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What happened to flight MH370?

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Re: What happened to flight MH370?

Postby Demonax » Thu Mar 20, 2014 12:03 am

^^^^
In a second email, this pilot expanded on how he is thinking about what might have happened:
I don’t know what happened to MH370 any more than anyone else who wasn’t aboard. But here’s how my head works with this. I try to find the simplest, least complex explanation that works with ALL THE AVAILABLE FACTS/INFORMATION, and that doesn’t need “added” leaps or assertions or events to have happened that we do not have any info about.

For instance, several things point to an “event,” not an “accident.” The lack of communication, the programmed turn, the climb to FL450 and descent to FL250, and the continuation of the aircraft’s existence as a whole object, powered and uncrashed, for about seven-plus hours after the disappearance.

The plane's ACARS and transponder were physically shut off, by some accounts before the last radio communication from the crew. We know that the aircraft remained powered and in controlled flight for many hours after this point. The aircraft’s route of flight in the FMS was changed by someone in the cockpit, as was its altitude, both up and down. There was no Mayday issued, and the aircraft did not answer repeated radio calls from ATC.

Let’s look at a smoke or fire “accident.” I do not believe, based on what we know now, that there was smoke or a fire. Why? Because there is no indication of fire, or smoke in the cockpit, during the time the aircraft was still in contact, and there is no indication of "fire" behavior in the aircraft's flight path. Additionally, normal emergency protocols train the crew to immediately don and wear full-face O2 masks (the B777 is equipped with them), and designate one pilot to fly and talk to everyone (aviate and communicate) while the other pilot runs the checklist and fights the problem. The plane made a sharp left turn, toward land, soon after ATC communication was lost. This was shown to have been pre-programmed into the FMS by the pilots.

The flying pilot’s job in an emergency such as this would be to point the airplane at the closest acceptable runway, announce to the world the nature of the emergency (ATC) and request help, and begin a descent so that at some point during the process, an attempt to vent the smoke from the cabin could be done.

Basically, none of this was done. This leads me to believe that there was no emergency of this type. For this type of emergency to be in play, it indicates that the cockpit crew would have had to willfully refuse to follow their training and checklists to combat the emergency.

Airborne smoke and fire emergencies are extremely serious, and are trained for by every airline crew in the world. In the wake of Swissair 111, which crashed off the coast of Nova Scotia, we know that a flight crew has a very limited period of time in which they must land the plane before disaster ... only 14 minutes in the Swissair tragedy ... yet MH370 continued to fly for more than seven hours after contact was lost. This is yet another clue that points away from an in-flight physical, mechanical, or other type of emergency.

There is evidence that Malaysia Airlines crews often allowed passengers onto the flight deck during flight, which is an indication both of lax safety and security procedures to my western way of thinking, but may be totally permissible at Malaysia Airlines. The FO had allowed some pretty girls to sit in the cockpit during a flight last year. His captain did not protest. This anecdotal info could lend credence to the idea of hijackers gaining access to the flight deck after takeoff.

To my eye, a fire/smoke emergency does not fit what we currently know.

Neither does a missile, engine failure, structural failure, loss of pressurization or any other kind of “accidental” failure. This looks and sounds like a “planned event,” not an “unforeseen emergency.” Mistakes can occur, and the sad truth is that we don’t know what we don’t know … but until something comes to light that supports an “emergency” situation, the simplest and most logical explanation is that someone took control of that airplane and diverted it from it’s planned course and destination.


http://www.businessinsider.com/malaysia ... z2wRsbxWUc
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Re: What happened to flight MH370?

Postby Paphitis » Thu Mar 20, 2014 1:02 am

I totally agree with the above. All the evidence seems to point to human intervention of some sort. The Aircraft's Transponder was turned off and the aircraft was in all likelihood manually flown on a Westerly heading towards the Bay of Bengal. Military Radar had the aircraft climb to FL450 which is beyond its Operating Limit. I don 't believe the Pilots would be stupid enough to try this.

There was no Fire on Board and if there was an Electrical Fire, and if there was then an Emergency Descent would be initiate to below FL140 (14000FT) after donning Oxygen Masks. The most likely spot for an Electrical Fire is directly below the Cockpit which is where all the electronics and Nav Systems are and the pilots have access to that. There can be no Landing Gear well fire and then make the ridiculous claim that the cockpit filled with smoke. Any on board emergency would result in an immediate diversion to the nearest suitable aerodrome and certainly a descent in the case of fire or depressurization not a climb to 45000FT.

The switching of the Transponder in the STBY position or completely off is most peculiar and that indicates foul play which is directly in line with the statements made by Malaysia's Transport Minister.

The conspiracy theories sound absurd (most of them). Unfortunately, can't get around the fact that the Transponder was manipulated by someone and turned to STBY or off, or the fact that the AP was switched off to fly the aircraft to 45000 and on top of that, someone changed the course and waypoints within the Flight Management Computer in order to take up a new course. If flown at low altitude to avoid radar, fuel consumption would be high, thus range would be reduced so in my opinion the Northern Corridor is unlikely. More than likely, it flew west towards the Bay of Bengal and then South West over the Indian Ocean. Also, Malaysian may have been a bit slack with cockpit security but again, this could be my Western Attitude kicking in as mentioned earlier. I will not pass judgement.

Also, I believe the aircraft will be found. It will just take a bit of time. I have no doubt the authorities are withholding some information, probably for security reasons. The US and Australians have amazing technology, and apparently Pine Gap is being used in the search which has radomes that go all the way to the Middle East and even reach Cyprus (apparently). But these facilities are highly secretive so don't expect the US or Australia broadcast any of their secrets over the evening news.

Also, please be mindful that Radar may have picked MH370 up. For instance, it was within range of Australia's JORN but the ADF would not have paid any attention to it. The purpose of this radar is to detect threats and gather intelligence.

The information so far points to some kind of intervention. The hijacking theory is a very plausible theory so far.
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Re: What happened to flight MH370?

Postby Demonax » Thu Mar 20, 2014 5:29 am

Here's a theory which centres on a possible plot by Malaysian Islamists to blow up the Petronas Towers using a hijacked passenger aircraft.

Malaysia Airline MH370: 9/11-style terror allegations resurface in case of lost plane

Possible plot investigated after Al-Qaeda supergrass told court that four or five Malaysian men planned a passenger airliner hijack

The disclosure that Malaysians were plotting a 9/11-style attack raises the prospect that both pilots were overpowered and the plane intended for use as a fuel-filled bomb. One possible target, if the scenario is correct, will have been the Petronas Towers in Kuala Lumpur, a symbol of Malaysia’s modernity and the world’s tallest buildings from 1998 until 2004.



http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldne ... plane.html
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Re: What happened to flight MH370?

Postby Paphitis » Thu Mar 20, 2014 6:33 am

2 pieces of debris found by the RAAF in the Australian Search zone 3200 kms from Perth in a isolated 305000sq km search zone off the Australian coast.

It is not confirmed that the debris belongs to MH370 but it looks quite good.

It seems strange that Australia, US and NZ commence searching an area off the Australian coast which is completely detached from the other search zones. In my opinion, Pine Gap released information to the Australian and US governments about a flight which disappeared.

It appears that this was an act of terrorism. Possible scenarios are that MH was headed for Australia in a 911 type terrorist attack or a terrorist attack against India by Kasmiri separatists. It is evident that the airliner may have been tracked by Australia and US.

Looks like MH370 will be found, but the news is not going to be the fairy tale people wish for, unfortunately. There will be no survivors.
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Re: What happened to flight MH370?

Postby Pyrpolizer » Thu Mar 20, 2014 12:22 pm

kurupetos wrote:
Pyrpolizer wrote:Just name one country where the military radars would spot an unidentified airplane crossing their country and not signal red alarm.
Or are the Malaysians simply lying to cover their total incompetence? :wink:

Stop making a fool of yourself and read this: http://www.timesofisrael.com/ex-el-al-e ... in-mh-370/


I think you are actually making a ridicule of yourself.
Yes every country whose military is not totally incompetent (like Israel from your own link) would certainly signal red alarm in case their military radars would have spotted an unidentified aeroplane crossing their country.
Well the fact is the Malaysian Military radars did spot an unidentified aeroplane crossing their country (which almost a weak later understood it was their own missing plane) and DID NOTHING ABOUT IT in real time.
Is there anything else you did not understand Kurupette? :lol: :lol:
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Re: What happened to flight MH370?

Postby Paphitis » Thu Mar 20, 2014 12:25 pm

Pyrpolizer wrote:
kurupetos wrote:
Pyrpolizer wrote:Just name one country where the military radars would spot an unidentified airplane crossing their country and not signal red alarm.
Or are the Malaysians simply lying to cover their total incompetence? :wink:

Stop making a fool of yourself and read this: http://www.timesofisrael.com/ex-el-al-e ... in-mh-370/


I think you are actually making a ridicule of yourself.
Yes every country whose military is not totally incompetent (like Israel from your own link) would certainly signal red alarm in case their military radars would have spotted an unidentified aeroplane crossing their country.
Well the fact is the Malaysian Military radars did spot an unidentified aeroplane crossing their country (which almost a weak later understood it was their own missing plane) and DID NOTHING ABOUT IT in real time.
Is there anything else you did not understand Kurupette? :lol: :lol:


Pretty hard when the Transponder was turned off!

I think you are being to critical of the poor Malaysians. Their Government conducted themselves with lots of maturity and sensitivity during a very difficult time.

I also believe that the US and Australia led Malaysia down the garden path and knew all along where MH370 was. They knew there would be no survivors. Think about it. The Snowden Affair has been very damaging, so the US and Australian Security Agencies were not exactly going to be fully cooperative. Australia just had a major incident from spying on Indonesian Government Officials.They were not exactly going to put their hand up and say, "we know where it is".

Have a look at this! Along with Area 51 in Nevada, this is the most secretive installation in the world!

http://www.smh.com.au/world/flight-mh37 ... 352ta.html
Last edited by Paphitis on Thu Mar 20, 2014 12:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: What happened to flight MH370?

Postby Pyrpolizer » Thu Mar 20, 2014 12:27 pm

Paphitis wrote:2 pieces of debris found by the RAAF in the Australian Search zone 3200 kms from Perth in a isolated 305000sq km search zone off the Australian coast.

It is not confirmed that the debris belongs to MH370 but it looks quite good.

It seems strange that Australia, US and NZ commence searching an area off the Australian coast which is completely detached from the other search zones. In my opinion, Pine Gap released information to the Australian and US governments about a flight which disappeared.

It appears that this was an act of terrorism. Possible scenarios are that MH was headed for Australia in a 911 type terrorist attack or a terrorist attack against India by Kasmiri separatists. It is evident that the airliner may have been tracked by Australia and US.

Looks like MH370 will be found, but the news is not going to be the fairy tale people wish for, unfortunately. There will be no survivors.


The size of them looks strange i mean one is 24m and the other 5m. But then again it could be plastic hence the reason they are still floating...
We will see....
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Re: What happened to flight MH370?

Postby Pyrpolizer » Thu Mar 20, 2014 12:30 pm

Paphitis wrote:
Pyrpolizer wrote:
kurupetos wrote:
Pyrpolizer wrote:Just name one country where the military radars would spot an unidentified airplane crossing their country and not signal red alarm.
Or are the Malaysians simply lying to cover their total incompetence? :wink:

Stop making a fool of yourself and read this: http://www.timesofisrael.com/ex-el-al-e ... in-mh-370/


I think you are actually making a ridicule of yourself.
Yes every country whose military is not totally incompetent (like Israel from your own link) would certainly signal red alarm in case their military radars would have spotted an unidentified aeroplane crossing their country.
Well the fact is the Malaysian Military radars did spot an unidentified aeroplane crossing their country (which almost a weak later understood it was their own missing plane) and DID NOTHING ABOUT IT in real time.
Is there anything else you did not understand Kurupette? :lol: :lol:


Pretty hard when the Transponder was turned off!

I think you are being to critical of the poor Malaysians. Their Government conducted themselves with lots of maturity and sensitivity during a very difficult time.


Come on Paphitis you should have known better,these are secondary radars, military ones, they are not relying on the transponder.
Had they lifted say a military aircraft in time, they wouldn't need to beg the Americans, Australians etc to help them find it now...
Last edited by Pyrpolizer on Thu Mar 20, 2014 12:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: What happened to flight MH370?

Postby Paphitis » Thu Mar 20, 2014 12:35 pm

The Australians seem to be using The Australian Maritime Safety Authority as cover for finding some of the debris which has not yet been confirmed as belonging to MH370 (although it is likely INMHO).

This find had Pine Gap, CIA, NSA, ASIO, ASIC and Defence Signals Directorate written all over it! :lol:
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Re: What happened to flight MH370?

Postby Paphitis » Thu Mar 20, 2014 2:23 pm

Pyrpolizer wrote:
Paphitis wrote:
Pyrpolizer wrote:
kurupetos wrote:
Pyrpolizer wrote:Just name one country where the military radars would spot an unidentified airplane crossing their country and not signal red alarm.
Or are the Malaysians simply lying to cover their total incompetence? :wink:

Stop making a fool of yourself and read this: http://www.timesofisrael.com/ex-el-al-e ... in-mh-370/


I think you are actually making a ridicule of yourself.
Yes every country whose military is not totally incompetent (like Israel from your own link) would certainly signal red alarm in case their military radars would have spotted an unidentified aeroplane crossing their country.
Well the fact is the Malaysian Military radars did spot an unidentified aeroplane crossing their country (which almost a weak later understood it was their own missing plane) and DID NOTHING ABOUT IT in real time.
Is there anything else you did not understand Kurupette? :lol: :lol:


Pretty hard when the Transponder was turned off!

I think you are being to critical of the poor Malaysians. Their Government conducted themselves with lots of maturity and sensitivity during a very difficult time.


Come on Paphitis you should have known better,these are secondary radars, military ones, they are not relying on the transponder.
Had they lifted say a military aircraft in time, they wouldn't need to beg the Americans, Australians etc to help them find it now...


Pyrpolizer,

that is what I am saying.

Secondary Surveillance Radar would not pick it up because the Transponder was turned off. Only SSR would be paying any attention to MH370.

Primary military radars would not. Most of the time, they are manned by individuals busy sipping coffee and browsing the internet. The primary radar at RMAF Butterworth picked it up and at least another Primary radar in Thailand did as well, yet they did not release any information. The Australians would have picked it up with their JORN Radar if it was operating once MH370 was within range. Certainly, I believe Pine gap would have picked it up and that placed the US and Australia in a very difficult position.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jindalee_O ... ar_Network

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pine_Gap

It's just so convenient that Australia, US and NZ (all three countries participate in intelligence sharing with ECHELON) began searching south west of Perth. Now they are saying that it was AMSA that found the debris! Yeh right! More like CIA, NSA, ASIO, ASIC and Defence Signals Directorate! :lol: :lol: :lol:

http://www.asd.gov.au/

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Australian ... irectorate

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ECHELON

You can all thank Snowden for this debacle and such secrecy. :evil:
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