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by **Kartal_Aetos** » Wed Oct 18, 2006 4:15 pm

I keep seeing that sometimes it feels like Europe do not actually want turkey in the EU anyway, and sometimes it feels like they really do want Turkey to join, and that the Cyprus problem is an un-wanted burden...It seems as though if Greece and Cyprus were not in the EU, than the other member states would not care less...It all seems so complex and difficult to work out...

Personally, i feel when russia and china offered a union with turkey a few years back they would have been better off...

anyone else have any opinions towards these matters?

by **Kikapu** » Wed Oct 18, 2006 4:23 pm

Kartal_Aetos wrote:I keep seeing that sometimes it feels like Europe do not actually want turkey in the EU anyway, and sometimes it feels like they really do want Turkey to join, and that the Cyprus problem is an un-wanted burden...It seems as though if Greece and Cyprus were not in the EU, than the other member states would not care less...It all seems so complex and difficult to work out...

Personally, i feel when russia and china offered a union with turkey a few years back they would have been better off...

anyone else have any opinions towards these matters?

I have written a great deal as to why Turkey should not join the EU ( even if they could, which is not the case anyway). I do not want to repeat myself again by writing what has been already written.

by **Kartal_Aetos** » Wed Oct 18, 2006 4:31 pm

ok...in that case, no one will force you, my friend

p.s. no one was forcing you to anyway

and it is not about whether you want turkey to join or not to join...it is about whether Europe want them to join or not to join and the mixed signals i've been interpreting from the other member states

by **Kikapu** » Wed Oct 18, 2006 4:44 pm

Kartal_Aetos wrote:ok...in that case, no one will force you, my friend

p.s. no one was forcing you to anyway

and it is not about whether you want turkey to join or not to join...it is about whether Europe want them to join or not to join and the mixed signals i've been interpreting from the other member states

It is very clear that some EU members does not want Turkey to join, so they will use every method at their disposal, even by granting Cyprus membership, when the island was divided, with an occupational force. This is why I posted the " RoC a 'Trojan Horse' for EU against Turkey" in Cyprus Problem ( page 2) few months ago.

by **Kartal_Aetos** » Wed Oct 18, 2006 5:15 pm

yeh, i posted on that forum too...they are some good points, but I cant see that being a big reason in taking cyprus onboard...

As for the members that don't want to see Turkey in the EU, do you think its because of turkey not being able to fulfill certain criteria? or because they are muslim? or maybe just because of a bad political history between them?

by **Kikapu** » Wed Oct 18, 2006 5:24 pm

Kartal_Aetos wrote:yeh, i posted on that forum too...they are some good points, but I cant see that being a big reason in taking cyprus onboard...

As for the members that don't want to see Turkey in the EU, do you think its because of turkey not being able to fulfill certain criteria? or because they are muslim? or maybe just because of a bad political history between them?

I think "Racism" comes to mind. You can see the actions of some Germans towards the Turks living in Germany. Also why the European Constitution Referendum did not pass in France and Holland. They see Turkey as a 3rd World country, and to some degree, that is true, and they don't want Turkey to give the "EU Neighbourhood" a bad name.

by **cypezokyli** » Wed Oct 18, 2006 5:28 pm

cyprus was accepted in the EU primarily bc of a big bargain that greece did for us, in helisnki, a number of years ago. the targets for the main european countries were different back then, and in no way did they plan to accept cyprus in order to put obstacles for turkey (or else greece wouldnt have to play a really tough game back then :wink:

)
the only opportunity (according to some - turks actually) that turkey hat to stop that, would be by replacing denktas as soon as the first versions of the AP were introduced, and accepting the plan from its first version in 2002. by the time turkey woke up it was too late.

by **Kartal_Aetos** » Wed Oct 18, 2006 5:33 pm

hmm...but is it also not a worry that Turkey, rich in natural resources, cheap labour, wealthy businessmen, and scope for much economic growth, would excel far beyond current EU members and maybe become a rich and powerful member which some EU members would not want to have to deal with...After all, it would make sense if they see Turkey as an adversary, they would not want them to grow more powerful than them?

Cypezokyli, sorry i just realised i've been writing ur name wrong all this time...lol...i wasnt aware greece made a deal with the EU a few years ago...what was this 'bargain'? what was it about? what did it entail?

by **Sotos** » Wed Oct 18, 2006 8:42 pm

Most EU citizens don't want Turkey in EU. This is what polls show. I think this is because they consider Turkey not to be very European. Is Turkey European?

by **Kartal_Aetos** » Wed Oct 18, 2006 8:46 pm

by European, do you mean as in their culture and way of life? if so, then i would say no...They are many cultures in one...You have the arabic, kurdish, balkan, mediterranean, russian, and turkish cultures all in one country...and in some cases, all meshed with one another

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