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Cyprus Elections and the True Voter Opinion!

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Re: Cyprus Elections and the True Voter Opinion!

Postby Sotos » Fri Feb 02, 2018 10:36 am

Get Real! wrote:In other words, Turkey is currently in control of 37% of Cypriot territory while a Cyprus “solution” (any one of the myriads of plans) would mean their control dropping to 0%, so why would they want a “solution”? :lol:


Here is where you are wrong GR. With the right (for Turkey) "solution" their control would go from 37% to 100%. Turkey has realized that the longer they wait, the more concessions we make. So there is no rush for them. Anastasiades has already agreed that all Settlers will stay, he agreed for rotating presidency, he agreed with direct or indirect vetos for the TCs on everything, he agreed that the "users" of properties will have priority etc etc etc. They ONLY thing he didn't agree yet is about the Turkish army and guarantees... once Anastasiades/Malas makes concessions on that then the Turkish "solution" that would make the whole Cyprus a banana Republic of Turkey would be ready. Did you forget about the Annan plan which Cleredes, Anastasiades and Vasiliou accepted? So they ALREADY agreed to such a plan and we had to reject it in a referendum. So your argument that our politicians will never accept such thing is invalid. Some of them will, and unfortunately both Anastasiades and Malas are among those, as proven with their stance on the Anan plan.
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Re: Cyprus Elections and the True Voter Opinion!

Postby MrH » Fri Feb 02, 2018 11:19 am

Postby Sotos » Fri Feb 02, 2018 10:36 am

Get Real! wrote:
In other words, Turkey is currently in control of 37% of Cypriot territory while a Cyprus “solution” (any one of the myriads of plans) would mean their control dropping to 0%, so why would they want a “solution”? :lol:


Here is where you are wrong GR. With the right (for Turkey) "solution" their control would go from 37% to 100%. Turkey has realized that the longer they wait, the more concessions we make. So there is no rush for them. Anastasiades has already agreed that all Settlers will stay, he agreed for rotating presidency, he agreed with direct or indirect vetos for the TCs on everything, he agreed that the "users" of properties will have priority etc etc etc. They ONLY thing he didn't agree yet is about the Turkish army and guarantees... once Anastasiades/Malas makes concessions on that then the Turkish "solution" that would make the whole Cyprus a banana Republic of Turkey would be ready. Did you forget about the Annan plan which Cleredes, Anastasiades and Vasiliou accepted? So they ALREADY agreed to such a plan and we had to reject it in a referendum. So your argument that our politicians will never accept such thing is invalid. Some of them will, and unfortunately both Anastasiades and Malas are among those, as proven with their stance on the Anan plan.
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Thank you Sotos,
As I have been saying for years, the longer the Greek Cypriots wait for a "Comprehensive" solution based on a Two State Bi-Communal, Bi-Zonal Federal Union in Cyprus the lesser of a favourable result for the Greek Cypriots it will be. What you said above is Spot on, to the extent that I would also include the full control of the Sea water of Northern Cyprus by Turkey too. It is there that Turkey will be the greatest winner, as prior to 1974 Turkey's rights as a Guarantor power may have given it access to the entire sea area around Cyprus, but practically she only exercised the limit of 10 miles from her shores while today it's almost 40 miles. Everyday a Cyprus solution is delayed, the more of a footprint Turkey establishes around the island. Furthermore, let's not forget that if Clerides had moved quickly in accepting a federal solution immediately after the 1974 conflict, as he did with the exchange policy at the time, we would have had a "secure" and not "loose" type of Federal Cyprus government in practise today. Unfortunately for the Greek Cypriots every country around the world is now fully educated and aware of the parameters and history of the Cyprus issue where we are now at the stage that a Federal solution based on two states has come to reality. Apart from the argument on guarantees, everything else has been accepted. Once the guarantees chapter has been settled, a new "Federal Republic of Cyprus" will be born with two very autonomous states. If not, then it'll be Partition with the North being integrated with the Republic of Turkey, if it hasn't happened already!
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Re: Cyprus Elections and the True Voter Opinion!

Postby DrCyprus » Fri Feb 02, 2018 12:03 pm

MrH wrote:Thank you Sotos,
As I have been saying for years, the longer the Greek Cypriots wait for a "Comprehensive" solution based on a Two State Bi-Communal, Bi-Zonal Federal Union in Cyprus the lesser of a favourable result for the Greek Cypriots it will be. What you said above is Spot on, to the extent that I would also include the full control of the Sea water of Northern Cyprus by Turkey too. It is there that Turkey will be the greatest winner, as prior to 1974 Turkey's rights as a Guarantor power may have given it access to the entire sea area around Cyprus, but practically she only exercised the limit of 10 miles from her shores while today it's almost 40 miles. Everyday a Cyprus solution is delayed, the more of a footprint Turkey establishes around the island. Furthermore, let's not forget that if Clerides had moved quickly in accepting a federal solution immediately after the 1974 conflict, as he did with the exchange policy at the time, we would have had a "secure" and not "loose" type of Federal Cyprus government in practise today. Unfortunately for the Greek Cypriots every country around the world is now fully educated and aware of the parameters and history of the Cyprus issue where we are now at the stage that a Federal solution based on two states has come to reality. Apart from the argument on guarantees, everything else has been accepted. Once the guarantees chapter has been settled, a new "Federal Republic of Cyprus" will be born with two very autonomous states. If not, then it'll be Partition with the North being integrated with the Republic of Turkey, if it hasn't happened already!


All previous solutions until now would have resulted in a loss for Cyprus. All future solutions, barring the sudden disappearance of Turkey from the Map, will also result in a loss for Cyprus. Fearmongering about the magnitude of the loss is basically moot. At the end of the day, if our only option is to lose, let's get a bit more fun out of the losing process by making it as miserable for the winner as possible.
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Re: Cyprus Elections and the True Voter Opinion!

Postby Sotos » Fri Feb 02, 2018 12:10 pm

MrH wrote:
Postby Sotos » Fri Feb 02, 2018 10:36 am

Get Real! wrote:
In other words, Turkey is currently in control of 37% of Cypriot territory while a Cyprus “solution” (any one of the myriads of plans) would mean their control dropping to 0%, so why would they want a “solution”? :lol:


Here is where you are wrong GR. With the right (for Turkey) "solution" their control would go from 37% to 100%. Turkey has realized that the longer they wait, the more concessions we make. So there is no rush for them. Anastasiades has already agreed that all Settlers will stay, he agreed for rotating presidency, he agreed with direct or indirect vetos for the TCs on everything, he agreed that the "users" of properties will have priority etc etc etc. They ONLY thing he didn't agree yet is about the Turkish army and guarantees... once Anastasiades/Malas makes concessions on that then the Turkish "solution" that would make the whole Cyprus a banana Republic of Turkey would be ready. Did you forget about the Annan plan which Cleredes, Anastasiades and Vasiliou accepted? So they ALREADY agreed to such a plan and we had to reject it in a referendum. So your argument that our politicians will never accept such thing is invalid. Some of them will, and unfortunately both Anastasiades and Malas are among those, as proven with their stance on the Anan plan.
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Thank you Sotos,
As I have been saying for years, the longer the Greek Cypriots wait for a "Comprehensive" solution based on a Two State Bi-Communal, Bi-Zonal Federal Union in Cyprus the lesser of a favourable result for the Greek Cypriots it will be. What you said above is Spot on, to the extent that I would also include the full control of the Sea water of Northern Cyprus by Turkey too. It is there that Turkey will be the greatest winner, as prior to 1974 Turkey's rights as a Guarantor power may have given it access to the entire sea area around Cyprus, but practically she only exercised the limit of 10 miles from her shores while today it's almost 40 miles. Everyday a Cyprus solution is delayed, the more of a footprint Turkey establishes around the island. Furthermore, let's not forget that if Clerides had moved quickly in accepting a federal solution immediately after the 1974 conflict, as he did with the exchange policy at the time, we would have had a "secure" and not "loose" type of Federal Cyprus government in practise today. Unfortunately for the Greek Cypriots every country around the world is now fully educated and aware of the parameters and history of the Cyprus issue where we are now at the stage that a Federal solution based on two states has come to reality. Apart from the argument on guarantees, everything else has been accepted. Once the guarantees chapter has been settled, a new "Federal Republic of Cyprus" will be born with two very autonomous states. If not, then it'll be Partition with the North being integrated with the Republic of Turkey, if it hasn't happened already!


There will be no such "solution" because neither Anastasiades nor Malas can pass such "solution" from a referendum. Anybody in the world that cares about the history of Cyprus can easily find the truth: On one side there are the native people of Cyprus, and on the other side the foreign invaders - the Turks. Furthermore, today nobody that matters likes the Turks. Erdogan has managed to make the Turks universally hated. So don't hope that your pseudo state can be recognized. If what you want is to become Anatolians of the Islamic Caliphate of Erdogan then we can't stop you, we can only help you by taking away from you your RoC/EU ids and passports and close the crossings to the occupied areas... and that is exactly what we should do.
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Re: Cyprus Elections and the True Voter Opinion!

Postby Sotos » Fri Feb 02, 2018 12:16 pm

DrCyprus wrote:
MrH wrote:Thank you Sotos,
As I have been saying for years, the longer the Greek Cypriots wait for a "Comprehensive" solution based on a Two State Bi-Communal, Bi-Zonal Federal Union in Cyprus the lesser of a favourable result for the Greek Cypriots it will be. What you said above is Spot on, to the extent that I would also include the full control of the Sea water of Northern Cyprus by Turkey too. It is there that Turkey will be the greatest winner, as prior to 1974 Turkey's rights as a Guarantor power may have given it access to the entire sea area around Cyprus, but practically she only exercised the limit of 10 miles from her shores while today it's almost 40 miles. Everyday a Cyprus solution is delayed, the more of a footprint Turkey establishes around the island. Furthermore, let's not forget that if Clerides had moved quickly in accepting a federal solution immediately after the 1974 conflict, as he did with the exchange policy at the time, we would have had a "secure" and not "loose" type of Federal Cyprus government in practise today. Unfortunately for the Greek Cypriots every country around the world is now fully educated and aware of the parameters and history of the Cyprus issue where we are now at the stage that a Federal solution based on two states has come to reality. Apart from the argument on guarantees, everything else has been accepted. Once the guarantees chapter has been settled, a new "Federal Republic of Cyprus" will be born with two very autonomous states. If not, then it'll be Partition with the North being integrated with the Republic of Turkey, if it hasn't happened already!


All previous solutions until now would have resulted in a loss for Cyprus. All future solutions, barring the sudden disappearance of Turkey from the Map, will also result in a loss for Cyprus. Fearmongering about the magnitude of the loss is basically moot. At the end of the day, if our only option is to lose, let's get a bit more fun out of the losing process by making it as miserable for the winner as possible.


The biggest losers are the TCs. This is true now, and it will be even more true in the future. In fact the Turkish citizens are also losers, since tiny Cyprus of less than a million people, can have, and will have, a significant negative effect on the well being of every Turk. We can definitely cause much more damage to the Turks than we will do with Anastasiades/Malas, but hopefully this is the last time that this happens. The prospects of such a "solution" should be dead and buried for good 5 years from now.
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Re: Cyprus Elections and the True Voter Opinion!

Postby MrH » Fri Feb 02, 2018 3:26 pm

Hi Sotos, although we differ in our opinion(s) on Cyprus, I would like to say that I am glad we are discussing this in an amicable way and that I respect your ideology of a Cyprus solution, or your ideas, based on you being a Greek Cypriot. What I would like to educate you on, and also GR in particular, is what is happening now and what your leader Mr Nicos Anastasiades has not told you from the latest event at Crans-Montana.

1) Firstly, Nicos Anastasiades should tell you, and this is in answer to youir EU dream, that the majority of "Turkish Settlers" (as you like to put it, are duel EU-Turkish-BULGARIAN Turkish Passport holders. When Bulgaria entered the EU, 600'000 duel Turkish-Bulgarian citizens flooded the EU, including the TRNC, but the ones in the TRNC are remaining quiet as Akinci uses this as a trump card when your stupid leader tries the "Settlers" phrase. At Crans-Montana, Nicos Anastasiades was suddenly cornered into allowing the so called "settlers" to remain in Cyprus as a vast majority of them, and their remaining families in Bulgaria and Turkey hold both duel nationalities.

2) Secondly, No Other Country recognises the TRNC more than the Republic of Cyprus. This you need to understand. Not even Turkey recognises the TRNC as much as they have never internationally championed its recognition until recently (and even now they have not put their backs into it fully. How do I know that the Republic of Cyprus recognises the TRNC? Well, let's think about it for one second as the facts are evident as follows:

a) It was nationalist Rauf Denktas whom opened the border in 2003. Why would he have done that? Since then, hundreds of thousands of crossings are performed each year by all Cypriots and holiday makers, and businesses (Taxi's) on a daily basis. That's Recognition at its most obvious level. Close the border tomorrow and watch the UN switch on you, proving that the actual decision didn't come from Denktas alone but from a higher authority! If your administrator didn't recognise a separate Cypriot state, the border would be similar to that of the East/West Germany boarder or the North /South Korean border but it clearly isn't. It's your administration whom allows, and has allowed its acceptance to manifest and operate. The ROC could have easily have said "OXI" and kept the TCs isolated under Turkey which would have worked to your favour, but no, once again your administration lies to you and gets away with it.

b) The "Cease-Fire Agreement" clearly demonstrates that Northern Cyprus exists as a serparate and accepting administration.

c) The Rolling "6 month UN Mandate" to patrol the "Border" is another form of open acceptance that there are two clear states in Cyprus with their own working administration "in conflict".

d) "Inter-communal" projects and activities performed FROM both sides on a monthly basis shows acceptance to the world that we are working together side-by-side as opposed to one country.

e) The financing by the EU themselves of major projects to the TRNC government on a yearly basis since 2004.

With the above factual practices, why would there be a need for a so called comprehensive solution when both governments on either side know fully well that no referendum on a federal solution will ever get passed its respective citizens? This leaves the Republic of Cyprus is a very strange, political predicament as each passing day of throwing the blame card on Turkey since 1974 has actually turned into a laughing stock.

IF the world; UN, EU etc...etc, really did see Turkey as an occupier, really did believe that Turkey does not have a legal basis for which to be on the island (according to the Turks as the troubles were actually instigated by the Greek Cypriots in 1963 and not only in 1974), why hasn't Turkey been kicked out of Cyprus? Why does Nicos Anastasiades feel compelled to sit at the negotiating table year after year?

The truth here must come from your leader Nicos Anastasiades as he has the proper answers and solution you are seeking. The only Greek Cypriot candidate whom could have secured a Cyprus agreement was your hardliner whom did suggest that the parameters of the Cyprus solution must change, but Nicos Anastasiades soon tricked his people once again into believing in the old dogma of endless talks and another failure in the end.

If Turkey is so wrong....then kick her out. Use your mighty political leverage and build up a UN and EU case to prove Turkey wrong as you know that this can never happen as it was your people from 1955 whom decided to pick on the British. The British made certain that Makarios signed the new Cyprus constitution in desperation and now you are stuck with only half an island/country even after it entered the EU. If being in the EU couldn't guarantee the so called unification of Cyprus, nothing now ever will. Turkey has the Republic of Cyprus exactly where it wants it and now that we have this Hydro-Carbons affair, it's only a matter of type before your greedy political Coffers will sign away the north to infamously enjoy the tax's only of the revenue collected by those natural resources.

Since joining the EU, even your Greek Cypriot Potatoes growers are unable to sell their products abroad due to limits imposed by the EU on your agricultural products. The EU has destroyed any possibility of a Cyprus solution offer than partition and you know it.

Don't agree with me? Print this our and email it to Nicos Anastasiades. Show it to your press and watch them bow their heads down in shame.
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Re: Cyprus Elections and the True Voter Opinion!

Postby Sotos » Fri Feb 02, 2018 6:42 pm

600'000 duel Turkish-Bulgarian citizens flooded the EU


600.000 is approximately the total number of Bulgarian Turks (and most of them are just Bulgarian citizens. The Turkish citizenship is as worthless to them as it is for you). Are you telling me that they all left from Bulgaria to flood other EU countries? Highly unlikely. But lets say that a few of them did go to the occupied areas. So what? How does that change anything? Do you think that other EU citizens have the right to trespass on our properties or are entitled to RoC citizenship?

Secondly, No Other Country recognises the TRNC more than the Republic of Cyprus.


RoC doesn't recognize any "trnc". They merely try to accommodate your community because they hope that one day there will be an agreed solution. Wait for that hope to die, and then you will see the crossings closing and the charity of RoC to the TCs ending.

IF the world; UN, EU etc...etc, really did see Turkey as an occupier, really did believe that Turkey does not have a legal basis for which to be on the island (according to the Turks as the troubles were actually instigated by the Greek Cypriots in 1963 and not only in 1974), why hasn't Turkey been kicked out of Cyprus?


Why isn't Israel kicked out of Palestine, why isn't Russia kicked out of Crimea? It is not that they don't see Turkey as an occupier, it is just that nobody is willing to sacrifice a large amount of its own soldiers for Cyprus.

If Turkey is so wrong....then kick her out.


Not being able to kick Turkey out doesn't mean that Turkey is not wrong. Turkey has the power to keep north Cyprus under occupation. But the biggest losers from this will be the TCs themselves who will become an insignificant minority of an Islamic State, followed by the Turkish citizens who can kiss goodbye any prospect of their country becoming a modern European democracy and instead will see Turkey becoming less Westernized and more islamicized until it becomes the next Iran.
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Re: Cyprus Elections and the True Voter Opinion!

Postby DrCyprus » Fri Feb 02, 2018 11:22 pm

Mr H can you point us to some of the articles you write as a professional?
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Re: Cyprus Elections and the True Voter Opinion!

Postby Get Real! » Sat Feb 03, 2018 12:14 am

Sotos wrote:
Get Real! wrote:In other words, Turkey is currently in control of 37% of Cypriot territory while a Cyprus “solution” (any one of the myriads of plans) would mean their control dropping to 0%, so why would they want a “solution”? :lol:

Here is where you are wrong GR. With the right (for Turkey) "solution" their control would go from 37% to 100%. Turkey has realized that the longer they wait, the more concessions we make. So there is no rush for them. Anastasiades has already agreed that all Settlers will stay, he agreed for rotating presidency, he agreed with direct or indirect vetos for the TCs on everything, he agreed that the "users" of properties will have priority etc etc etc. They ONLY thing he didn't agree yet is about the Turkish army and guarantees... once Anastasiades/Malas makes concessions on that then the Turkish "solution" that would make the whole Cyprus a banana Republic of Turkey would be ready. Did you forget about the Annan plan which Cleredes, Anastasiades and Vasiliou accepted? So they ALREADY agreed to such a plan and we had to reject it in a referendum. So your argument that our politicians will never accept such thing is invalid. Some of them will, and unfortunately both Anastasiades and Malas are among those, as proven with their stance on the Anan plan.

They may “agree” but only VERBALLY Sotos, which is what you fail to understand.

One can pretend to agree and then refuse to sign across the dotted line when it comes to the crunch.

So don’t take too seriously what is being SAID and worry more about what is being DONE, because after all… it is well known that ACTION speaks louder than words.

I'll repeat that... at NO time did any of our governments give anything away to Turkey despite DECADES of "agreeing" to everything. <--- Always remember that.
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Re: Cyprus Elections and the True Voter Opinion!

Postby Get Real! » Sat Feb 03, 2018 12:21 am

MrH, you are wasting your breath so I stopped reading your long post after 2-3 lines because you just don’t seem to get it.

It will NEVER get to a point where we have to worry about such detail.

They say hope dies last but you are ridiculous.

Tattoo this on your forehead…

YOU WILL NEVER HAVE A TC STATE ON CYPRUS
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