Cyprus-Forum.com

[boomerang]

doesn't your momma tourka feed you enough?...and here is me thinking you belly was always full from doing bugger all...

Why not ask them for a pay increase?...I am sure they will give it to you...

PS...you have to ask for a pay increase, due to inflation

[Viewpoint]

doesn't your momma tourka feed you enough?...and here is me thinking you belly was always full from doing bugger all...

Why not ask them for a pay increase?...I am sure they will give it to you...

PS...you have to ask for a pay increase, due to inflation

We know who are allies and enemies are.

[boomerang]

Since turkey ain't feeding you well then are you saying they are your enemies as well?

[Viewpoint]

Since turkey ain't feeding you well then are you saying they are your enemies as well?

No they are feeding us just fine, you GCs are the enemy for trying to isolate and punish us for 44 years.

[Kifeas]

The question to the proud Turkish speaking Cypriot remains what are your views on soon becoming a minority in your own country?

These people are our origins, which is Turkish...our Cypriot brothers tried to stab us in the back, all Turkey has done for us is put food on our plates, she not only protects us but supports us financially, you do not bite the hand that feeds you humanist. People who choose to live in the TRNC and become citizens are my people regardless of their ethnic origins, as long as they abide by our laws and respect each other we have no problems.

Can you see or understand the difference? The Turks have supported us in every way possible whereas GCs have only tired to sell us out to Greece isolate, discriminate and persecute us for being TCs.

VP, I have a proposal to make to you, which I am sure every other GC and our leadership will accept without any problems or objections.

The proposal is the following:

1.] We agree that the Turkish troops withdraw to the 18.4% of Cyprus and the maximum 25% of the coastlines, and the remaining 17.6% of the now occupied areas will pass to the control of the UN, with a resolution guaranteed under chapter 7 of the UN Charter.

2.] There will be no forceful movement or expulsion of TC population from these areas, nor there will be any GC re-settlement into these areas, out of which the Turkish troops will withdraw.

3.] We will negotiate for a fixed term of one year, so that we examine the prospects of reaching a re-unification solution on the basis of a BBF.

4.] We agree that after the end of this one year time-table (I know you like this word) for negotiations, if there is still no agreement between the two communities for re-unification, we will close the re-unification chapter, call the quits and both sides accept recognized partition, simultaneously with the return by the UN to the RoC of the areas which will be in its control since 1 year earlier.

5.] Those TCs residing in the areas that will be returned by the UN to the RoC, will have an option to either stay as RoC citizens that they are, under a revised constitution on the basis of one man one vote -i.e. without separate TC communal rights; or they will have the right to move into the 18.4% of the areas which will form the recognized independed TC state ("TRNC.")

6.] The international community will provide funding for the re-settlement of these people, as well as for any compensation to GCs that will permanently lose their properties situated inside the recognized "TRNC!"

7.] The RoC will agree not to have any saying or objections to your membership as a separate country into any international organization or into the EU.


How do you find such an agreement, would you and the leadership of your community agree to it, and if not, please explain why?

Any other TC is free to express their opinion of the above, within the framework of the above questions placed for VP to answer.

[Kikapu]

Kifeas,

If I may speak for VP for a second, he will say "I personally will accept your proposal Kifeas (as long as my house does not fall in the 17.6% UN controlled area), but show me any examples where land distribution in a form of a Partition is based on the size of the population".

[Kifeas]

Kifeas,

If I may speak for VP for a second, he will say "I personally will accept your proposal Kifeas (as long as my house does not fall in the 17.6% UN controlled area), but show me any examples where land distribution in a form of a Partition is based on the size of the population".

Okay then, I am ready to accept land distribution on the basis of private land ownership in Cyprus, as it was in 1960. In this case, the private land ownership of the members of the TC community and Evkaf was around 17% of the total private land, with only some 12% of it situated on or around the coastlines; therefore the TC community will keep only the 17% of the island's territory and 12% of its coastlines. It's fine with me, and I am sure to the rest of the GCs!

[Kikapu]

Kifeas,

If I may speak for VP for a second, he will say "I personally will accept your proposal Kifeas (as long as my house does not fall in the 17.6% UN controlled area), but show me any examples where land distribution in a form of a Partition is based on the size of the population".

Okay then, I am ready to accept land distribution on the basis of private land ownership in Cyprus, as it was in 1960. In this case, the private land ownership of the members of the TC community and Evkaf was around 17% of the total private land, with only some 12% of it situated on or around the coastlines; therefore the TC community will keep only the 17% of the island's territory and 12% of its coastlines. It's fine with me, and I am sure to the rest of the GCs!

If I may speak for VP again, he will say "look here you knucklehead, I will ask you again to show me any examples where land distribution in a form of a Partition is based on the size of the population. We are not interested in how you GC's with your mentality on how you calculate things. Just how the hell are we suppose to accommodate all my ottoman ancestors, because they are my people and they have every right to be here, therefore 70%-30% is what the UN has agreed to in the past for all peace settlements, so if it's good enough for the UN, it's ought to be good enough for you GC's. You should be lucky we are not asking for 50% of the land, since we had 50-50 veto power. Just be grateful that we are not going to ask for the extra 20% you have stolen from my people. Is all this clear to you, numb head" ??.

Yep, that's what I think VP would say to you Kifeas.

[CopperLine]

Kifeas,
A staged approach, a try-it-and-see approach ... Seems plausible to me. Certainly worth thinkng about and exploring. If the property question is too much of a hot potato for some then one could try with something else (peace parks, nature conservation zones, for example, or ever-larger demilitarised zones).

In principle a staged approach has got merits.

On your specific proposal I've got two initial queries : first, I'm not sure one year is long enough for any meaningful plan to be tested; and second, as already pointed out many times, it is not obvious that a BBF proposal is the democratic way forward. And as hinted above, property/land might not be the easiest thing to start with.

[Kikapu]

The proposal is the following:

1.] We agree that the Turkish troops withdraw to the 18.4% of Cyprus and the maximum 25% of the coastlines, and the remaining 17.6% of the now occupied areas will pass to the control of the UN, with a resolution guaranteed under chapter 7 of the UN Charter.

2.] There will be no forceful movement or expulsion of TC population from these areas, nor there will be any GC re-settlement into these areas, out of which the Turkish troops will withdraw.

3.] We will negotiate for a fixed term of one year, so that we examine the prospects of reaching a re-unification solution on the basis of a BBF.

4.] We agree that after the end of this one year time-table (I know you like this word) for negotiations, if there is still no agreement between the two communities for re-unification, we will close the re-unification chapter, call the quits and both sides accept recognized partition, simultaneously with the return by the UN to the RoC of the areas which will be in its control since 1 year earlier.

5.] Those TCs residing in the areas that will be returned by the UN to the RoC, will have an option to either stay as RoC citizens that they are, under a revised constitution on the basis of one man one vote -i.e. without separate TC communal rights; or they will have the right to move into the 18.4% of the areas which will form the recognized independed TC state ("TRNC.")

6.] The international community will provide funding for the re-settlement of these people, as well as for any compensation to GCs that will permanently lose their properties situated inside the recognized "TRNC!"

7.] The RoC will agree not to have any saying or objections to your membership as a separate country into any international organization or into the EU.


How do you find such an agreement, would you and the leadership of your community agree to it, and if not, please explain why?

Any other TC is free to express their opinion of the above, within the framework of the above questions placed for VP to answer.

Kifeas,

This time it is REALLY me who's speaking on your proposal.

I do like your idea very much. What's there to lose by trying out your proposal.? Of course the TC's will risk letting go land that does not belong to us anyway, but look what we would be getting back in return...if not BBF, a full Independence with full recognition.

Here are the problems as I see it. I do not believe the TC's or Turkey wants a full Independent "TRNC". They would much rather have a BBF with the 70%-30% split and all legal cases against Turkey dropped, as well as use the "wealth" of the RoC to benefit the "TRNC" financially, economically as well as politically. Just how would you draw the dividing line on the Cyprus map to show 18% of "TRNC" with 25% coastline. The only way that can happen, would be to make several areas and towns purely TC surrounded by the RoC. Also, are the GC's willing to give up Kyrenia, because I'm sure the TC's would like to keep that "treasured city" for their tourism and prestige. I'm afraid a lot of our problems of not achieving peace has to do with land and not security and when your proposal is not accepted by the TC's, you will know why.