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Well well well: Cobalt Air has applied for an AoC

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Re: Well well well: Cobalt Air has applied for an AoC

Postby RichardB » Fri Oct 19, 2018 5:36 pm

Paphitis wrote:
RichardB wrote:
Paphitis wrote:
RichardB wrote:
FFS Paphitis wind yet neck in..
DT never said he was responsible for setting up Cobalt. He said he was on the board to secure funding. Something quite normal in business. Even I when setting up restaurants I employed a specialist to secure funding as they know the best places to look and get the best possible rates this is normal business practice.

You said that the backers were a company called Glencore . A 5 minute search on the internet proved you wrong and that the main investors were Chinese. ( this has in fact now been reported in many newspapers) but oh no you know better.

Also of course a CEO Can be fired

No wonder people are taking the piss.

And GR was right even in the face of overwhelming evidence you will never admit you were wrong


No I admit I was wrong. The company was owned by Chinese Interests when it went down.

But that wasn't the case in the beginning. I suggest you keep doing some internet searches.

The Chinese did not form Cobalt or own it from day 1.

Here you go. One of the principal founders of Cobalt was a chap by the name of Michael Hayden. A British Airways and QANTAS executive.

https://cyprus-mail.com/2015/12/24/72116/

These guys were involved in over 20 airline start ups world wide. In other words, Cobalt wasn't their first.

https://www.routesonline.com/news/29/br ... or-cyprus/

Other people involved were Andrew Pine. Another Australian who was involved with Cathay Pacific and Dragonair.

And Paul Kelly who was the first CEO of Cobalt who was also the CEO of Qatar Airways owned Saudi Subsidiary Jazeera Airlines and Dobrolet. This is the guy DT has claimed got sacked and had his Russian Office raided.

https://www.cyprusprofile.com/en/articl ... ed-airline


Why are you bringing up people who were there in the beginning?
Apart from you no one has brought up who was there "at the begining"
It was about who the investors were at the end.

Also please show me where DT said he was responsible for setting up Cobalt as I can't seem to find it.

A link would also be appreciated to "legislation"? Which decrees a CEO cannot be fired.


he said it here:

DT. wrote:Paphitis ffs!...stop bullshitting!! AP was fired. I served on their fucking board for 6 months I know!

And the investors were Chinese. Full stop.


AP must be Andrew Pyne. He wasn't even the CEO. The CEO was Peter Kelly not Andrew Pyne.

Yet it was Andrew Pyne that was somehow sacked when he wasn't even an employee. This is what DT said.

I am asking for evidence. I don't care whether you think CEO's can be sacked. Fact is, the main players and backers can't be sacked unless they had a rift between themselves which doesn't seem to be the case.

https://www.cyprusprofile.com/en/articl ... ed-airline

Surely it aint that difficult. If people are going to make the claim of CEO sackings and Russian Office raids, they can also provide the evidence.

I am not disputing that Cobalt is Chinese owned. Fair play. It is owned by a Chinese company and was owned by them for quite some time. But for the first few months, it was Australian owned before they all bailed out. It was these Australians that founded Cobalt and got an AOC and they flogged the company off.

What they did is set up a business, got an AOC, leased 2 A320 aircraft and sold the company in the nick of time and fucked off into the sunset. They probably thought they lost the plot and realised Cyprus is not the place to conduct this kind of business.


Andrew Pyne was CEO Cobalt for leaving 1 month after the airline started operations

Yes DT was on the board in a capacity to secure funding. He has himself said he had no responsibility in obtaining AOC let alone setting up the company.

Keep on digging
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Re: Well well well: Cobalt Air has applied for an AoC

Postby Paphitis » Fri Oct 19, 2018 5:43 pm

RichardB wrote:
Paphitis wrote:
RichardB wrote:
Paphitis wrote:
RichardB wrote:
FFS Paphitis wind yet neck in..
DT never said he was responsible for setting up Cobalt. He said he was on the board to secure funding. Something quite normal in business. Even I when setting up restaurants I employed a specialist to secure funding as they know the best places to look and get the best possible rates this is normal business practice.

You said that the backers were a company called Glencore . A 5 minute search on the internet proved you wrong and that the main investors were Chinese. ( this has in fact now been reported in many newspapers) but oh no you know better.

Also of course a CEO Can be fired

No wonder people are taking the piss.

And GR was right even in the face of overwhelming evidence you will never admit you were wrong


No I admit I was wrong. The company was owned by Chinese Interests when it went down.

But that wasn't the case in the beginning. I suggest you keep doing some internet searches.

The Chinese did not form Cobalt or own it from day 1.

Here you go. One of the principal founders of Cobalt was a chap by the name of Michael Hayden. A British Airways and QANTAS executive.

https://cyprus-mail.com/2015/12/24/72116/

These guys were involved in over 20 airline start ups world wide. In other words, Cobalt wasn't their first.

https://www.routesonline.com/news/29/br ... or-cyprus/

Other people involved were Andrew Pine. Another Australian who was involved with Cathay Pacific and Dragonair.

And Paul Kelly who was the first CEO of Cobalt who was also the CEO of Qatar Airways owned Saudi Subsidiary Jazeera Airlines and Dobrolet. This is the guy DT has claimed got sacked and had his Russian Office raided.

https://www.cyprusprofile.com/en/articl ... ed-airline


Why are you bringing up people who were there in the beginning?
Apart from you no one has brought up who was there "at the begining"
It was about who the investors were at the end.

Also please show me where DT said he was responsible for setting up Cobalt as I can't seem to find it.

A link would also be appreciated to "legislation"? Which decrees a CEO cannot be fired.


he said it here:

DT. wrote:Paphitis ffs!...stop bullshitting!! AP was fired. I served on their fucking board for 6 months I know!

And the investors were Chinese. Full stop.


AP must be Andrew Pyne. He wasn't even the CEO. The CEO was Peter Kelly not Andrew Pyne.

Yet it was Andrew Pyne that was somehow sacked when he wasn't even an employee. This is what DT said.

I am asking for evidence. I don't care whether you think CEO's can be sacked. Fact is, the main players and backers can't be sacked unless they had a rift between themselves which doesn't seem to be the case.

https://www.cyprusprofile.com/en/articl ... ed-airline

Surely it aint that difficult. If people are going to make the claim of CEO sackings and Russian Office raids, they can also provide the evidence.

I am not disputing that Cobalt is Chinese owned. Fair play. It is owned by a Chinese company and was owned by them for quite some time. But for the first few months, it was Australian owned before they all bailed out. It was these Australians that founded Cobalt and got an AOC and they flogged the company off.

What they did is set up a business, got an AOC, leased 2 A320 aircraft and sold the company in the nick of time and fucked off into the sunset. They probably thought they lost the plot and realised Cyprus is not the place to conduct this kind of business.


Andrew Pyne was CEO Cobalt for leaving 1 month after the airline started operations

Yes DT was on the board in a capacity to secure funding. He has himself said he had no responsibility in obtaining AOC let alone setting up the company.

Keep on digging


I’m not challenging whether or not DT was on the board in a financial capacity.

And I am not aware of AP being a CEO for a month. I am aware that Peter Kelky was CEO. Another Australian airline executive.

If DT was on the board, then he is aware of Cobalt’s history and how it was formed, and who formed it.

Their financial backer was another Australian company called Glencorp which is, a Cobalt miner. Hence the name Cobalt Aero. Glencorp had financial dealings with Virgin, and there is the Virgin connection as one of these guys was with Virgin Atlantic executive who formed Virgin Blue and Virgin Australia for Richard Branson.
Last edited by Paphitis on Fri Oct 19, 2018 5:53 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Well well well: Cobalt Air has applied for an AoC

Postby DT. » Fri Oct 19, 2018 5:44 pm

Paphiti,

Chill. I’ll never know why you insist on arguing with people about things they know first hand. Let it go and you’ll be better for it. And don’t get angry.
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Re: Well well well: Cobalt Air has applied for an AoC

Postby Kikapu » Fri Oct 19, 2018 5:46 pm

Paphitis wrote:And one more thing. How can a company with a fleet of 6 airbus, predict to be in profit within 9 moths? Who made these predictions and how? How do they plan to increase their revenue and lower their costs?

Wow you would have to be the best business man in the world.

here is the thing with Aviation. If you fuck an engine, then you can revise that forward estimate from 9 months to about 5 years. Especially with such a small company.

9 months is ambitious.

Do an engine on a Fokker 100 and you can buy an engine for about 1 million.

And there are plenty of Aviation businesses that are well run and will lose money. You got to have the money and willingness to fund this for the upturn plus eliminate competition and Cobalt couldn't do it.


DT stated that the company would have broken even in 9 months times had it not went under. As for profit, DT did not state any time period for that.

However, when the company was losing 30 million Euros for the each of the last 2 years from what I have read, I don't know how the company was going to make up losing 30 million Euros in the next 9 months just so to break even? Even if they were to do so, they still would have been 60 million Euros in the hole for the previous 2 year's loses. Sure, all start up companies are in the red for the first few years, but I just can't see how a budget low cost airline with fleet of 6 aircraft could possibly create such a volume in a small saturated Cyprus market to eventually go into becoming a profit making company eventually when all the time, they would have been going against other established major budget airlines? Cyprus airways couldn't do it by charging premium prices, so how could a small low budget airline?
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Re: Well well well: Cobalt Air has applied for an AoC

Postby Paphitis » Fri Oct 19, 2018 5:48 pm

DT. wrote:Paphiti,

Chill. I’ll never know why you insist on arguing with people about things they know first hand. Let it go and you’ll be better for it. And don’t get angry.


I’m not angry. I just want some evidence about the sacking of AP. Also you mentioned raids. What raids and why?
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Re: Well well well: Cobalt Air has applied for an AoC

Postby RichardB » Fri Oct 19, 2018 5:48 pm

https://www.flightglobal.com/news/artic ... ic-359490/

This is maybe what was reffered to re AP being kicked out of his offices in Russia
AND
AP was definitely CEO when Cobalt Commenced operations

Google is my friend
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Re: Well well well: Cobalt Air has applied for an AoC

Postby DT. » Fri Oct 19, 2018 5:54 pm

RichardB wrote:https://www.flightglobal.com/news/articles/avianova-sacks-ceo-and-accuses-him-of-misleading-public-359490/

This is maybe what was reffered to re AP being kicked out of his offices in Russia
AND
AP was definitely CEO when Cobalt Commenced operations

Google is my friend



Lol! Thanks Richard but let’s let the matter rest. Paphitis is getting upset and I really don’t want to do that.
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Re: Well well well: Cobalt Air has applied for an AoC

Postby Paphitis » Fri Oct 19, 2018 5:57 pm

RichardB wrote:https://www.flightglobal.com/news/articles/avianova-sacks-ceo-and-accuses-him-of-misleading-public-359490/

This is maybe what was reffered to re AP being kicked out of his offices in Russia
AND
AP was definitely CEO when Cobalt Commenced operations

Google is my friend


Right! The article said he was sacked from Avianova. He was involved with this airline.

probably this sacking is more political and associated more directly with the fallout between Australia and Russia than anything else because the accusations were "misleading the public". It sounds trumped up.

It doesn't mention he was CEO of Cobalt or was sacked by Cobalt.

Thank you btw for providing some evidence of Andrew Pyne being sacked from a Russian Airline.
Last edited by Paphitis on Fri Oct 19, 2018 6:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Well well well: Cobalt Air has applied for an AoC

Postby Paphitis » Fri Oct 19, 2018 6:00 pm

DT. wrote:
RichardB wrote:https://www.flightglobal.com/news/articles/avianova-sacks-ceo-and-accuses-him-of-misleading-public-359490/

This is maybe what was reffered to re AP being kicked out of his offices in Russia
AND
AP was definitely CEO when Cobalt Commenced operations

Google is my friend



Lol! Thanks Richard but let’s let the matter rest. Paphitis is getting upset and I really don’t want to do that.


DT, in all honesty, if you know something I don't then please let us know. I want to learn.

You were on the board. Therefore, you claim that AP was CEO and was sacked. Can you clarify this please?
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Re: Well well well: Cobalt Air has applied for an AoC

Postby RichardB » Fri Oct 19, 2018 6:04 pm

Google LinkedIn.com search Andrew pyne

Here you go ...my last word have a good day
Last edited by RichardB on Fri Oct 19, 2018 6:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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