conflict between ALL the different sects of Islam have been going on since the days of The Prophet. That will never change. :roll:
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Re: The Strength of IS.

Postby Paphitis » Wed Dec 21, 2016 8:27 am

Schnauzer wrote:I agree with you entirely, such a pity that WE (who are so cacooned in lies and deceptions courtesy of our leaderships) are actually powerless to draw any realistic conclusions as to that which is really going on under our very noses.

Were it not for the fact that there is so much death and destruction taking place in so many regions of this troubled world of ours, the whole 'Mish Mash' could be seen as some kind of a bad joke and, if it didn't make you laugh it would make you cry.

Season's greetings to you and your family (and ALL members) God knows we could ALL do with a bit of 'Good Will' in these dreadful times. :wink:

Best Wishes for 2017.................the year which might herald a bit of 'Peace' (with the corner up eh?) :lol:


The world had an opportunity to deal IS a very decisive blow. it would have been a decisive blow against radicalization.

Instead, radicalization has been fueled and will be intensified. Terrorism will surge, and so too will wars in the Middle east for years to come.

There are so many players now, including ISIL's arch nemesis Hezbollah. they are both as bad as each other, but DAESH will surge as has Hezbollah bringing other complications and players into play such as Israel.

The Middle east, Lebanon, and Syria do not have a good future. The world will suffer from terrorism but it won't be anywhere near as bad as the people of Lebanon and Syria. Israel will suffer as well, with terrorism and rocket attacks from Hezbollah thugs.
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Re: The Strength of IS.

Postby CrookedRiverGuy » Wed Dec 21, 2016 8:24 pm

Paphitis wrote: Israel will suffer as well, with terrorism and rocket attacks from Hezbollah thugs.


Tell me; is this something that is going on a daily basis? When was the last time it happened 'unprovoked'? You must be mixing Hezbollah with Hamas...

Are you aware that Israel is violating Lebanese sovereignty on a daily basis? I honestly believe that bearded master thug is behaving quite well.
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Re: The Strength of IS.

Postby Lordo » Wed Dec 21, 2016 11:26 pm

i seem to remember the israili soldiers were taken after a arab politician was assasinated by mosad. and of course they went in thinking they are godsgist to mankind.

in trying to release two soldiers they lost over 100 soldiers and over 100 tanks too. so i suspect the israilis have learnt a lesson so they would not invade in a hurry anybody else. but of course they can do a lot of damage from the air especially the cluster bombs they use. now thats a nice chrsitian civilisation thingy civiising the arabs again. they seem to inherited it from their christian american friends. after all it was their custer bombs they used.
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