Cyprus-Forum.com

[Bananiot]

Paschos Mandravelis, in Kathimerini, not a member of Synaspismos, or LAOS.

Σ' αυτή τη χώρα σκοτωνόμαστε για την Ιστορία. Αν κανείς τολμήσει να αναγνώσει διαφορετικά ένα ιστορικό συμβάν, θα είναι «προδότης» ή «ανθέλλην». Πολλοί απέκτησαν ιδιαίτερη ευαισθησία ακόμη και στις λέξεις. Καταστράφηκαν χιλιάδες δένδρα για να τυπωθούν επιχειρήματα κατά του «συνωστισμού στην αποβάθρα της Σμύρνης». Ξοδεύονται εκατομμύρια λεπτά τηλεοπτικού χρόνου για να στηλιτευτεί κάθε απόπειρα προσβολής της Ιστορίας μας από εσωτερικούς και εξωτερικούς παραχαράκτες της.

[alexISS]

Come on my friend! Go to any Greek school, anywhere in the world, and claim that what we are told about 25th March 1821 is a lie. You will be booted to hell in no mean way.

That's exactly what my history teacher did and nothing happened to him. When was the last time you visited Greece because, from what you say, I form the impression you're talking about Greece in the 60s. In any case, even if they're not told at school, the public knows of the "other" views through the media or other means. Try to find a single person that is not aware of the view that "krifo scholeio" was a myth, you won't.

One last thing. Because AKEL is the biggest party in Cyprus, I take it that AKEL's view of history is the correct one, so history is just a matter of geography, among else.

No. People voted for AKEL despite their view of history. That too proves that people are more open minded than you think

[Bananiot]

Mandravelis lives in Greece, no?

[alexISS]

Paschos Mandravelis, in Kathimerini, not a member of Synaspismos, or LAOS.

Σ' αυτή τη χώρα σκοτωνόμαστε για την Ιστορία. Αν κανείς τολμήσει να αναγνώσει διαφορετικά ένα ιστορικό συμβάν, θα είναι «προδότης» ή «ανθέλλην». Πολλοί απέκτησαν ιδιαίτερη ευαισθησία ακόμη και στις λέξεις. Καταστράφηκαν χιλιάδες δένδρα για να τυπωθούν επιχειρήματα κατά του «συνωστισμού στην αποβάθρα της Σμύρνης». Ξοδεύονται εκατομμύρια λεπτά τηλεοπτικού χρόνου για να στηλιτευτεί κάθε απόπειρα προσβολής της Ιστορίας μας από εσωτερικούς και εξωτερικούς παραχαράκτες της.

So did anyone call Mandravelis a traitor? I'm sure you are aware of the fact that the people that accuse others of being "traitors" are anything but moderate and "average"

[Paphitis]

Of course the Italians were no cowards. If they were, the Greek victories would lose much of their shine, according to the logic of Piratis. We have an inner need for the Greeks to triumph against all odds and hence, all our military victories were achieved against much stronger, more populous armies, perhaps with a little bit of help from our God (we have a personal God, the God of the Greeks) ... so pathetic!

It is getting really silly, every time Piratis claims that the truth is simply a matter of statistics. Will he ever grow out of this habit?

Piratis is good enough to answer for himself. However, I do not know of many Greeks that exaggerate the truth in order to glorify their accomplishments.

That aside, Greece has achieved some remarkable military feats in its history. The War of Independence and the Greco-Italian War in 1940 are just 2 examples of that, and these accomplishments are recognised the world over. Greece has also had its fair share of defeats, and the Anatolia Campaign of 1922 is a clear example of this.

This is no different to any other other country, from Turkey, Britain, US, Germany, Australia, Japan etc etc. All have had astounding military successes against all odds, and all have had their fair share of military flops.

But classifying Greece as a 'military war machine' is OTT, and classifying entire races as "cowardly" just because they were defeated when perhaps they should not have been, is just pure nonsense.

[Paphitis]

Being able to diverge from the stereotype view is what wide horizons means. Perhaps you know this already but this is another story. Theodorides's evaluation makes more sense to me than the glorification of war and the sending of thousands of young people to be butchered by two confirmed fascists, Metaxas and Musolini.

Musolini was the one intending to invade and occupy Greece on behalf of its ally, Germany. Metaxas was left with no other choice but to try and defend his nation, and this is what he successfully did in 1940.

How is Metaxas glorifying war? Perhaps he should have capitulated so that no young Greek was butchered, but this could have had far reaching consequences for all allied nations, which I am sure even you could not accept.

[Bananiot]

So did anyone call Mandravelis a traitor? I'm sure you are aware of the fact that the people that accuse others of being "traitors" are anything but moderate and "average"

If not, why did he write about it then? Perhaps you are referring to Piratis?

[alexISS]

So did anyone call Mandravelis a traitor? I'm sure you are aware of the fact that the people that accuse others of being "traitors" are anything but moderate and "average"

If not, why did he write about it then? Perhaps you are referring to Piratis?

Bananiot, it's obvious that Mandravelis is not talking about the average Greek, but the ultra-nationalist minority which, unfortunately, has a voice level disproportional to their percentage.

No, I'm not referring to Piratis or anybody else. I've never called anyone a traitor and whoever has has only proven his own arrogance by considering himself more "patriotic" than another. I'd never doubt your love for your homeland just because your opinion on what is best for it is different than mine. And neither does the moderate majority, both in Greece and in Cyprus