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Birkibrisli's Cyprus dairy...My first 17 years in 7 days...

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Postby zan » Sun Dec 23, 2007 1:26 pm

Piratis wrote:
And I have been touting that for you for some time now and......Nothing!!!!

There is not a single GC here hat wants that to happen without some changes and if there are to be changes then we want changes as well and so it goes on


The reason there is Noting is because the Turkish side doesn't even want to hear about it. Whenever some people propose it in debates here, the argument against it is that such thing is not feasible because Turkey and the TCs do not accept it. And that is the truth. TCs and Turkey would accept nothing short of partition, or even better a disguised partition like Annan plan. For TCs a disguised partition is even better than "clean" partition because in that way they would get directly in EU and have financial benefits, while for Turkey and the UK a disguised partition is better because in that way there would be no Greek Cypriot state with an international representation to cause to them problems in EU and the UN (in the case of Turkey) or create problems against their bases (in the case of UK).

So when Turkey will accept nothing short of partition or disguised partition which would be even better for them and even worst for us, it is redicoulous to tell me that the reason we do not return to legality is because GCs don't want to.

So there is no question whether we would accept to return to the 1960 agreements. We would - period.

Yes we would want some changes, in the same way you are entitled to want changes also. One thing is to want and to propose changes, and another thing is to try to illegally enforce what you want.

So maybe we would challenge that 30% of governmental positions that is given to the TC community as being discriminatory, in the same way you can challenge as discriminatory the fact that a TC can not elect or be elected a president. Making such reforms is called progress and I doubt there is any country that has not changed anything in its constitution since the day it was created. As long as the reforms are made in the right direction with legal means there is absolutely nothing wrong with it.



That again is pure rubbish and propaganda because as soon as you put the fact that we voted yes to the Anna Plan your whole propaganda crap goes out of the window....Turkey wants nothing but partition is a worthless statement. :roll: :roll:
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Postby zan » Sun Dec 23, 2007 1:48 pm

Birkibrisli wrote:
Zan wrote:And I have been touting that for you for some time now and......Nothing!!!!

There is not a single GC here hat wants that to happen without some changes and if there are to be changes then we want changes as well and so it goes on........We arrive at this day...The day of reality........The day when we need to look forward and see that the dream you have...Although a noble one....Is not going to happen. The wimps ....or as I like to call them...The practical people want to move on and look forward to reunification in the future. To stop reaching for the moon and ruining the possibility of real peace. The possibility that it is best to live apart for now and make those bridges more stable and wanted rather than dragging our feet over wobbly threads of dreams...........Not that way...Then lets try this way should be the cry. A line that sticks in my head from the book "Kings of Peace. Pawns of War" is the criticism of Tpap for trying to win this on a legal basis rather than a political one. What a profound statement!!!!!Politics winning he day??????


Zan...If there is no reunification now,there will never be one.
What you are suggesting is to give up on the dream,and accept the status quo. For you and many others,the status quo (de facto Partition)is perfectly acceptable if not preferable. For me it is the death of our community. We need not wait to be invited to return. Papadopoulos is sitting where he is because of the 1960 constitution of the Republic of Cyprus. That constitution has not changed and it cannot be changed without TC acceptance. Talat can solve this problem in one week,if he abolishes the trnc and demands to return to the Republic. But that cannot happen of course because Talat is only the puppet as we all know. The puppet-master has other ideas for Cyprus and the TC community...Mine is a voice in wilderness,Zan...I will keep warning of the dangers of the status quo and the inevitable Partition. That is all I can do. Giving up on the dream of reunification is not an option for me. I wish it was,my life would be a lot easier... :( :(


I didn't say give up your dream but accept that there are practical ways to do this. You and I have the same dream but t seems that I am the only one that can be practical.

Lets examine what you are asking Talat to do. Disolve the TRNC/KKTC and ask for the return of the Zurich agreement.......And that hasn't changed??????? :roll: Bir...Please see past the fact that you think I want partition as the ultimate. The "RoC" is not the Cyprus Republic. Tpap was quoted as being the best mind in law in the western world. His little traps are waiting there for people like you. He has changed the name of he original republic and you guys have not even realised. That alone should ring alarm bells in your head but still you tell me he has changed nothing. :roll: They are the legitimate government in the "RoC" full stop, and that has been so since 1963 partially and then with the coup in 74 that was sealed in stone. That was the whole plan in the first place...Can you not see that. How much clearer can it get. They cause the troubles and then call for he UN to intervene...They then are recognised as the sole government in Cyprus and Cyprus becomes Greek...How many times more do I have to say that before it sinks in. The man is the best lawyer that money can buy and he has stuffed it to you, me and the rest of he world. That is why we have lost every resolution that he UN can make. He tied their hands with that one move. The UN did not pass those resolutions because it thought morally the were right but because they had to...They had no choice from a legal standing. We on the other hand have the moral upper hand because of the period 1963-74 and that is why they want to lose that part of history. Please look into what I am saying....We have no rights in the "RoC" hat we had in the CYprus Republic because the latter does not exist..Take a look at the coin I posted from 1963.....It says Cyprus Republic not the "RoC"......Wake up please. A massive trap is waiting for us and we cannot fall into it again. we have only just started to realise where we are. Disolve the TRNC/KKTCand we hand the island on a plate o the "RoC". Then we can start the arduous task of trying to find our place in a country in which we are simply a minority. The people will leave in droves at the first singing of he Greek national anthem at the reunification celebrations....Tpap might even shed a tear for real this time and a joyous one at that. I too feel like a lone voice and the boy who is shouting out that the Emperor isn't wearing any clothes but a large black cloud is hanging over my head and a large net over yours. The Cyprus Republic is in the same condition as your house was in that picture you posted...It is in ruins and you are sitting on a small crumbling part of it remembering it as it was. That is fine but please see it as it is......A wreck. If anything, it needs to be pulled down and rebuilt...... :cry:
Last edited by zan on Sun Dec 23, 2007 2:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby T_C » Sun Dec 23, 2007 2:34 pm

Well done for writing such a great diary of your time and feelings in Cyprus BK...I thoroughly enjoyed reading it mate. :D
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Postby Piratis » Sun Dec 23, 2007 11:41 pm

Zan, what you votes "yes" was for a disguised partition that would legitimize your rule over the north part of our country with the added bonus of EU and lots of money.

Not only you want partition but you claim that partition is already legal by claiming the existence of some "trnc". If you didn't want partition then why you declared the "trnc" and Turkey recognized it? Stop hiding behind your finger mate. We all know what you want, which is exactly the same thing as you wanted since the 50s - partition.

The reason the UN resolutions are against you is very simple Zan: We have the justice on our side. Turkey might have the big army, the UK/USA as friends, oil pipelines and a ton of other things that helped her get away with the absolutely inexcusable crime of occupying 1/3rd of our island, but justice is the one thing that you don't have on your side and only a brainwashed Turk like you could not realize this.


We on the other hand have the moral upper hand because of the period 1963-74 and that is why they want to lose that part of history


:lol: Really??

The ones who want to lose the whole history of this island except of some tiny and selective parts are non else than you mate.

Even in that tiny part of history you selectively choose to remember, you remember only your own suffering and our crimes. You don't remember our suffering and your crimes which they were at least equivalent and way more if you include 1974 in the equation.

But what about the recent history and the present you choose to forget, where you have ethnically cleansed the great majority of Cypriots from their homes, stole their lands, and claim that their land is now supposedly yours and "Turkish"? What about the events before the only decade you choose to remember where you have literally butchered 10s of thousands of Cypriots?

Zan's definition of "history" is: The few events that suit him over a period of a decade.

Well, I have news for you mate. Cyprus history spans 1000s of years and not just a decade, and the events that matter are not only those few that suit you.

You might have the army and the power to attack and enslave our island, but you have no moral whatsoever.
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Postby zan » Mon Dec 24, 2007 1:06 am

Piratis wrote:Zan, what you votes "yes" was for a disguised partition that would legitimize your rule over the north part of our country with the added bonus of EU and lots of money.

Not only you want partition but you claim that partition is already legal by claiming the existence of some "trnc". If you didn't want partition then why you declared the "trnc" and Turkey recognized it? Stop hiding behind your finger mate. We all know what you want, which is exactly the same thing as you wanted since the 50s - partition.

The reason the UN resolutions are against you is very simple Zan: We have the justice on our side. Turkey might have the big army, the UK/USA as friends, oil pipelines and a ton of other things that helped her get away with the absolutely inexcusable crime of occupying 1/3rd of our island, but justice is the one thing that you don't have on your side and only a brainwashed Turk like you could not realize this.


We on the other hand have the moral upper hand because of the period 1963-74 and that is why they want to lose that part of history


:lol: Really??

The ones who want to lose the whole history of this island except of some tiny and selective parts are non else than you mate.

Even in that tiny part of history you selectively choose to remember, you remember only your own suffering and our crimes. You don't remember our suffering and your crimes which they were at least equivalent and way more if you include 1974 in the equation.

But what about the recent history and the present you choose to forget, where you have ethnically cleansed the great majority of Cypriots from their homes, stole their lands, and claim that their land is now supposedly yours and "Turkish"? What about the events before the only decade you choose to remember where you have literally butchered 10s of thousands of Cypriots?

Zan's definition of "history" is: The few events that suit him over a period of a decade.

Well, I have news for you mate. Cyprus history spans 1000s of years and not just a decade, and the events that matter are not only those few that suit you.

You might have the army and the power to attack and enslave our island, but you have no moral whatsoever.


You are still trying to bend everything to suit you aren't you :roll: :roll:

Perhaps it's just a case of you not understanding :oops: :roll:

Yes I and all TCs support and endorse the TRNC/ and will do unless there is a massive change in your attitude to what is real and justifiable. Your legality started with an illegality and that illegality was instigated by the illegal actions put together in the Akritas Plan. You knew that by getting the UN to intervene in Cyprus because of your so called "Inter-communal Fighting" which was really an attack on h Turkish Cypriot people, that the rest would just follow and the UN would have no choice. That is what the mind of Tpap produced and when it was not happening fast enough you massacred even more people.The ethnic cleansing done by you was then legitimised and you have no shame in that. You can throw all the accusations like about what the Ottomans did to you but it was you that destroyed the first ever republic that existed n the island and you that is responsible for the pain and heart ache of people that are alive today and still being persecuted by you. The world has seen that now and will lift he embargoes and isolation of my people. Our time as come mate an you will have to suck your thumb and cry because enough is enough of your persecution. All my life you have treated me as a second class citisen and it will stop. Your lies and propaganda are being found out. Bleet all you like....[/u][/code]
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Postby Piratis » Mon Dec 24, 2007 1:43 am

I am simply saying the whole truth Zan, while on the other hand you only want to talk about the tiny and selective history you have been brainwashed with in your school and sing your propaganda excuses.

Your barbaric invasion and rule of our island that started 436 years ago was just the begging in the endless crimes you have committed against us. In fact every single Cypriot generation has suffered and continues to suffer under the Turkish crimes since then, including today. And if you don't stop with your crimes this will continue with future generations since people will be born poor in some refugee housing while their family owns lots of property in the lands you illegally stole from us.

During this time you have killed 10s of thousands of Cypriots, ethnically cleansed 100s of thousands, and today you claim that 1/3rd of our island which you stole from us by brute force is supposedly yours. And then you are trying to present yourselves as the victims because in some past decade you also, along with us, had a few 100s of casualties.

And if thats not enough, not only you are trying to excuse yourself for your crimes of past and present, but you are trying to find excuses to continue with the crimes against us, by using gross exaggerations and lies.

Here is how the inter-communal fighting started, which you call "an attack on the TC people" by a British (your best friends) documentary:



Your shameless and immoral propaganda is trying to present some conflict where both communities were responsible for and both had a few 100s of casualties as supposedly being an "attack on TC people". Not only that, you are trying to associate the inter-communal conflict that started in the late 50s and had ended in 1968 with the Turkish invasion of 1974, 6 whole years later, in order to find some excuse for killing 1000s of people (many times more than all the people killed during all years of inter-communal conflict), ethnically cleansing 100s of thousands, and stealing our land as it has been your plan since the 50s.

You have absolutely no moral ground in what you are doing against Cyprus and your lies and gross exaggerations will not help you to create one.
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Postby zan » Mon Dec 24, 2007 2:07 am

Thanks Piratis....That shows the result you got in line with this little baby....

The Akritas Plan

The rising tensions of the early 1960s spurred the formation of paramilitary groups on both sides, and as the constitutional crisis came to a head in 1962-63, both prepared for violence. The Greek Cypriots were better armed and more ideologically driven, and appeared to welcome the crisis---possibly including Makarios's Thirteen Points, which it sets out as a course of action---]as a likely provocation to Turkish Cypriots. An expected reaction from the Turkish Cypriot community, either to Makarios's constitutional gambit or some other incident, would in turn set the Greek Cypriot cadres into action. The plan for that action, revealed by a Greek Cypriot newspaper after the fact, was the so-called Akritas Plan, which is reproduced below.



The recent public statements of His Beatitude have outlined the course which our national issue will follow. As we have stressed in the past, national struggles are neither judged nor solved from day to day, nor is it possible to fix time limits for the achievement of the various stages of their development. Our national cause must always be examined and judged in the light of the conditions and developments of the moment, and the measures which will be taken, the tactics, and the time of implementing each measure must be determined by the conditions existing at the time, both internationally, and internally. The entire effort is trying and must necessarily pass through various stages, because the factors which influence the final result are many and varied. It is sufficient, however, that all should understand that the

measures which are prescribed now constitute only the first step, one simple stage towards the final and unalterable national objective, i.e., to the full and unfettered exercise of the right of self-determination of the people.

Since the purpose remains unalterable, what remains is to examine the subject of tactics. It is necessary to divide the subject of tactics under two headings, that is: internal tactics and external, since in each case both the presentation and the handling of our cause will be different.

A. External tactics (international).

During the recent stages of our national struggle the Cyprus problem has been presented to diplomatic circles as a demand for the exercise of the right of self-determination by the people of Cyprus. In securing the right of self-determination obstacles have been created by the well-known conditions, the existence of a Turkish minority, by the inter-communal conflict and the attempts to show that co-existence of both communities under one government was impossible. Finally, for many international circles the problem was solved by the London and Zurich Agreements, a solution which was presented as the result of negotiations and agreement between the two sides.

a) Consequently, our first target has been to cultivate internationally the impression that the Cyprus problem has not really been solved an the solution requires revision.

b) Our first objective was our endeavour to be vindicated as the Greek majority and to create the impression that:

(i) The solution given is neither satisfactory not fair;

(ii) The agreement reached was not the result of a free and voluntary acceptance of a compromise of the conflicting views;

(iii) That the revision of the agreements constitutes a compelling necessity for survival, and not an effort of the Greeks to repudiate their signature;

(iv) That the co-existence of the two communities is possible, and

(v) That the strong element on which foreign states ought to rely is the Greek majority and not the Turkish Cypriots.

c) All the above has required very difficult effort, and has been achieved to a satisfactory degree. Most of the foreign representatives have been convinced that the solution given was neither fair nor satisfactory, that it was signed under pressure and without real negotiations and that it was imposed under various threats. It is significant argument that the solution achieved has not been ratified by the people, because our leadership, acting wisely, avoided calling the people to ratify it by a plebiscite, which the people, in the 1959 spirit, would have done if called upon.

Generally, it has been established that the administration of Cyprus up to now has been carried out by the Greeks and that the Turks have confined themselves to a negative role.

d) Second objective. The first stage having been completed, we mus programme the second stage of our activities and objectives on the international level. These objectives in general can be outlined as follows:

(i) The Greek efforts are directed towards removing unreasonable and unfair provisions of administration and not to oppress the Turkish Cypriots;

(ii) The removal of these oppressive provisions must take place now because tomorrow it will be too late;

(iii) [b]The removal of these provisions, despite the fact that this is reasonable and necessary, because of the unreasonable attitude of the Turks is not possible bv agreement, and therefore unilateral action is justified
;

(iv) The issue of revision is an internal affair of the Cypriots and does not give the right of military or other intervention;

(v) The proposed amendments are reasonable, just, and safeguard the reasonable rights of the minority.

e) Today it has been generally demonstrated that the international climate is against every type of oppression and, more specifically, against the oppression of minorities. The Turks have already succeeded in persuading international opinion that union of Cyprus with Greece amounts to an attempt to enslave them. Further, it is estimated that we have better chances of succeeding in our efforts to influence international public opinion in our favour if we present our demand, as we did during the struggle, as a demand to exercise the right of self-determination, rather than as a demand for union with Greece (Enosis). In order, however, to secure the exercise of complete and free self-determination, we must get free of all those provisions of the constitution and of the agreements (Treaty of Guarantee, Treaty of Alliance) which prevent the free and unfettered expression and implementation of the wishes of our people and which create dangers of external intervention. It is for this reason that the first target of attack has been the Treaty of Guarantee, which was the first that was stated to be] no longer recognised by the Greek Cypriots.

When this is achieved no legal or moral power can prevent us from deciding our future alone and freely and exercising the right of self-determination by a plebiscite.

From the above, the conclusion can be drawn that for the success of our plan a chain of actions is needed, each of which is necessary, otherwise, future actions will remain legally unjustified and politically unachieved, while at the same time we will expose our people and the country to serious consequences. The actions to be taken can be summed up as follows:

a) Amendment of the negative elements of the agreements and parallel abandonment of the Treaties of Guarantee and Alliance. This step is necessary because the need for amendments of the negative aspects of the treaties is generally accepted internationally and is considered justified (we can even justify unilateral action), while at the same time intervention from outside to prevent us amending them is unjustified and inapplicable;

b) As a result of our above actions, the Treaty of Guarantee (right of unilateral intervention) becomes legally and substantively inapplicable;

c) The people, once Cyprus is not bound by the restrictions of the Treaties of Guarantee and Alliance regarding the exercise of the right of self-determination, will be able to give expression to and implement their desire.

d) Legal confrontation by the forces of State of every internal or external intervention.

It is therefore obvious that if we hope to have any chance of success internationally in our above actions, we cannot and must not reveal or declare the various stages of the struggle before the previous one is completed. For instance, if it is accepted that the above four stages are necessary, then it is unthinkable to speak of amendments in stage (a) if stage (d) is revealed. How can it be possible to aim at the amendment of the negative aspects of the constitution by arguing that this is necessary for the functioning of the State if stage (d) is revealed?

The above relate to targets, aims and tactics in the international field. And now on the internal front:

B. Internal Front.

1. The only danger which could be described as insurmountable is the possibility of external intervention, by force, not so much because of the material damage, nor because of the danger itself (which, in the last analysis, it is possible for us to deal with partly or totally by force), but mainly because of the possible political consequences. Intervention is threatened or implemented before stage (c), then such intervention would be legally debatable, if not justified. This fact has a lot of weight both internationally and in the United Nations.

From the history of many recent instances we have learnt that in not a single case of intervention, whether legally justified or not, has either the United Nations or any other power succeeded in evicting the invader without serious concessions detrimental to the victim. Even in the case of the Israeli attack against Suez, which was condemned by almost all nations, and on which Soviet intervention was threatened, Israel withdrew, but received as a concession the port of Eilat on the Red Sea. Naturally, more serious dangers exist for Cyprus.

If, on the other hand, we consider and justify our action under (a) above well, on the one hand, intervention is not justified and, on the other, it cannot be carried out before consultations between the guarantors Greece, Turkey and the UK. It is at this stage of consultations (before intervention) that we need international support. We shall have it if the proposed amendments by us appear reasonable and justifiable.

Hence, the first objective is to avoid intervention by the choice of the amendments we would request in the first stage.

Tactics: We shall attempt to justify unilateral action for constitutional amendments once the efforts for a common agreement are excluded. As this stage the provisions in (ii) and (in) are applicable in parallel.

2. It is obvious that in order to justify intervention, a more serious reason must exist and a more immediate danger than a simple constitutional amendment.

Such a reason could be an immediate declaration of Enosis before stages (a) - (c) or serious inter-communal violence which would be presented as massacres of the Turks.

Reason (a) has already been dealt with in the first part and, consequently, it remains only to consider the danger of inter-communal violence. Since we do not intend, without provocation, to attack or kill Turks, the possibility remains that the Turkish Cypriots, as soon as we proceed to the unilateral amendment of any article of the constitution,

will react instinctively, creating incidents and clashes or stage, under orders, killings, atrocities or bomb attacks on Turks, in order to create the impression that the Greeks have indeed attacked the Turks, in which case intervention would be justified, for their protection.


Tactics. Our actions for constitutional amendments will be in the open and we will always appear ready for peaceful negotiations. Our actions will not be of a provocative or violent nature.

Should clashes occur, they will be dealt with in the initial stages legally by the legally established security forces, in accordance with a plan. All actions will be clothed in legal form.

3. Before the right of unilateral amendments of the constitution is established, decisions and actions which require positive violent acts, such as, for example, the use of force to unify the separate municipalities, must be avoided. Such a decision compels the Government to intervene by force to bring about the unification of municipal properties, which will probably compel the Turks to react violently. On the contrary, it is easier for us, using legal methods, to amend, for instance, the provision of the 70 to 30 ratio in the public service, when it is the Turks who will have to take positive violent action, while for us this procedure will not amount to action, but to refusal to act (to implement).

The same applies to the issue of the separate majorities with regard to taxation legislation.

These measures have already been considered and a series of similar measures have been chosen for implementation. Once our right of unilateral amendments to the constitution is established de facto by such actions, then we shall be able to advance using our judgment and our strength more decidedly.

4. It is, however, naive to believe that it is possible to proceed to substantive acts of amendment of the constitution, as a first step of our general plan, as has been described above, without the Turks at tempting to create or to stage violent clashes. For this reason, the existence of our organisation is an imperative necessity because:

a) In the event of instinctive violent Turkish reactions, if our counter-attacks are not immediate, we run the risk effacing panic in the Greeks in the towns and thus losing substantial vital areas, while, on the other hand, an immediate show of our strength may bring the Turks to their senses and confine their actions to sporadic insignificant acts, and

b) In the event of a planned or staged Turkish attack, it is imperative to overcome it by force in the shortest possible time, because if we succeed in gaining command of the situation (in one or two days), no outside, intervention would be either justified or possible.

c) In either of the above cases, effective use of force in dealing with the Turks will facilitate to a great extent our subsequent actions for further amendments. It would then be possible for unilateral amendments to be made, without any Turkish reaction, because they will now that their reaction will be weak or seriously harmful for their community, and

d) In the event of the clashes becoming more general or general we must be ready to proceed with the actions described in (a) to (b), including the immediate declaration of Enosis, because then there would be no reason to wait nor room for diplomatic action.

5. At no stage should we neglect the need to enlighten, and to face the propaganda and the reactions of those who cannot or should not know our plans. It has been shown that our struggle must pass through four stages and that we must not reveal publicly and at improper times our plans and intentions. Complete secrecy is more than a national duty.

IT IS A VITAL NECESSITY FOR SURVIVAL AND SUCCESS.

This will not prevent the reactionaries and the irresponsible demagogues from indulging in an orgy of exploitation of patriotism and provocations. The plan provides them with fertile ground, because it gives them the opportunity to allege that the efforts of the leadership are confined to the objective of constitutional amendments and not to pure national objectives. Our task becomes more difficult because by necessity, and depending on the prevailing circumstances, even the constitutional amendments must be made in stages. However, all this must not draw us into irresponsible demagogy nor to bidding higher in the stakes of nationalism. Our acts will be our most truthful defenders. In any event, because the above task must make substantial progress and yield results long before the next elections, for obvious reasons, in the relatively short time in between we must show self-restraint and remain cool.

At the same time, however, we must not only maintain the present unity and discipline of the patriotic forces, but increase it. This can only be done by the necessary briefing of our members and through them of our people.

In the first instance, we must uncover what the reactionaries stand for. Some of them are opportunist and irresponsible, as their recent past has shown. They are negative and aimless reactionaries who fanatically oppose our leadership, but without at the same time offering a substantive and practical solution. We need a steady and strong government in order to promote our plans up to the last moment. These opponents are verbalists and sloganists, but unwilling to proceed to concrete acts or to suffer sacrifices. For example, even at the present stage they offer nothing more concrete than recourse to the United Nations, that is, words again without cost to themselves. They must, therefore, be isolated.

In parallel, we shall brief our members only ORALLY about our intentions. Our sub-headquarters must, in gatherings of our members, analyse and explain fully and continuously the above, until each one of our members understands fully and is in a position to brief others.

NO WRITTEN REPORT IS PERMITTED. THE LOSS OF ANY DOCUMENT ON THE ABOVE AMOUNTS TO TREASON AGAINST THE NATION.

No act can damage our struggle as vitally and decisively as the revealing of the present document or its publication by our opponents. With the exception of word-of-mouth briefing, all our other actions, i.e., publications in the Press, resolutions, etc., must be very restrained and no mention of the above should be made. Similarly, in public speeches and gatherings, only responsible persons may make, under the personal responsibility of the Leader or Deputy Leaders, references in general terms to the plan. They must also have the authorisation of either the Leader or the Deputy Leader who must approve the text. ON NO ACCOUNT ARE REFERENCES IN THE PRESS OR ANY OTHER PUBLICATION PERMITTED.

Tactics. Complete briefing of our people and of the public by word of mouth. Publicly we shall endeavour to appear as moderates. Projection of or reference to our plans in the Press or in writing is strictly prohibited. Officials and other responsible persons will continue to brief and to raise the morale and the desire for the struggle of our people, but such briefing excludes making our plans public knowledge by the Press or otherwise.

NOTES: This document will be destroyed by fire on the personal responsibility of the Leader and the Deputy Leader in the presence of all the members of the General Staff within 10 days from its receipt. Copies or part copies are prohibited: members of the staff of the Office of the Deputy Leader may have copies on the personal responsibility of the Leader, but may not remove them from the Office of the Deputy Leader.

The Leader AKRITAS

[/b]
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Postby Piratis » Mon Dec 24, 2007 3:54 am

The "Akritas plan" which is just an anonymous document and not an official one, only talks about how the Cypriots would gain the freedom and self-determination that was denied to them by Turkey and UK by using the TC minority on the island as the excuse to do so.

As I have shown to you many times, the UN resolution about decolonization clearly states that the people of a territory being decolonized should have "integration to another country" as a legitimate option in case they democratically choose to. Cypriots after being oppressed by Turkish, British and other rulers finally wanted their freedom as it happened with the other Greek islands.

The "crime" of GCs was that some of them continued to want their full self-determination even after the British and Turks had forced us to sign the 1960 agreements which granted to Cyprus only a limited independence.

The above document doesn't call for the killing or ethnic cleansing of anybody, just for how Cypriots would regain the rights that were forced to sign away.

However that is only one side of the story. The other side of the story, which you seem to ignore, is that TCs were working for partition, a plan that they had since the 50s and continue to have today. Again from the British (your friends) documentary:



Unlike the just demand of Greek Cypriots for union with Greece, which was what the great majority of Cypriots desired and would not involve the violation of the rights of anybody, the Turkish demand for partition involved the killing and ethnic cleansing of 100s of thousands of people from their homes and it was both illegitimate and criminal.

It is funny how you choose to remember only one side of the story in a thread where Bir described the actions of TMT that had as an aim the partition of Cyprus and the uprooting of 100s of thousands of Greek Cypriots, and involved not only murders of Greek Cypriots, but also the murder and intimidation of every Turkish Cypriot that dared not to follow the partition line.

Unlike you I do not refuse the share of responsibility and the crimes committed by our side during that time. However it is obvious that even during this tiny part of history you choose to remember, forgetting all the hardships you had caused to us during virtually every other period, your share of blame and the crimes you committed are at least as much. So even during that decade you have not been the "innocent victims" as you claim, let alone to be the "innocent victims" during our history as a whole when it is obvious that it is the Cypriots who have fallen victims of the Turkish expansionism and aggression, and not the other way around as you are trying to present it.
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Postby zan » Mon Dec 24, 2007 11:26 am

The more you squirm the more it is obvious you are trying to lie your way out of a situation you found yourselves in with the discovery of the Akritas Plan. History is there for al to see in how you worked with this plan but because we did not quite play along you then used 1974 in the shape of a coup to finish us off. If Turkey hadn't come the only "Cypriots" left would have been Greek and the island would have been part of Greece so all this trying to make TCs a part of the Cyprus you envisioned s just pure crap.

You need to now pay attention to the part in the plan that your precious leader warned against and is now fighting against although he knows it is lost.
From the history of many recent instances we have learnt that in not a single case of intervention, whether legally justified or not, has either the United Nations or any other power succeeded in evicting the invader without serious concessions detrimental to the victim. Even in the case of the Israeli attack against Suez, which was condemned by almost all nations, and on which Soviet intervention was threatened, Israel withdrew, but received as a concession the port of Eilat on the Red Sea.


That is what the greatest mind in law wrote back then and is now your president. Thank heavens Turkey saw what you were doing and stopped you stealing my home and murdering my people.
:evil:
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Postby Piratis » Mon Dec 24, 2007 3:34 pm

Zan, you use some anonymous document to excuse the murder of 1000s of the ethnic cleansing of 100s of thousands?

The truth is that you are the ones who have killed us by the 1000s and 10s of thousands, you are the ones who started the whole conflict by invading our island in the first place, you are the ones who made plans to occupy half of our country and ethnically cleanse us from it and eventually you put those plans into action.

What you have against is just a product of your imagination and propaganda. Because some Greek Cypriot once wrote a document, not about killing anybody, but about how Cypriots would gain the self-determination that was denied to us, not only you attribute that document to our president, but you also claim that document was made to "steal your home and murder your people" while it nowhere says any such thing. All we ever wanted was our freedom from the foreign invadors of our island Zan, nothing more than that. You are the murderers and criminals who have killed and denied our rights for centuries and continue to do so today, so you can steal our homes and exploit our island.
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