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Don't keep turning away from the truth.

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Don't keep turning away from the truth.

Postby zan » Thu Oct 04, 2007 9:45 am

It will get you in the end.

“PAPADOPULOS CONFESSIONS” FROM KLERIDES
Glafkos Klerides, one of the former leaders of Greek Cypriot Administration of Southern Cyprus, has put off the mask of today’s leader Tassos Papadopulos. Klerides has put forth the fact that Tassos Papadopulos played a big role at the foundation of many problems that have been continuing in Cyprus.

Klerides stated that the Greek Cypriot leader Tassos Papadopulos accepts Cypriot Turks as the minority, adding that he never was convinced to recognise no other rights for Cypriot Turks but minority rights.


Klerides also said that the major parts of the Akritas plan – a plan of Greek Cypriots’ to terminate Cypriot Turks – was written by Papadopulos, and confirmed that he said the infamous sentence of “We will have one hour and 45 minutes to clean up the Turks from Cyprus," during a visit to the American Embassy in 1964.


”What will happen is the recognition of the regime in the North not as a separate sovereignty but on legal grounds”, Klerides also says and adds that, “it will be given for a few years and the separation will come into progress on the base of today’s dividing lines.”


The Greek Cypriot newspaper Politis cited the words of former Greek Cypriot leader Glafkos Klerides about the Cyprus problem published in the book "Glafkos Klerides: The Process of a Country," by Turkish lecturer Niyazi K?z?lyürek from the Greek Cypriot University. The paper wrote that Klerides revealed unknown political facts of the period.


According to the book, Klerides said Greek Cypriot leader Tassos Papadopoulos had never seen the Turkish Cypriots as an independent society and thus never agreed to granting them any rights but those of minorities. "Papadopoulos sees the Turkish Cypriots as a minority," Klerides also reportedly said.


Klerides underlines that the 1960 Constitution was functional, that Turkey’s demand was the implementation of the constitution and in that period extremists from both sides held talks to solve the question.


Klerides says that “Tasos Papadopulos has never recognised Cypriot Turks as a society but he believed that they existed in Cyprus Republic as a minority”.


Klerides also says that Turkey’s military government was affected by the American factor, and since the American factor demanded peace in Cyprus, no doubt, and the soldiers’ policy was the functionality of the constitution.


Klerides also said on the same constitution as follows:


”None of the issues were non-exploitable apart from the tax issues as one of the basic issues. Majority was needed on other issues such as elections and municipal taxes. If this issue of taxes was overcome, the state could work.


Turkish side did not vote in favour of an increase on the income taxes because it would bring an extra burden on the Turkish Cypriots. This problem was suggested to be overcome by a suggestion which would meet the educational outgoings of Cypriot Turks and Greeks.


This solution was agreed at talks held with Cypriot Turks and Turkish side asked for a protocol. The protocol was signed by the President, the Speaker of the Parliament, and the speakers of the congregational parliaments, but Greek Cypriot side demanded for a constitutional change. The demands of Greek Cypriots were more emotional than logical, and the leadership of Greek Cypriots (Archbishop Makarios III, Polikarpos Yorgacis and Tasos Papadopulos) wanted to show people that the constitution was being corrected. Despite the positive views that Greek Cypriots took from abroad on whether the protocol would be valid, this question remained unresolved and what happened in 1964 followed. ”


Papadopulos was Against the Federation...


According to Politis Newspaper, the narration on 1975-1976 incidents is one of the attention attracting points of the book. The negotiator of Greek Cypriot side Glafkos Klerides had accepted a two-society and bipartite federation in Cyprus. Constantine Karamanlis did the same thing.


Tasos Papadopulos and Mihalakis Triantafillidis who accompanied Klerides during the negotiations showed an opposing stance against such a resolution and Makarios faced this dilemma.


Klerides resigned from his post of negotiator when the famous map that Klerides had the initiative to present to Rauf Denkta? was published.


Papadopulos’s “Ethnic Cleansing Plan”


What Klerides said on the Greek Cypriot Adminsitration’s present leader Tassos Papadopulos enlightens the blind eyes that believe peace and solution is possible with Greek Cypriots.


Klerides said Tasos Papadopulos was caught while he was making phone calls with various places on the issue of cleaning up the island from Turks in case of an operation in 1964.



Klerides said that “This was also approved by Yorgacis ve Makarios, they told him that he was pushing them to a position where they would be accused of committing crime but they had views of such.” He also confirmed with these words that Papadopulos had said the infamous sentence of “We will have one hour and 45 minutes to clean up the Turks from Cyprus," during a visit to the American Embassy in 1964”, as told in the book of Makarios Drusiotis.


Akritas Plan is a Work of Papadopulos


Klerides replied to questions on the writing of Akritas plan as follows:


“I believe that most of the work of writing of the plan in question was done by Tasos Papadopulos rather than Polikarpos Yorgacis. Yorgacis did not have the legal opportunity or the level of education to prepare that document. I think that most of the work was carried out by Papadopulos.”


According to the Politis Newspaper, this evaluation of Klerides is not left ungrounded in the book and Klerides for the first time confessed that he joined the organisation that wanted to continue the EOKA struggle in 1960s for a short while.


Spiros Kiprianu also joined the organisation, not as much as Klerides did but the president of the organisation was Polikarpos Yorgacis and Tasos Papadopulos was his deputy.


Papadopulos Always Said “No”


Klerides told on the pre-1974 ear as follows:


“Whenever there was an effort to create cooperation methods between the two societies, Tasos always said that the Turks needed to understand that they were a minority and they were demanding more than the minority rights. Tasos found everything more than classical minority rights that could be demanded by Turkish Cypriots as too much. He did not have an idea of two societies.”

According to Glafkos Klerides, one of the problems of Tassos papadopulos to agree upon the Annan Plan was the plan’s suggestion of political equity of two societies.


The author of the book Niyazi K?z?lyürek said that the solution momentum was lost with the conjuncture came with the European Union membership of Greek Cypriot side, and ended his book with the following words of Klerides:


“What will happen is the recognition of the regime in the North not as a separate sovereignty but on legal grounds”, Klerides also says and adds that, “it will be given for a few years and the separation will come into progress on the base of today’s dividing lines.”

http://www.diplomaticobserver.com/news_read.asp?id=1558
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Postby Kikapu » Thu Oct 04, 2007 10:00 am

You and Halil could do well to coordinate your postings, so that there are no double postings of the "same old stuff" from the two of you on separate threads.

What did you think, that we are going to read it TWICE.!! :lol: :lol:

You should be so lucky for it to be read ONCE. :lol:
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Postby zan » Thu Oct 04, 2007 10:04 am

Kikapu wrote:You and Halil could do well to coordinate your postings, so that there are no double postings of the "same old stuff" from the two of you on separate threads.

What did you think, that we are going to read it TWICE.!! :lol: :lol:

You should be so lucky for it to be read ONCE. :lol:


This is worthy of a thread of it's own Kikapu and the thought that you might actually read it and see the reality of the situation just sends shivers down my spine.....Waking from a comma is not going to be easy and I DO NOT ENVY YOU. I will offer you support and counselling if you like..
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Postby Kikapu » Thu Oct 04, 2007 10:17 am

zan wrote:
Kikapu wrote:You and Halil could do well to coordinate your postings, so that there are no double postings of the "same old stuff" from the two of you on separate threads.

What did you think, that we are going to read it TWICE.!! :lol: :lol:

You should be so lucky for it to be read ONCE. :lol:


This is worthy of a thread of it's own Kikapu and the thought that you might actually read it and see the reality of the situation just sends shivers down my spine.....Waking from a comma is not going to be easy and I DO NOT ENVY YOU. I will offer you support and counselling if you like..


Zan, I do not need to read the words of a man who is trying to sell his book on what he says he knows about PapaD from the 1960's. Everyone who wants to peddle their book always have some "juicy secrets" so excuse me for not going gaga over what the "book pusher" is saying. What I want to know is, what is it that we are doing today to fix the problem and not use the words of a "book pusher" to have more reasons to keep the divide.
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Postby zan » Thu Oct 04, 2007 10:23 am

Kikapu wrote:
zan wrote:
Kikapu wrote:You and Halil could do well to coordinate your postings, so that there are no double postings of the "same old stuff" from the two of you on separate threads.

What did you think, that we are going to read it TWICE.!! :lol: :lol:

You should be so lucky for it to be read ONCE. :lol:


This is worthy of a thread of it's own Kikapu and the thought that you might actually read it and see the reality of the situation just sends shivers down my spine.....Waking from a comma is not going to be easy and I DO NOT ENVY YOU. I will offer you support and counselling if you like..


Zan, I do not need to read the words of a man who is trying to sell his book on what he says he knows about PapaD from the 1960's. Everyone who wants to peddle their book always have some "juicy secrets" so excuse me for not going gaga over what the "book pusher" is saying. What I want to know is, what is it that we are doing today to fix the problem and not use the words of a "book pusher" to have more reasons to keep the divide.



Hahhahahahhaaa! And I suppose your dog ate your homework as well hahahhahahahhahha!

That is fine by me Kiks......As I have said to you many times..You can be what ever you want to be...Just don't come here with your blinkered views and dismiss anything and everything that is put before you because you want me to be as one sided and as Greek as you...It ain't gonna happen mate. I have no problem with Greek people being proud of who they are and god bless them but I am not Greek and have no intention of converting...You on the other hand have no qualms about that and again ....Good luck!!!
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Postby Piratis » Thu Oct 04, 2007 11:12 am

Kliredes who must be around 90 now, did not appear in public for ages. During his last appearances it was obvious that his old age had severely affected his mental capacity.

I believe that most of the work of writing of the plan in question was done by Tasos Papadopulos rather than Polikarpos Yorgacis. Yorgacis did not have the legal opportunity or the level of education to prepare that document. I think that most of the work was carried out by Papadopulos

So he "believes" and "thinks" without any kind of evidence, whatever he likes. Basically he says whatever they told him to say in order to damage Papadopoulos.

Beyond that, what is repeated in the article is that Papadopoulos says the obvious: That TCs are a minority. Arguing against this is like arguing against logic. TCs are the 18% of the population, of course they are a minority.

The Cyprus Problem is exactly the fact that Turkey and Britain are using this minority in order to control Cyprus, and this is why they are trying to give to this minority a controlling power share in order to deprive the Cypriot people their independence.

The Ottoman and the British rule are theoretically over, but the Cypriot people still have a lot of fights to give in order to finally liberate themselves from their "former" rulers.

Papadopoulos is the right person to lead this fight because he defends the dignity of the Cypriot people and he will not sign away our island to any foreigners.

The TC minority should start acting like real Cypriots (if they want to be Cypriots) and stop collaborating with those foreign powers that want to continue to control our island. The Cypriots should control their own country in a democratic way, one person one vote, without racist discriminations and divisions that some foreigners want to impose on us in order to more effectively control our island.
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Postby halil » Thu Oct 04, 2007 11:52 am

Kikapu wrote:
zan wrote:
Kikapu wrote:You and Halil could do well to coordinate your postings, so that there are no double postings of the "same old stuff" from the two of you on separate threads.

İ have no idea what Zan is doing ? it may be your tactics. i prefare to talk alone mate .
G-R asked me a question to prove the claims against Papadopoulos and i tried to prove .
http://www.cyprus-forum.com/viewtopic.php?t=13606


What did you think, that we are going to read it TWICE.!! :lol: :lol:

You should be so lucky for it to be read ONCE. :lol:


This is worthy of a thread of it's own Kikapu and the thought that you might actually read it and see the reality of the situation just sends shivers down my spine.....Waking from a comma is not going to be easy and I DO NOT ENVY YOU. I will offer you support and counselling if you like..


Zan, I do not need to read the words of a man who is trying to sell his book on what he says he knows about PapaD from the 1960's. Everyone who wants to peddle their book always have some "juicy secrets" so excuse me for not going gaga over what the "book pusher" is saying. What I want to know is, what is it that we are doing today to fix the problem and not use the words of a "book pusher" to have more reasons to keep the divide.


Don't ignore Glafkos Klerides he was president of the ROC. He was very active in Cyprus events.
Doing today to fix the problem , we have all know with who we are dealing .My point was if someone tries to sell the GUNS....... What do u except from him. How he can help to solve the problem.
U talking about solving the problem at other topic u , the same man tries to build up walls !!!!!!
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Postby Kikapu » Thu Oct 04, 2007 12:13 pm

halil wrote:
Kikapu wrote:
zan wrote:
Kikapu wrote:You and Halil could do well to coordinate your postings, so that there are no double postings of the "same old stuff" from the two of you on separate threads.

İ have no idea what Zan is doing ? it may be your tactics. i prefare to talk alone mate .
G-R asked me a question to prove the claims against Papadopoulos and i tried to prove .
http://www.cyprus-forum.com/viewtopic.php?t=13606


What did you think, that we are going to read it TWICE.!! :lol: :lol:

You should be so lucky for it to be read ONCE. :lol:


This is worthy of a thread of it's own Kikapu and the thought that you might actually read it and see the reality of the situation just sends shivers down my spine.....Waking from a comma is not going to be easy and I DO NOT ENVY YOU. I will offer you support and counselling if you like..


Zan, I do not need to read the words of a man who is trying to sell his book on what he says he knows about PapaD from the 1960's. Everyone who wants to peddle their book always have some "juicy secrets" so excuse me for not going gaga over what the "book pusher" is saying. What I want to know is, what is it that we are doing today to fix the problem and not use the words of a "book pusher" to have more reasons to keep the divide.


Don't ignore Glafkos Klerides he was president of the ROC. He was very active in Cyprus events.
Doing today to fix the problem , we have all know with who we are dealing .My point was if someone tries to sell the GUNS....... What do u except from him. How he can help to solve the problem.
U talking about solving the problem at other topic u , the same man tries to build up walls !!!!!!


The wall I proposed buliding was to be made from "circumcised foreskins" Halil. :lol: :lol: :lol:

I don't care if PapaD was selling Guns or Roses. It better than buying Guns, isn't it.??

What does that has to do with our problems in Cyprus anyway.??

Talking about past Presidents, how did you put up with Denktash when he took 30,000 Donums of GC land for himself as his reward for the 1974 Invasion. Did you ever question Denktash as to why he was not interested in resolving the Cyprus problem for all the time he was the President. Did you by any chance think, it was because Denktash and his crooked friends in high places had so much GC land, that having peace would have meant that they would have lost all that GC land, that did not belong to them.

But Halil, do you ever ask questions relating to your own community like I ask questions relating to my community, which happens to be the same for both of us.
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Postby halil » Thu Oct 04, 2007 1:01 pm

Kikapu wrote:
halil wrote:
Kikapu wrote:
zan wrote:
Kikapu wrote:You and Halil could do well to coordinate your postings, so that there are no double postings of the "same old stuff" from the two of you on separate threads.

İ have no idea what Zan is doing ? it may be your tactics. i prefare to talk alone mate .
G-R asked me a question to prove the claims against Papadopoulos and i tried to prove .
http://www.cyprus-forum.com/viewtopic.php?t=13606


What did you think, that we are going to read it TWICE.!! :lol: :lol:

You should be so lucky for it to be read ONCE. :lol:


This is worthy of a thread of it's own Kikapu and the thought that you might actually read it and see the reality of the situation just sends shivers down my spine.....Waking from a comma is not going to be easy and I DO NOT ENVY YOU. I will offer you support and counselling if you like..


Zan, I do not need to read the words of a man who is trying to sell his book on what he says he knows about PapaD from the 1960's. Everyone who wants to peddle their book always have some "juicy secrets" so excuse me for not going gaga over what the "book pusher" is saying. What I want to know is, what is it that we are doing today to fix the problem and not use the words of a "book pusher" to have more reasons to keep the divide.


Don't ignore Glafkos Klerides he was president of the ROC. He was very active in Cyprus events.
Doing today to fix the problem , we have all know with who we are dealing .My point was if someone tries to sell the GUNS....... What do u except from him. How he can help to solve the problem.
U talking about solving the problem at other topic u , the same man tries to build up walls !!!!!!


The wall I proposed buliding was to be made from "circumcised foreskins" Halil. :lol: :lol: :lol:

I don't care if PapaD was selling Guns or Roses. It better than buying Guns, isn't it.??

What does that has to do with our problems in Cyprus anyway.??

Talking about past Presidents, how did you put up with Denktash when he took 30,000 Donums of GC land for himself as his reward for the 1974 Invasion. Did you ever question Denktash as to why he was not interested in resolving the Cyprus problem for all the time he was the President. Did you by any chance think, it was because Denktash and his crooked friends in high places had so much GC land, that having peace would have meant that they would have lost all that GC land, that did not belong to them. We judge him and removed him from his position.
Show me one bad example about Talat. He was immigrant from Kyrenia before 1974.He lives at apartman block in Kyrenia. He wasn't TMT man or other things.

But Halil, do you ever ask questions relating to your own community like I ask questions relating to my community, which happens to be the same for both of us.
Kikapu , of course i asked same question about my own community . we felt responsibility and gathered at Atatürk Square and scream for peace in Cyprus.İ told u before and i will say again to understand our feelings you must stay in here and experience everything with yourself.Talk to people face to face and see their fears and ideas.
this is the my guide.İ live in this country since 1957. i knew very well past and present times. İ can do healthy comparaison .No body wants war or unknowing future for him self or for his children as some of the forum members said:They left this island for their own and kids future.
to be honest none of us will expect minority rights. We were equal partner at 60's and some one tries to telling me go worst than 1960 agreement's are kidding man :oops:
People can solve the land or money problems very easily but they can not solve the trust and security very easily .This is the most risky part of the Cyprus.For me doesn't matter if it is 18 % or 30 % or what's over it is.
Very simple our people wants to govern them self.

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Postby Piratis » Thu Oct 04, 2007 1:30 pm

We were equal partner at 60's and some one tries to telling me go worst than 1960 agreement's are kidding man


Really? So it can not be worst for you but it should be worst for us? Is this what you want to say?

Why don't you just accept the 1960 agreements so it will not be worst for anybody? Because you think that with brute force and blackmail you can gain on our loss, right?
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