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SETTLERS-SHALL THEY GO SHALL THEY STAY?

How can we solve it? (keep it civilized)

Postby -mikkie2- » Sat Oct 09, 2004 2:03 am

But bear in mind 1000s of TCs have moved away - why can they not be replaced by immigrants.


What in Gods name are you talking about? The reason why TC's have left is because they have no future in Cyprus as things stand. If a solution is to come about then many will probably want to come back. Same goes for GC's.

The SETTLERS (not immigrants) should be given compensation in order to return but who should bear the responsibility for that? IT IS TURKEY. They brought them here, they should pay for them to go back as part of a comprehensive solution!
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Postby iskismet » Sat Oct 09, 2004 10:27 am

They did this, they did that .....

Listen to yourself Mikkee
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Postby -mikkie2- » Sat Oct 09, 2004 1:21 pm

If you must insist on having a baseless argument then fine.

For you the current setup is the solution and you say to the GC's to accept that and move on. Well, that is not going to happen!

If the Turks don't accept some responsibility for the settlers and come up with a solution that would eb agreeable to everyone then this will be a bone of contention forever.
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Postby mehmet » Sat Oct 09, 2004 3:11 pm

The Turkish Cypriots that left from the 1950s onwards will not come back in the event of a solution. They make their own solution by starting a new life somewhere else. Some will go back, maybe some older people will retire, but it will not be a flood.

Mikkie you must know this is the case. The people who have been there 30 years have more connection with Cyprus than I do. They will have to be considered in the solution along with everyone else.
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Postby -mikkie2- » Sat Oct 09, 2004 8:35 pm

They will have to be considered in the solution along with everyone else.


I'm not suggesting that they don't be considered. What I am saying is that Turkey is not taking any responsibility for the settlers which she is encouraging to come to Cyprus with the promise of free land and someone elses house.

That is what gets me. It is that we the GC's are being saddled with this responsibility, yet the perpertrators of this situation can simply walk away with no cost to them. The Turks have to face up to this as well. THere is no sense of shared responsibility, only that we must bear the cost to accommodate these people, who are in the majority poor, and quite backward - and that is not my opinion, it is the opinion of many TC's too.
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Postby MicAtCyp » Sun Oct 10, 2004 2:59 pm

Iskismet wrote: First part - yes I agree but you will not be able to force people against their will - so you (by you I mean government) would have to offer compensation.

The compensation has to be paid by Turkey as the one solely responsible

Iskismet wrote: I wouldn't argue with your sentence ref colonisation.


Read the Laasko and Cuco reports, ref settlers

http://www.moi.gov.cy/moi/pio/pio.nsf/A ... penElement

http://www.moi.gov.cy/moi/pio/pio.nsf/A ... penElement

http://www.moi.gov.cy/moi/pio/pio.nsf/A ... enDocument

Iskismet wrote: in any process of conciliation both sides would need to start to drop words like settlers, occupied, barbarians etc because trust will only grow very slowly.


Conciliation can only come after we sign an agreement.Conciliation before that, is defeatism.

Iskismet wrote: But bear in mind 1000s of TCs have moved away - why can they not be replaced by immigrants.

Because the Invasion of 1974 was presumably done to protect the TCs, not to send them away and replace them by settlers.

Iskismet wrote: They did this, they did that ..... Listen to yourself Mikkee


No you listen to yourself. All you can digest right away, is oversimplistic terms like "north" , "south", "immigrants", and stuff like that....Anything less simplistic gets you confused.
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Postby brother » Mon Oct 11, 2004 12:46 pm

Firstly many tc do not like the settlers as they are not the cream of society from turkey, many are uneducated and there contribution to cyprus is very limited apart from making up the numbers for the politicians.

As for them leaving many that were born and lived there for 30 odd years, we will have to take a view and either compenstae them to leave or take the lands given to them illegally by the goverment back and hence they then have a choice to purchase like normal human beings.

But at the moment by far the most important situation is stopping all the settlers as we speak from flooding into cyprus.
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Postby magikthrill » Fri Oct 15, 2004 3:04 am

brother.

you make things seem very complicated, but in reality they are not. if someone was illegally sent to the island and inhabited ILLEGALLY OCCUPIED property (they keywords here being illegally and occupied) then they must be removed. where they go? now thats none of our concern, is it?

It doesnt matter whether its been 5 years or 25 years. By living where you live you are violating international law, causing havoc amongst civilizations and causing people decades of pain.

Cyprus is for the Cypriots. After having been conquered and occupied by Romans, Ottomans and the Brits, the fact that there is a 3/4+ majority of Greeks on the island must mean somethign right? I mean I don't understand how so many people can live in land, on which other peoples ancestors lived and thrived in the first place, but if that doesn't seem to bother anyone else, why should it bother me?

I don't mind Turkish Cypriots in Cyprus, cause as I said Cyprus is for Cypriots. The only way though that Cyprus can actually be unified is by allowing the majority to rule. Not the GC majority separately from the TC majority. The majority of all the residents.

Illegal settlers: you dont belong here get the hell out. End of story.
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Postby metecyp » Fri Oct 15, 2004 3:15 am

Illegal settlers: you dont belong here get the hell out. End of story.

What do you think about the children of those settlers that were born in Cyprus, never been to Turkey? Do you think it's right to punish those children for something that they had no control over?

What do you think about the settlers that got married to TCs and their children? They should leave too?

I'm not fond of settlers either. They have a different culture and I never managed to feel close to them. So I'm not trying to defend them but at the same time, I cannot see how you can solve a problem by creating more victims. I believe there are settlers who can easily be asked to leave tomorrow but there are more complicated cases as well.
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Postby -mikkie2- » Fri Oct 15, 2004 11:12 am

Most settlers have come from very poor regions of Turkey.

I bet that most will go given the right incentive, and that usually means money. So, metecyp, do you think that if these people are offered enough money to leave does that mean it is a bad thing?

However, I would say that settlers that came soon after the invasion would need to be treated differently as their children will be well established in Cyprus. Also, settlers that have married TC's will also need to be treated differently.

Also, if most settlers have not fitted in with the culturally different Cypriots, would you prefer them to stay?

But, thought should also be given to the rights of the refugees and their ancestral homes. There seems to be a lack of concern by the TC's on this issue.
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