Cyprus-Forum.com

[zan]

I think there's a clear break down in communication. Either that, or the bubbles on here have given their brains the weekend off, as well as their bodies.

There is no dispute amongst civilised folk in Britain that we are descendants of far flung folk. My point about Cyprus is that, you can go as far back as you like, the "Greek" link is far more tenuous than is admitted by the inhabitants. It's a simple fact.

Notwithstanding identifiers like language and religion, the ethnic background of GCs is not Greek. Not by a long chalk. It's more of a middle eastern / Asia Minor blend. Have you people not noticed that Greek Cypriots are much darker and middle eastern looking that proper Greeks who are fairer and mre European?

Or are you too busy supping Cyprus Coffee and smoking Senior Service to have seen this blatant truth?

Oh dear, my fellow bubbles, you really let yourselves down with your ignorance.

Just finished watching "300"..These numb-nuts do not realise that even the Greeks are not solely Greeks....Just like the Ottomans they made people Greek or Turkish....They cannot even believe what they see with their own eyes that if the blood where pure then they would all have the same colour hair and eyes.....not the mish mash of peoples they see every day.....

[miltiades]

Zan's signature!!
"""""Driven out of Cyprus by EOKA and Makarios. Kept out by TPap."""
Kept out of where Zan ?? The 40 thousand foreign troops are not stationed on the ROC mate but on the "TRNC" I almost forgot . it is the other way around the "ROC" and the TRNC !!!

[Bill]

Even more interesting is that quite a few tc's have a blood line tracing back to greeks plus all the other bits thrown over the last 2000 or so years .

Bill

[zan]

Speak about yourself. You of course are not Greek nor Cypriot. You don't speak Greek, you didn't serve in the army of Cyprus, you don't care about Cyprus (in fact you hate it), and I doubt you have the Cypriot citizenship. So what would make you Greek or Cypriot?

Cypriots are as Greek as it gets. Cyprus was Hellenized at the same time when most other Greek islands did, and just a few centuries after mainland Greece. All this happened long before the Greek civilization became the great civilization everybody admires today. Cypriots believed in the Gods of Olympus, one of which was Cypriot, and later became Greek Orthodox, again in line with the rest of the Greek world.

Greeks of Cyprus belong to the first Greek tribe, the Myceneans, and the spoke the most ancient Greek Language which became known as ArcadoCypriot since it was spoken in Arcadia (Peloponnese) and Cyprus. In fact Athenians and northern Greeks are mostly Dorians, a Greek tribe which arrived in the area later.

Cyprus did have many invadors and rulers since, but so did the other Greek islands and the Greek mainland itself.

Cyprus is not different, no different at all, than any other Greek island. The reason Cyprus today is not part of the Greek state is exclusively due to the fact that the British colonialists did not want to allow to the Cypriot people their freedom and self-determination and they have used the Muslim minority in Cyprus (turning them into "Turkish Cypriot community") as the excuse to deny to Cyprus its self-determination. All "Turkish Cypriots" before that spoke Greek, and in fact many of them had Greek as their mother tongue.

By the way Pumpy, you said you are "half English". Shouldn't you say a mix of Latin, Germanic and some other tribes?

Piratis, it would be quite helpful if you were to tell the truth about me every now and then, if only to know what it is like to debate openly and politely.

I am indeed half Greek Cypriot, my command of the language is weak, though respectable, and as far as the "Army" goes, that is clearly a ridiculous assertion you make based on a fanciful notion of what and who you think I am. I won't even acknowledge this statement.

I do not "hate" Cyprus, Piratis. Where have I said such a thing? Do we "love" our countries purely by omitting any criticism of them? What a laughable position to hold.

Some people seem to equate cultural identity factors, like language and religion, purely with being Greek (both aspects to Greekness that Greek Cypriots cling to for fear of not actually having a proper heritage or identity at all and quite an embarassing history of being overrun by foreign powers).

These perspectives are quite sad and a reflection of the confused state of the typical Cypriot in today's lost society. I'd say parentage and lineage have eveything to do with nationality and identity and the idea soneone can NOT be "Greek Cypriot" because they don't toe the line on certain areas is a joke. What a load of right wing nonsense.
Piratis progresses his post by equating language purely with nationality. Keep going, Piratis, as this is one of the few tenuous links you possess between Cyprus and Greece.

My "Englishness" is indeed up for dispute for the reasons given. A mixed blend for historical reasons, which is why my dear friend, people who recognise this call themselves "British" (all encompassing) as opposed to English (which denotes more of a racial harmony with the indigenous people).

I would never be so arrogant as to allign myself with a racially pure tribe. Seems like some of the more right wing greek cypriots here have trouble understanding their own position.

Pumpy your lack of education and intellectual prowess is showing through enormously with every post.

I assumed you ignored my pointer to "memes" and its application to Greekness through an oversight.

However, it is now apparent you are not up to date with memetic theory and how that is so much more important than genes and hereditary lineage .... because basically, Human Beings are all the same ... We inherit such different messages than pure signals from our parents, because of recombination events at chromosome replication, that Genetics is less relevant to the liberal elitists thinkers / scientists than the cultural differences that seep down to us from parents and kin.

That which we inherit that is far stronger, more Humanly unique than genes (which less face it, can be as high as 99% identical to those of Chimps ) are the units of cultural inheritance, language, music, ideas and such like. These are the memes (akin to genes).

So Pumpy move with the times old boy, if you want to take on the heavy-weights like Piratis et al.

Here's a starter to get you motivated in the right direction (sorry it's from Wiki, but I don't think you are ready for the original Dawkins yet ....

A meme (pronounced /miːm/), as defined by memetic theory, constitutes a theoretical unit of cultural information, the building block of culture or cultural evolution which spreads through diffusion propagating from one mind to another analogously to the way in which a gene propagates from one organism to another as a unit of genetic information and of biological evolution.[1] Multiple memes may propagate as cooperative groups called memeplexes (meme complexes).

Biologist and evolutionary theorist Richard Dawkins coined the term meme in 1976.[2] He gave as examples tunes, catch-phrases, beliefs, clothing fashions, ways of making pots, and the technology of building arches.

Meme-theorists contend that memes evolve by natural selection (similarly to Darwinian biological evolution) through the processes of variation, mutation, competition, and inheritance influencing an individual entity's reproductive success. So with memes, some ideas will propagate less successfully and become extinct, while others will survive, spread, and, for better or for worse, mutate. "Memeticists argue that the memes most beneficial to their hosts will not necessarily survive; rather, those memes that replicate the most effectively spread best, which allows for the possibility that successful memes may prove detrimental to their hosts."[3]

A short story written in 1876 by Mark Twain, A Literary Nightmare, describes his encounter with a jingle so "catchy" that it plays over and over in his mind until he finally sings it out loud and infects others (also known as an earworm).

What a weak theory that is Not that there is much wrong with it over all but you can use it for something as simple as shoes...I will call it feme (Pronounced fim) Only the strongest survive unless dictated to by fashion....

[phoenix]

I think there's a clear break down in communication. Either that, or the bubbles on here have given their brains the weekend off, as well as their bodies.

There is no dispute amongst civilised folk in Britain that we are descendants of far flung folk. My point about Cyprus is that, you can go as far back as you like, the "Greek" link is far more tenuous than is admitted by the inhabitants. It's a simple fact.

Notwithstanding identifiers like language and religion, the ethnic background of GCs is not Greek. Not by a long chalk. It's more of a middle eastern / Asia Minor blend. Have you people not noticed that Greek Cypriots are much darker and middle eastern looking that proper Greeks who are fairer and mre European?

Or are you too busy supping Cyprus Coffee and smoking Senior Service to have seen this blatant truth?

Oh dear, my fellow bubbles, you really let yourselves down with your ignorance.

You are recalcitrant in your refusal to come into the 21st Century regarding the importance of handed down cultural elements (memes).

But you are also way off the mark in suggesting Cypriots are less Greek simply because they may be darker (undertones of a racist attitude methinks).

Nevertheless.... I have a home in the Peloponnese and I can assure you the native Greeks there are short and stocky, and dark and swarthy .... more so than any Cypriot. I would like to see you suggest to Peloponnesians (ie Spartan descendants) that they are not Greek because of this physical attribute.

So what is your point Pumpy? ..... what are you so desperate to prove that you are sounding more and more obtuse and ridiculous with your archaic comparisons .....

Wrong again Pumpy..... make an effort to read and understand before you dig a deeper hole with your ridiculous premise .... Darling!

[Piratis]

If you look at most Turks today they have very little even physiologically to do with the original Turks that came from Mongolia. So why do they call themselves Turks? Should any outsider impose on them not to call themselves Turks?

Greek Cypriots are as Greek as any other Greek. The whole of Greece was under multiple foreign rulers, not just Cyprus. If you say that Cypriots are not Greeks, then you have to say that Cretans are not Greek, that Rhodians are not Greek and that Athenians are not Greek either.

So either you have to make the point that there is no such thing as Greek, Turk, English, French, Russian etc, and in that case there is no such thing as Cypriot either, or you have to accept how people define themselves without trying to force your own will on them just because you are racist and you hate everything Greek.

[zan]

Zan's signature!!
"""""Driven out of Cyprus by EOKA and Makarios. Kept out by TPap."""
Kept out of where Zan ?? The 40 thousand foreign troops are not stationed on the ROC mate but on the "TRNC" I almost forgot . it is the other way around the "ROC" and the TRNC !!!

My god I am glad that you are back but do I have to explain everything to you once again.......Your long term memory playing up

The siege made it impossible for my family to return to Cyprus mate because of economic reasons...Because of educational reasons...Because of uncertainty....The embargoes where there for a reason and they worked with my family and thousands more or you would not have to weep for my people today and worry about them being a minority. Do you understand now????

[umit07]

Pumpy, I agree with you on this one. You are just saying that the link with GC's and Greece in terms of descendance is not as strong as they might like. Then again, what you are in terms of identity is up to you if you feel Greek you are Greek if you feel like Turkish you are Turkish. You can't force people to change their identity, if Piratis and Phoenix feel "Greek" let it be. You can see how fired up they both got after the stuff you said, they even went far enough to dictate to you what you are. That is the sort of behavior that put Cyprus in the situation it is now. They gotta learn to cope with TC's.

[phoenix]

Speak about yourself. You of course are not Greek nor Cypriot. You don't speak Greek, you didn't serve in the army of Cyprus, you don't care about Cyprus (in fact you hate it), and I doubt you have the Cypriot citizenship. So what would make you Greek or Cypriot?

Cypriots are as Greek as it gets. Cyprus was Hellenized at the same time when most other Greek islands did, and just a few centuries after mainland Greece. All this happened long before the Greek civilization became the great civilization everybody admires today. Cypriots believed in the Gods of Olympus, one of which was Cypriot, and later became Greek Orthodox, again in line with the rest of the Greek world.

Greeks of Cyprus belong to the first Greek tribe, the Myceneans, and the spoke the most ancient Greek Language which became known as ArcadoCypriot since it was spoken in Arcadia (Peloponnese) and Cyprus. In fact Athenians and northern Greeks are mostly Dorians, a Greek tribe which arrived in the area later.

Cyprus did have many invadors and rulers since, but so did the other Greek islands and the Greek mainland itself.

Cyprus is not different, no different at all, than any other Greek island. The reason Cyprus today is not part of the Greek state is exclusively due to the fact that the British colonialists did not want to allow to the Cypriot people their freedom and self-determination and they have used the Muslim minority in Cyprus (turning them into "Turkish Cypriot community") as the excuse to deny to Cyprus its self-determination. All "Turkish Cypriots" before that spoke Greek, and in fact many of them had Greek as their mother tongue.

By the way Pumpy, you said you are "half English". Shouldn't you say a mix of Latin, Germanic and some other tribes?

Piratis, it would be quite helpful if you were to tell the truth about me every now and then, if only to know what it is like to debate openly and politely.

I am indeed half Greek Cypriot, my command of the language is weak, though respectable, and as far as the "Army" goes, that is clearly a ridiculous assertion you make based on a fanciful notion of what and who you think I am. I won't even acknowledge this statement.

I do not "hate" Cyprus, Piratis. Where have I said such a thing? Do we "love" our countries purely by omitting any criticism of them? What a laughable position to hold.

Some people seem to equate cultural identity factors, like language and religion, purely with being Greek (both aspects to Greekness that Greek Cypriots cling to for fear of not actually having a proper heritage or identity at all and quite an embarassing history of being overrun by foreign powers).

These perspectives are quite sad and a reflection of the confused state of the typical Cypriot in today's lost society. I'd say parentage and lineage have eveything to do with nationality and identity and the idea soneone can NOT be "Greek Cypriot" because they don't toe the line on certain areas is a joke. What a load of right wing nonsense.
Piratis progresses his post by equating language purely with nationality. Keep going, Piratis, as this is one of the few tenuous links you possess between Cyprus and Greece.

My "Englishness" is indeed up for dispute for the reasons given. A mixed blend for historical reasons, which is why my dear friend, people who recognise this call themselves "British" (all encompassing) as opposed to English (which denotes more of a racial harmony with the indigenous people).

I would never be so arrogant as to allign myself with a racially pure tribe. Seems like some of the more right wing greek cypriots here have trouble understanding their own position.

Pumpy your lack of education and intellectual prowess is showing through enormously with every post.

I assumed you ignored my pointer to "memes" and its application to Greekness through an oversight.

However, it is now apparent you are not up to date with memetic theory and how that is so much more important than genes and hereditary lineage .... because basically, Human Beings are all the same ... We inherit such different messages than pure signals from our parents, because of recombination events at chromosome replication, that Genetics is less relevant to the liberal elitists thinkers / scientists than the cultural differences that seep down to us from parents and kin.

That which we inherit that is far stronger, more Humanly unique than genes (which less face it, can be as high as 99% identical to those of Chimps ) are the units of cultural inheritance, language, music, ideas and such like. These are the memes (akin to genes).

So Pumpy move with the times old boy, if you want to take on the heavy-weights like Piratis et al.

Here's a starter to get you motivated in the right direction (sorry it's from Wiki, but I don't think you are ready for the original Dawkins yet ....

A meme (pronounced /miːm/), as defined by memetic theory, constitutes a theoretical unit of cultural information, the building block of culture or cultural evolution which spreads through diffusion propagating from one mind to another analogously to the way in which a gene propagates from one organism to another as a unit of genetic information and of biological evolution.[1] Multiple memes may propagate as cooperative groups called memeplexes (meme complexes).

Biologist and evolutionary theorist Richard Dawkins coined the term meme in 1976.[2] He gave as examples tunes, catch-phrases, beliefs, clothing fashions, ways of making pots, and the technology of building arches.

Meme-theorists contend that memes evolve by natural selection (similarly to Darwinian biological evolution) through the processes of variation, mutation, competition, and inheritance influencing an individual entity's reproductive success. So with memes, some ideas will propagate less successfully and become extinct, while others will survive, spread, and, for better or for worse, mutate. "Memeticists argue that the memes most beneficial to their hosts will not necessarily survive; rather, those memes that replicate the most effectively spread best, which allows for the possibility that successful memes may prove detrimental to their hosts."[3]

A short story written in 1876 by Mark Twain, A Literary Nightmare, describes his encounter with a jingle so "catchy" that it plays over and over in his mind until he finally sings it out loud and infects others (also known as an earworm).

What a weak theory that is Not that there is much wrong with it over all but you can use it for something as simple as shoes...I will call it feme (Pronounced fim) Only the strongest survive unless dictated to by fashion....

So now you are setting yourself above an Oxford professor are you "Prof" Zan.

Your inability to comprehend is not a measure of the validity of a theory .....

[phoenix]

Pumpy, I agree with you on this one. You are just saying that the link with GC's and Greece in terms of descendance is not as strong as they might like. Then again, what you are in terms of identity is up to you if you feel Greek you are Greek if you feel like Turkish you are Turkish. You can't force people to change their identity, if Piratis and Phoenix feel "Greek" let it be. You can see how fired up they both got after the stuff you said, they even went far enough to dictate to you what you are. That is the sort of behavior that put Cyprus in the situation it is now. They gotta learn to cope with TC's.

Another brainless idiot joins the fray of half baked '60's Hippie ideology .....

Current research and scientific theory mean nothing above your coffee shop gossip ....