Cyprus-Forum.com

[Piratis]

cymart, I see you take word for word everything that Politis, clearly one of the 2 most anti-Papadopoulos newspapers (along with Cyprus-Mail) says.

Papadopoulos did what he had to do with the Annan plan.


The Annan plan was the plan created to solve the problem Turkey would have with her EU accession if Cyprus had entered the EU with no solution to the Cyprus problem. Or you think it was a coincidence that they rushed to apply that plan right before we entered the EU?

If we had accepted that plan, there would be no Cyprus Republic anymore. It would just be 2 separate countries in all respects with the only difference that this two countries would join the EU as supposedly one country, ensuring that Greek Cypriots would not be able to present any obstacle to the EU accession of Turkey - since TCs would obviously veto any such effort.

For 7% of land that they might have given us back, we would have signed off the 29% of our island forever to the Turks, and we would give to to Turkey, via their 18% minority in Cyprus, a total control over the whole of Cyprus.

Our rights not only they would not be legally guaranteed, but on the contrary we would sign them away. All cases would have to be dropped from the ECHR, Turkey would not have to pay even a cent, while any compensations given would be from us to us.

Cymart, we have already established 2 things:
1) You are not a Cypriot and you do not care about Cyprus
2) All you care about is the money you think you would personally get.

So spare us the lame accusations against Papadopoulos. Our economy is doing good. Low inflation, low unemployment, higher development rate, lower financial deficit. Everything.

And you are the most hypocrite ever if you call Cyprus a "Banana Republic" while at the same time you support the Annan plan that would create in Cyprus some undemocratic system that exist nowhere else, where people would have different rights based on their race (happens in NO country since Apartheid collapsed in South Africa), where the "head" of state would be some council, and where the judges of the Supreme Court would be foreigners. So according to you what Annan plan would create would not be a Banana Republic but what we have now is?

Here, go read what Politis will not tell you (and probably you don't want to listen since you only care about your own pocket and nothing else)

http://unannanplan.agrino.org/

[oranos64]

cymart, what you said about the army is besides the point. The point here is that we gave 26 months of our lives to serve this country, and we still go 3-4 times a year to various exercises. We do this for our country, unless you are going to tell me that we gained lots of $$$$ by being in the army during 2+ of the best years of our lives.

Then of course there are those others that would find a million of excuses to avoid doing anything for their country. Fortunately they are a minority.

Sure, we are all human and we all care about our well being, to have fun and everything else. This doesn't mean we care only about ourselves and not about our country, does it?

Most Cypriots care about their country and they are willing to make sacrifices for it. Yes, after 33 years of occupation where no justice is served many people are disappointed and angry, and their hope for a just solution has been changed to hate and nationalism. This is natural for a country under occupation. What did you expect exactly? Love for the invadors? (and lets face it, the majority of TCs have always supported the occupation)

About the future: It is clear that an agreed just solution can not be found. Turkey and TCs will accept nothing short of partition where they will gain a disproportionately large part of land and power.
So no, there will not be a solution any time soon. This doesn't mean we have to sign away our lands to the Turks. Our ancestors have been under the Ottomans for 3+ centuries under far worst conditions and they didn't just choose the easy way out of becoming Muslims and forgetting what they really are.
Maybe we lost 37% of the land, but don't ask us to loose our decency. The balance of power keeps changing and it is certain that it will not always favor the Turks. Once the balance of power will shift the Turks will not afford to enforce this illegality on Cyprus EU soil. All we have to do until then is one thing: Not to sign away our land and our rights.
This might take 10 or 20 or 30 years. Our ancestors have waited for far more. The people of mainland Greece and the other Greek islands have waited for 4 centuries until they were liberated. Freedom doesn't come easy.

The question is: Do YOU care about Cyprus? If you start the excuses of the kind "but nobody cares, the teenagers, blah blah blah" the answer is NO you don't. But be sure that there are many, the majority, that do care even if you can not see it in the surface because they are simply tired of demanding their rights when nobody listens.

Boys it my fault this army thing began ...and so therefore i would like to adress the subject and give my view to you guys

first of all i respect Get real and every cypriot for giving up 26 months or whatever days of your lives to the national guard and then getting a career but lets look at the national guard more closely and addresses it duty
also before we begin ...those of the forum who know will back me on this

my qualifications
i am ex british miltary ,i have been to IRAQ ,KOSOVO AND WORK IN PRIVATE ESCORT WORK FOR DIPLOMATS
MY EMPLOYERS ARE PILIGRIMS GLOBAL ,U.N and the orthodox church (i escorted and protected serbs in kosovo in 99/01 on three occasions

my current duties ,i am studying and working in CLOSE QUARTER /LOCAL COMBATIVES and basically that means i study and train with the best military combat instructors in the world ,developing new programs and taking a internet nerd and turning into a combat soldier with a brain (non US PROGRAMS I GUESS)

SO LETS ADDRESS THE NATIONAL GUARD

Its duty is to provide security to the Greek cypriot people ,train troops for warfare ,provide them with adequate training ,information on warfare ,emergency responces ,purchase necassary equipement within its budget ,provide guards along the green lines and across sea areas to guard vunerable areas from sea assault and protect and advise civilians in emergencies ...

train the soldier ,make him fit ,make work in a team ,learn to communicate and act according to isntruction ,learn his weapons ,and in war ,make sure he is condition for the realties ...

in return ,clothe ,bed ,protect and nuture men into combat ready civillians ,who respect their nation and recognise sacriface for their families freedom whilst recieving soem monies (barely enought for their water consumption)

Histroy
the national guard was set up after 74 ...it was not a continaution of the cyprus army before then . why ? the new army was set up under instructions by the ROC AND GREECE .the problem here is ....it was not recognised by NATO,UN etc ..why ...

well the ARMY was disbanded pre 74 ....this army was mainly Greek cyps ...financed and supplied by GREECE AND CYPRUS GREEKS ...some people betrayed cyprus with their friends from greeks (please see junta) and MTM

NATO recognises us as having only a militia ...so ....no weapons can be sold to us by NATO nations except Greece ,no AMERICAN ,NO BRITISH NO GERMAN ...SPECIFICALLY U.S (U.S supplies 75% OF THE WEAPONS TO OUR NEIGHBOUR TURKEY )
Now Turkey though supplies to TRNC with weapons from its army ..because the army there is Turkish and run by Turkish generals...
they demand discipline and the soldiers cannot get parents to call in and get them out of duty ...the soldier is train to respect his seniors ,guard his base constantly and learn to admire his nation and people .. this is certainly the case of a good 80% of troops (i have studied and watch the troops train on kyrenia mountain .)compare that to the butter boys on the south side.

Now as we are none NATO , this also means ..our army does not have proper training programs ..only those greece can give us .. ...so we learn from Greece AND THE QUALITY AND DISCIPLINE IS ERODED

officers train there came back and well here comes the problem

they try to teach 18 year kids how to march,.hold a gun .....run ,train like a soldier...whilst the same kid is talking on his mobile phone ,etc

the cypriot army ,..has no discipline ...Greece has and it is enforeced ,CYPRUS has no disciplinen.if you shout or force discipline .the soldier /waste of oxygen gets on the phone to daddy or relative to complain ..why is this ....butter soft nation ....

now the other problem we have is

that during those 26 months etc ...what is taught ....? nothing ...mechaised units get some 4 weeks training on a tank ...but when do they do manuverves ?

infrantry some field training but mainly guard duty ? from who ...Turkish cypriots already work in the south and some built the bases ...so are we guarding against spies ,local gangs ,UFOS ,NINJAS WHAT ...WE Already know this summer that most of the guards dont even fire their weapons at approching invaders ...so they are not following orders or basic training .

i did U.N test with the national guard last year ...how long could a mobile unit drive and surround a hill 1 kilo metre away SO HERES A comparion OF time (5 tanks and 2 light vechiles ,1 truck of troops and 1 cannon unit )

TO MOBILSE FROM INSTRUCTION TO DEPLOYMENT
Germany army -42 mins
UK - 20mins
france 40mins
Turkish army - 1 hour
Greek - 47 mins
GREEK CYPS - 2 hours 11 minutes - why ... none of soldiers could get organised in less than 25 mintues (equipment )
the tanks could not be driven according to training STANDARDS by senior officers (EVEN THOUGH MY ASSISTANT ASK FOR TRAINED STAFF)
1 of the land rovers ,was painted two days befoe and the doors were painted over and could not open !!

test 2
vechiles on the road ,one loses a tire ...how long to change tire aNd regroup

all nations 14minutes at worse (British 8 mins )
Greek cyp - 60minutes (officers made too many mistakes ) 2 attempt left the base without proper tire changing kit ) SOLDIERS ALSO DIDNT KNOW WHERE TO BEGIN ...GREAT ...

3. TEST THREE GROUND LAUNCHERS TO FIRE AT 4 TARGETS OVER A 5 KILO AREA
,TARGETS GIVEN OVER RADIO

ALL NATIONS APPROX TIME 40MINS ,ACCURACY 75% ..BRITAIN TOP
Greek cyp target .... 1 hour - accuracy - 40% ,problem ...soldiers recieved instruction there and then ...total time to completion 3 hours

only good results ...OEK came up 3rd best out of 25 nations in test (because them boys are disciplined and train hard ...proving that we can do it )
the list goes on ..but you can see a pattern emerging ...Greek cyps dont practise defending or combat readiness ...and infrantry units are a joke

NEXT subject NIKI FOROS - OR WASTE OF TIME AS SOME CALL IT

LARNCA AREA - UNITS 192,291,612,613 - TOTAL NUMBER OF MEN - 450
SPENT LAST WEEK IN FARM LAND CAMPING FOR 3 DAYS ...THATS IT

NO TRAINING ,NO SKILLS LEARNT ,NO COMBAT SKILLS JUST EATING,SLEEPING AND SHITTING IN THE WOODS (NO CHANGE FOR SOME ) WHAT WAS THE POINT OF THIS ? DID THE NATIONAL GUARD HAVE A PLAN ... I ASKED THEM ...NO WE DIDNT ...

SO FOR THE MEDIA THEY TOLD THE SOLDIERS /MEN THERE TO LIE


SHOULD THE MEDIA COME AND THEY WOULD BE GIVEN TIME OUT

basic training for tank units complied with standard requirements for basics (in other words ..tanks units did the combat training requirements NATO units do in their first two weeks ..nothing more ...

NOWI know the LOK AND OEK GUYS TRAIN ...BUT What are we training for ...manuverves in woods ....sorry pal ...every war over the past few years (50 ) has mainly been fought in the city ..indeed ...Turkish troops train to parachuting programs in cities (land,screen and capture drills )because they will .if we ever fought ..fight in the citys/towns ..so why are soldiers taught camoflague in woods only etc ...

why dont we train in the towns like we in other nato countries ..heck we can use the same program the TA use in the SBA

you see what i am saying is ....the national guard uncluding the death of the young guy this week are ruining and wasting lives with inadequate training and a lack of organised programs

Dont listen to the bullshit on TV on rik on sunday ...i train soldiers and civilians ...i am more than happy to teach any cypriot my skills and knowledge ...dont ask the government for 350million a year to feed yourselves adn waste the lives of these men

Isreals are the same as us ...there army is higly trained from officer to general they work togeather ,the soldier is taught from day one ,why he is there but they are also trained to be MEN ...they learn about anything sensible from DIETS - TO TRAINING FOR HEALTH ... FROM HAND TO HAND COMBAT TO PATROLS ...THEY DONT JUST DO GUARD WORK ...they learn LIFE SKILLS .they become citizens ...

this cost nothing ...all the national guard needs to do is stop and think

develop programs , or go professional and get us all in for 6 months hard training and enough of this brain numbing 26 months of boredom

finally some of you may think i am being harsh ...but a young man died this week from exhaustion ..it was caused by fatigue ..by mismanagement of human resources and again by employing young kids to do respsonble jobs ...

the national guard said we will no use officers instead to drive trucks ...is that going to bring my friend back ....

no ...it is time the national guard ...changed or gave up the job

i would happily take over and train all cypriots and give them something sensible in order to learn how to defend their land from enemies foreign and domestic ...not this waste of time and energy ...real training ...

FINAL PARTING SHOT ...OEK are our special forces ,trained for all problems ...should teorrist hold a plane of hostages ...they would be the asked to tackle the issue with state specialist police (MUDD)...programs taught to us over the past years have cost cyprus $8million ..

so why did the minister of defence ask ...recently that should cyprus have a issue ...whether britain would supply SAS ...COST ..$ 4 million for support ...why because they dont want to make the OEK pros and pay them a real wage and treat them like men ...

WHEN ITS ALL SAID ...I SAY THIS ...I QUALIFY AS THE MOST SENIOR RANKED COMBATIVES INSTRUCTOR IN 2009...I CANT WAIT TO TAKE OVER ...CANT WAIT TO HAVE TRAINING SESSIONS WITH THEM MEDAL WEARING GREEK CYPRIOTS ...
I LOVE THEM ALL AND RESPECT THEM ...BUT BOY ...ARE THINGS GOING TO CHANGE

[Get Real!]

the cypriot army ,..has no discipline ...Greece has and it is enforeced...

Where was Greece’s discipline when Turkey grabbed her rocks in the Aegean?

TO MOBILSE FROM INSTRUCTION TO DEPLOYMENT
UK - 20mins

If the British army is so good how come its getting its ass whooped so badly in south Iraq?

Isreals are the same as us ...there army is higly trained from officer to general they work together...

Again... Israel got whooped so bad by Hezbollah that they are still at a loss how more than a year later!

The bottom line, what looks good on paper may not necessarily be good in real life.

[oranos64]

the cypriot army ,..has no discipline ...Greece has and it is enforeced...

Where was Greece’s discipline when Turkey grabbed her rocks in the Aegean?

TO MOBILSE FROM INSTRUCTION TO DEPLOYMENT
UK - 20mins

If the British army is so good how come its getting its ass whooped so badly in south Iraq?

Isreals are the same as us ...there army is higly trained from officer to general they work together...

Again... Israel got whooped so bad by Hezbollah that they are still at a loss how more than a year later!

The bottom line, what looks good on paper may not necessarily be good in real life.

YOU SEEM CONFUSED AND OBIOVIOUSLY PLAYING TOO MUCH MEDAL OF HONOUR

1 BRITISH TROOPS ARE GETTING WHOOP ..ERRR ...WHERE DO YOU GET THAT FROM ....THEY HAVE ENTIRE AREAS PINNED DOWN ...AND THEY LOSED LIKE 67 SOLIDERS IN THE LAST 12 MONTHS ..7OOO IRAQI INSURGENTS DEAD ....

AFGAN - 14 DEAD ....10K DEAD ... I THINK THAT SPEAKS FOR ITSELF

GREECE - LOST AIRCRAFT ...AND THEY FACED A BETTER FORCE AT THAT MOMENT ...YOU KNOW THE DETAILS ...ARE YOU SAYING THAT GREEK CYPS WOULD BE BETTR - IF IT WAS GREEK CYPS ,THEY WOULD HAVE SUNK THEIR OWN SHIPS (EVER SEEN THAT PLANE ON THE GREEN LINE FULL OF GREEK COMMANDOS ...SHOT BY US GREEK CYPS ...IT WAS 40 FEET FROM THE GROUND ...BIG HELENIC FLAG ON IT ...DIVS )

ISREALIS LOST - ERR ..NO SON ...THEY WON THAT BATTLE ...THERE AIM WAS TO DESTROY THERE ENEMIES GROUND POSTIONS AND INFRASTRURE ...THEY DID IT ...ISREALI INTELLIGENCE WANTED 14 THINGS COMPLETED WITHIN 2 WEEKS IT DRAGGED ON ...

AND ....LEBABNON SADLY IS BACK BY 20 YEARS ...I THINK YOU WILL FIND THEY DID VERY WELL AND DONT COMPARE TO US ..IF THE CYPS DID THAT ...THEY WOULD PROBABLY BOMB THEIR OWN TROOPS ...

I THINK YOU NEED TO UNDERSTAND AND LIKE ME BE UNBIASED ....DONT COMPARE CYPRUS ARMY TO OTHERS ...WE NEED AN ARMY THAT DOES ITS JOB ....LIKE I SAID ...HOW CAN YOU CALL IT AN ARMY ...WHEN IT DOES EXACTLY THE OPPOSITE AND DOESNT EVEN GUARD ITS HOME

GR ...DONT TALK TO ME ABOUT COMBAT OR MILITARY TACTICS ...JUST KNOW THAT IF WE DO HAVE ONE ...I AM MORE THAN KNOWLEDGED AND THE HEAD OF NATIONAL GUARD KNOWS THAT ...HENCE I AM IN THE KNOW ...AND IN THE RIGHT CIRCLES ..WHILST YOU GUYS DREAM

ALSO UNLIKE MOST OF YOUR PURE GREEK CYPS,RACIST TYPES ..I AM PREPARED TO DIE FOR MY COUNTRY ....CYPRUS NEEDS ME

X

[cymart]

I had no idea when I first posted this subject that it would arose so much acrimony but at least we have exchanged some useful ideas and information!
Politis covers a number of other issues apart from the latest political news such as the question of missing persons on both sides which is a humanitarian matter that should have been solved years ago.Some time ago there was an excellent and extensive report on the massacre of Turkish Cypriot women and children in Mesaoria in August 1974 by EOKA B thugs,as well as those in Asha committed byTurkish extremists against Greek Cypriot civilians-where are the culprits today?As far as I know none of them have been punished on either side or even reprimanded!Cyprus desperately needs a truth and reconciliation committee like they had in South Africa after apartheid so that people here can confess their past crimes, forgive each other for their wrongdoings. and then move on to build a better futureA guy called Tony Angastiniotis very bravely made a film on the events of 74 mentioned above but so far, no t.v. station on this side has shown it,which is a great pity.
Further about Politis,Ghalanos interview last Sunday about the need for' the masks to fall on the Cyprus problem' could not offend anyone and it ws very factual.
I have never talked about money,and if I cared about it so much I could earn many times what I make here in many other countries with the knowledge and qualifications I have so I don't think this is an issue.
Even if they were given the option tomorrow,how many refugees would even want to return to the north after spending over 30 years here,especially the new generation who have their lives and homes and families on this side and have never known anywhere else?O.K. about half at most might consider going back,the old ones out of sentimentality and others who have extensive property in places like Varosha etc.I can give the names of many people I know personally and who share this view and by no means all of them are rich on this side either!So the refugee issue can be resolved by compromise and compensation too.
And if Papad. has really had a change of heart in the last few days,it seems we may finally have seen sense and be heading in that direction,at last!Whether he is just using this as a ploy to snooker his election opponents or whether he has genuinely realised that being akward and inflexible wins you no friends and has not helped our cause etc. I don't know but in any case I sincerely wish that his gestures will be rewarded,although Turkeys generals are not exactly in a nice mood at the moment so it could be badly timed!
Open Ledra street,knock down all the barriers and let's all just go over and shake hands with everyone,including the Turkish soldier conscripts,and tell them they can go home because we've all come to our senses at last and can work things out between us as Cypriots,not Greeks and not Turks and this time we will do a decent job and behave properly towards each other!Thanks for 'keeping the peace' guys but your mission is over now so off you go!

[DT.]

Morally and legally you may be right Phoenix,but that still does not excuse all the other not so pleasant traits I have written about earlier!And quite frankly,if I knew nothing about the situation and just booked a holiday from the U.K. to Paphos or Limassol,I doubt if I would ever find out about the occupation etc etc.I don't think the people at this end of the island are in the least bit worried about it as long as the money keeps rolling in and that is much a part of the Cyprus problem as everything else!Very few people here in Paphos would be in the least concerned if the present status-quo becomes permanent and quite .a few have told me this openly!
No doubt this explains their so- called 'patriotism' and support for Papad.and his cronies!By demanding the sky,they realise he will get nothing and this suits them perfectly!I can still remember their sarcastic remarks about the possible return of Varosha etc. just before the referendum in 2004!!

you're kidding right? We came to the point of the northern state swearing allegiance to Ataturk in their constitution,Turkey having more gaurantee rights than before, ahope of Turkey moving out within a very long timeframe and we still harp on about how we should have accepted all this? This is asking for the sky?

We've got our Y fronts down to our ankles and we're asking for a little vaseline and some of you think we're asking for the sky!!!

[cymart]

Like getting the E.U. to be the guarantors instead as we will all be members in both north and south,or at least giving them superior powers over Greece and Turkey.Much as I can sympathise with the Turkish Cypriots concerns about security etc. there cannot be any justification for keeping a massive army from Turkey on a small island like this so there must be a definite and guaranteed timetable for their withdrawal which is acceptable to all sides here.
It has already been proven since 2003 that Greek and Turkish Cypriots can and still do,even if to a lesser extent than initially,visit each other and behave as civilised human beings without any problem and I'm sure a mixed nationality police force could allay any mutual worries and concerns that anyone has.
No compromise agreement can ever work unless both sides are committed to it sincerely,just like the new U.N. secretary general who has said he will not start a new round of negotiations unless he is first convinced that all parties are genuinely interested in finding a solution.So at the end of the day it's all down to us folks!This is what we have been demanding so now we are being given the chance,can we take advantage of it?Signs during the last few days from both sides seem to indicate that we may at last be moving in this direction and I really pray this time it will lead somewhere!

[phoenix]

..and that will be the Cypriot army will it? - when exactly have you NOT been ruled / governed/ owned/ invaded by 'foreigners'? (except 1960 - 74 - and you cocked that up)

You are showing yourself to be a thoroughly obnoxious character. Have you come to Cyprus to laugh at our plight? Is that how you get your kicks. You sad pathetic bullying little Britainer!

We are a small Nation that happens to be in one of the most desirable spots on the planet and that's why vermin like you cannot stay away from us. It's you and your kind that have caused the most misery on our island in the last few hundred years.

Stop spreading your poisonous words all over the forum about my island. I live in the UK and for all its major faults and embarrassing misdemeanors that it feels the need to spread across the world I do not systematically go around trying to put down its natives or turn anyone against it.

Why are you trying to destroy the good name of the Cypriot people?

If you can't say something nice, just be quiet or go back!

[cymart]

Britans 'divide and rule' policy has brought misery to many countries,India and Pakistan being a good example where the problems it created are still causing trouble today...In the case of Cyprus,Churchill promised the Cypriots self-rule in return for joining the Allies in World War two,only to have it denied by Anthony Eden in the 50's when the Suez crisis started etc!So I would be a bit sensitive on this issue if I were you as many Cypriots feel we cheated them by going back on our promises!We also deliberately set the Turkish Cypriots and Greek-Cypriots against each other when they started the EOKA campaign,by using the Turks in the Police force and local government administration etc. and also encouraging Turkey to take an interest in Cyprus to counter the Greek-Cypriots campaign for union with Greece!The terrible truth is that both communities on this island had got along without any major problems or division for centuries until then and we opened a can of worms which has still not been closed.The Cold War also meant that our bases were of vital strategic significance here-and still are-so there is no likelihood of us giving them up and the Cypriots grudgingly accept this.
From another viewpoint,and one which many older Cypriots have also said they agree with,Makarios made a fatal mistake in not accepting the Radcliffe proposals in the 1950's which would have given the island self-rule internally with only foreign policy and defence being controlled by Britain.Unfortunately Grivas had also just arrived here to start the EOKA campaign then so Makarios probably felt he could not go against public opinion and rejected our offer.Another similar situation occurred about 10 years later when he also rejected demands for a NATO base in Karpasia,insisting that Cyprus remained 'non-aligned'.Looking back on what has happened since then,obviously most Cypriots would have preferred the Radcliffe solution to partition and 40.000 Turkish troops in the north etc. as well as colonisation by Turkish Immigrants and the loss of nearly 40% of the island!
Without wishing to offend people here,Cyprus is still a politically immature country-after all they have never really had the chance to develop as an independent nation,apart from a couple of years after 1960 until the problems started in 1963.It is also very controversial whether Makarios decision to unilaterally amend the constitution regarding the rights of the Turkish Cypriots then was his most fatal error-even Greece warned him not to-as it gave those in Turkey who favoured partition here the perfect excuse to start trouble and ever since then things have gone downhill fast.
Geo politics are often far more important than local politics and the failure of the Cypriots to understand them and the wider issues which affect their country has often made them unable to realise and exploit opportunities to gain allies and friends abroad which they so vitally need if they are ever going to find a just solution.
We have done a lot wrong here in the past,but on the other hand we have also invested billions here in tourism and property which the economy would be in very dire straits without so there are two sides to the coin,as is so often the case.

[cymart]

Since 1974 there have been several lost opportunities,not only to get back Varosha,but even worse, to get a deal overall that would have been more favourable for us than the final version of the Annan Plan which we turned down.When Denktash suddenly opened the border in April 2003,the government here were taken by surprise and had no idea how to handle the situation!So people ignored the politicians and did what they felt was best-thousands of them queued at the crossing points for their first chance to visit the north since 1974 and we had our own Berlin 9 November 1989 in Cyprus!I still believe that if the government had responded differently and reciprocated in the right way,the problem here would have been solved within a matter of months.For the first time the Turkish Cypriots had dared to demonstrate openly against Denktash and his Ankara backed regime and international pressure was on Turkey due to their application for an opening date for E.U. accession talks.This continued until late 2004 and if we had gone to the final rounds of negotiations before the referendum with the attitude that we wanted a solution but also demanded changes to what was presented as the final version of the Plan,Turkey would have been forced to show flexibility and to agree to at least some of our demands.Unfortunately,the government of Papandreou and Simitis in Greece who had been very involved in the process lost the election and Karamanlis,their successor kept a very low profile.Clerides in Cyprus had also failed to win the extra 15 months he requested in office and attended the negotiations only as an observer and could not make any binding decisions which were now in the hands of Papadopoulos who had apparently already decided that the Greek-Cypriots would reject the plan overall ,rather than use the prevailing international climate to try to get Turkey to make more concessions.Rather than refuse to hold the referendum unless more time was allowed for further negotiations,and knowing that the climate among the Greek-Cypriots in Cyprus was already against the deal following intensive campaigning against it by Lillikas etc. he went ahead with the referendum after using a very melodramatic and staged television address to ensure a 'no' vote!He thus shifted the responsibility onto the people,although I do not consider that he is the only culprit for developing the attitude here that prevailed.This responsibility rests with every government here since 1974 to a greater or larger extent, and I will enlarge on this very important point another time.
But I am still convinced that if we had played our cards differently in 2004 we could have got an acceptable compromise deal with the international climate that was then prevailing, especially as we were due to enter the E.U. and had favourable support from many countries at that time,while Turkey were clearly under pressure...