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Cypriotism (Cypriot Nationalism)

How can we solve it? (keep it civilized)

Re: Cypriotism (Cypriot Nationalism)

Postby repulsewarrior » Wed Mar 03, 2021 2:25 am

...if i posted this before, i feel it is worth repeating,

Wednesday, May 31, 2017
President: “Does Turkey mean what it says?”

http://in-cyprus.com/president-does-tur ... ment-24095.


"It is clear in Cyprus what “Turkishness” has done, and what in affect “Turkishness” is doing to Turkey. A Cyprus divided, only leads to Turkey more divided; this is natural: as is a united Cyprus, and a united Turkey. What is the Cypriot way, is the way, the “perfect” solution, one that can be emulated, and by the rest of the world held in high esteem, it remains elusive, this reform to a BBF, like the USA, or Canada.

…it is time for Mr. Akinci to remember who voted for him, who he is representing. Mr. Anastasiades, like his electors stand alone, for Cyprus, without him. Without Mr. Akinci, Mr. Anastasiades’ choices are even fewer. He, Mr. Akinci may think there is no choice, that he is ending this drama for Turkish Cypriots by his own betrayal of the rest of us not “Turkish”, feeling perhaps the pressure of such a dogma, and, in any case since those “Turkish” he faces have their own candidates to choose from. Turkish Cypriots risk “being” no-more.

Either Mr. Akinci is a Cypriot, or, not. He makes demands for “Turks”, and he ignores that in the Cypriot context, that “Turks” and “Greeks” are no different and not Cypriot. While he ridicules Mr. Anastasiades for wearing two hats, he should think again, what hat he wears that he wears one. And that, putting Cyprus, before “Greekness”, or “Turkishness”, in Cyprus, to Cypriots, for Cyprus, should have no shame

It is up to Turkey, to act, since Mr. Akinci is not up to the task of uniting a country. What better venue than Geneva with the world watching for Erdogan to demonstrate what could be in effect a “new Turkey”, by recognising the Republic of Cyprus in its capacity to reform itself, and in effect agreeing to a solution agreeable to Cypriots, the other half as i like to call them, those not “Greek” and not “Turkish”.

One Turkey, like one Cyprus is not so hard to understand, if you think about it. Turkey cannot afford a divided Cyprus, and the Republic has demonstrated itself to be a resilient adversary to such a notion. Better as an ally perhaps, a better Turkey perhaps, as a BBF; like in Cyprus not “Greek” while mostly Greek speaking, in Turkey, not “Turkish”, but Turk. A united Cyprus gives hope, a united Turkey is possible, so too Peace in the region.

I say thank goodness for Anastasiades, Greek as he is. If Akinci cannot say he is Cypriot shame on him."
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Re: Cypriotism (Cypriot Nationalism)

Postby repulsewarrior » Sun Mar 07, 2021 4:23 am

Tuesday, December 08, 2015
Bizonality still a sticky question in the Cyprus talks
http://in-cyprus.com/bizonality-still-a ... rus-talks/

''What is a "Turk"? What has "Turkishness" got to do with Cypriots having representation based on Universal Principals, the self-representation which demonstrates the will of Cypriots, as Cypriots?

In my Cyprus Bizonal is not that hard to understand. Regardless of how you divide Cyprus as parts, One Government represents us as Cypriots. One Country exists as a State, and that is the Republic of Cyprus. Under it, all its Citizens are equal, without any discrimination or distinction additionally needed.

Indeed, Cypriot Constituencies exist, and they can be identified by the living relics, language, communities and homes, these Constituents care for till today. As Cypriots, if we are prepared to consider that Cyprus has an Ethnos, (more than "being" mostly Greek,) Cypriots should also be prepared to apply themselves accordingly with Constitutional Reform respecting the nature of this Heritance. If we are prepared to consider that a "Turkish Constituency" should exist, should there be Constituencies for the Maronite, Latin, and Armenian populations which have the same struggle, in terms of sustaining their distinctiveness, as Cypriots. Why not? Why not a Greek Constituency while we're at it? Why not a set of Cypriot Constituencies, at another level of government?

Where in this demand, by or for a Turkish Constituency, is there an effort to represent the principals that clearly indicate an interest in the affairs of Cypriots as a whole? Why are "their" demands so different to my own for example, if "they" care for Cyprus? How are "they" equal to the Republic? They, the occupation's regime, concern themselves with "Turkishness" (and only "Turks" to them are acceptable); there, anyone who dares to fly the Flag of Cyprus risks a great deal of controversy, although just recently, legally, it has been ruled that people have the right to do so.

...in short, such a demand, for "Turks" or "Turkishness", as it is, is asking for a lot, and folly, from a position where (illegally) "they" have much more than they should, "they" seek to care only for themselves, and where "they" "deserve" (and because they have little to offer) very, very, little.

...solution is easy, ask for 7 percent (almost too hard to refuse), and be willing to accept (far) less.

...as for the rest of us, Turcophone, Grecophone, and Cypriot, dividing Cyprus, to "give" some of it away to "someone" who sees us as an "other", seems far fetched, unjust, and a step backwards for Humanity, not just for Cypriots.''
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Re: Cypriotism (Cypriot Nationalism)

Postby repulsewarrior » Tue Mar 09, 2021 8:05 am

Tuesday, March 09, 2021
Disy, Akel leaders: no straying from bicommunal federation
https://cyprus-mail.com/2021/03/04/disy ... 5296584942


They, the "They" you are talking about Huseyin, are the "Turks" and the "Greeks" that live among us.

...but, despite decades, they represent something less than half the voting population.

You may ignore this fact like "them", but it doesn't make it any less true. While we all hope that our Leadership will craft for us a solution that's agreeable, little confidence it seems exists that this may happen soon, i'll agree. And, if "they" go too far, that will be made clear, if it is the People who take to representing themselves. (They too, under their Flag, the Flag of Cyprus, may have "picnics" too.)

...there are Cypriots, and there are the "others". Are Cypriots the Problem?

"Greeks and "Turks" are no different to me. Indeed, the "Greeks" did lose in '74, because the Greeks "being" Cypriot did not support them. Anyone, Greek or Turkish Cypriot now, wishes the same defeat for "Turkishness", and for the same reasons. What is tearing Turkey itself apart today, this dogma, has torn Cyprus apart for far too long. Actually, unity in and for Turkey, what with its own need for Constitutional reform, may well begin in Cyprus, with Cypriots united; this is something to think about.
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Re: Cypriotism (Cypriot Nationalism)

Postby repulsewarrior » Sun Mar 21, 2021 11:02 pm

Sunday, March 21, 2021
Parties cross swords, fail to pass House resolution ahead of Cyprus talks
https://cyprus-mail.com/2021/03/19/part ... rus-talks/


...well, i am hopeful.

Finally these Parties will have to look at themselves,

...and who they represent (read: who they should be representing).

Indeed there are faint attempts to find in Cypriot Political Parties, across the divide, common ground; timid steps. Such as it is, Turkish Cypriots represent about half of the illegal regime's electorate. In effect, they represent the vanguard against our existential threat, the "Turkishness" that, today, divides Turkey itself.

...and after decades, such an Identity may be recognised,and exist, better defined, celebrated, "being" Cypriot, perhaps not by the "Turks", or the "Greeks", perhaps not by Erdogan, but by the People themselves.

"Picnics": peaceful representations; with souvla under the Flag that is rightfully theirs Cypriots may gather.

If it is that the Legislature is split, (the question: what is Cyprus?) this is good; because new thinking is needed.
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Re: Cypriotism (Cypriot Nationalism)

Postby repulsewarrior » Sat Mar 27, 2021 6:17 am

Thursday, November 05, 2015
Re: What does Erdogan's victory mean for Cyprus?
http://www.cyprus-forum.com/cyprus44192-10.html#p828707

...i am expecting Erdogan to use Cyprus differently. It would not surprise me if the "Turks" of Cyprus will feel betrayed, because he will demonstrate through Cyprus the qualities that the rest of the world is looking from him, the recognition of the Republic. In that regard, an about face from Erdogan, makes sense. Externally he will get a great deal of support, improving the credibility which he is now lacking. Cyprus becomes an important ally (with (Syria, Lebanon,) Israel, Egypt, and Greece). Internally, it will not lead to any more discord, against him, it may even help, because as an action it is hopeful to those who feel, in Turkey, that they are suffering from the same intolerance, and in esteem his supporters can take comfort in the potential Turkey can realise Internationally, having made this choice.

...i remember how hopeful the world was with his election originally. This charm is gone. He needs it now, and the Problem provides him an avenue, with its solution.


...as true today.
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Re: Cypriotism (Cypriot Nationalism)

Postby repulsewarrior » Sat Apr 03, 2021 2:46 am

Monday, September 19, 2016
A Cyprus solution? A brief view of what is important
http://in-cyprus.com/a-cyprus-solution- ... mment-4057

...many Cypriot Constituencies can exist. Cyprus is an ethnos, not, "Turkish" and not "Turkish", or, "Greek" and not "Greek". Cypriots exist, they remain, despite the efforts to marginalize such an intention (by "Greeks" and "Turks").

Recognition of a Turkish Cypriot Constituency, is possible, if it exists within the context of a set of Cypriot Constituencies. While representing Persons, offering self representation toward sustaining this distinct identity, as electors, they (any Constituency of this set of Constituencies which chooses to do so) will be closer to their taxes spent toward their own efforts. But, as Individuals, and at a superior level of government, Cypriots, beyond Liberties like these which they may enjoy, to secure them, they need to secure the Freedom which comes from demonstrating a commitment to Universal Principals, as Cypriots, without further distinction or discrimination, willing to defend (a Rule of Law, and) each other.

...when i think of a BBF (Bicommunal Bizonal Federation), i think of Canada, and the USA.

...in that regard the Republic of Cyprus should have no equal.
...(while its government(s) defend Universal Principals equally)

...enclaves are not a dirty word. Even if the "Green line" remains little unchanged, Free Movement, Free Association, and Free Expression, are all encouraged with the geographic insertion of enclaves on the map of Cyprus, north and south. In any case, Justice seen, for the displaced, requires from all Cypriots their recognition and respect. Some at least should return as they left, as Communities, not just as Individuals. The "Green Line" cannot exist but as a frontier among many, or for the good of Cypriots, and if not, it should not exist not at all.

"Something", entirely "Turkish", or entirely "Greek" should (if need be) represent, something entirely small. In any case, and in that regard, nothing more than 1.5% land-wise, i think, is acceptable for either party as such, because in over fifty years of having divided Cypriots, holding the Agenda, they have failed to provide a justification for "their" existence, to the rest of us (as Human beings).

...witness the Occupy Movement in Nicosia a few years ago; the youth in Cyprus, not so easily divided: they are (and were) Cypriot, and despite their differences they remained united for a Cypriot way as Cypriots. New thinking is needed from the political elite, what with the lack of charity they, these young Cypriots received, toward their efforts to "take back" Cyprus from its interlocutors, from them, then. Witness today, in a strange counter-intuitive kind of way, Eroglu is not heading to the negotiations, Akinci is. Witness this same desire from Koray Basdogrultmaci and Cinel Senem Husseyin, having to win the right to "being" Cypriot.

It is a singular message.

... thus, i think the President needs the credibility of winning Individual votes, whatever ethnic origin they may declare themselves to be (or to be a representative of). To lead, it would be reasonable to imagine that a leader could (or should) hold a majority of seats in the legislature where they present an Agenda. If the State was represented with a Bicameral Legislature, it would be possible to have representation by population, and by Party politics. I suggest that at a Federal Election, every Citizen is given three votes, one from each slate offered at their polling station, for a Turkish Cypriot Representative, and a Greek Cypriot Representative, of an Upper Chamber divided equally as seats for the winning candidates, Parties offered on two of these slates, and a third vote, from a third slate, for an Independent Representative of the Lower House, for sober second thought, (a Lower House will offer, regions, minorities (in the context: not "Greek", not "Turkish"), and other minorities,) a voice in making better Law, their debate, to open public consideration, (and Amendments), to secure transparency in the making of Law, they would vote by consensus, respectively, for their electorate as a neighborhood directly. The Leader of the Party winning a majority of seats in such an Upper House, facing such a Lower House, would surely have the confidence, and the representation to lead all Cypriots.

Beyond what could be, or should be, there is Cyprus now. Direct action means more flags that people will sit under. In that regard, in our daily lives, more can be done to do so. This message loud and clear can be brought to the present day ruling class, if when they dare to look out their windows they see such a flag, the Flag of Cyprus, flying from a rooftop, or on a car, as one which cannot be ignored among the many already there, because it is always there, there are more there, in their view. This, Cypriots can do for themselves, now. And in doing so, move closer to each other, seen, as Cypriots, an end, for a better future.

...in the context of, "a ratio", it, should not be set in stone, Constitutionally speaking. Cypriots cannot assume in a world such as ours, that this ratio will not change, or that the demographics will remain the same as the world changes around Cyprus; it is another reason for a Cyprus in terms of representation, for Cypriots, whether representation for "Greeks", or "Turks", "Maronites", "Armenians", or even "British", exists or not.

...enjoyed the article/opinion; thanks.
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Re: Cypriotism (Cypriot Nationalism)

Postby Lordo » Sat Apr 03, 2021 11:52 am

What on earth makes you think that Nationalism of any kind is beneficial. Where have Nationalists stepped foot on and harmony was achived. In fact part of the Cyprus problem was the Cypriots Nationalists being used to not only to fight agaianst each other but to destroy RoC, which they did in 1963.

I sometimes do wonder which universe you live in.
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Re: Cypriotism (Cypriot Nationalism)

Postby repulsewarrior » Sat Apr 03, 2021 7:05 pm

...intentions count, Lordo. It is not Nationalism that is the Problem, but its manipulation by those with selfish aims.
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Re: Cypriotism (Cypriot Nationalism)

Postby repulsewarrior » Sat Apr 03, 2021 8:18 pm

...this little video, Lordo, you might enjoy and it makes the same point politically.



...perhaps if we acted more as Cypriots first, in Cyprus, we may find that its diversity is worth embracing.

...what is, the adversarial posture, may always "be" us, even genetically, but it may be directed toward real enemies, such as Hunger, Disease, and the Ignorance we suffer from our own plundering.

...consider the concepts; "Cypriotness", "Greekness", and "Turkishness": what is appealing to you?

And i suggest the "Greeks", and "Turks", are just as easily exposed by Cypriots simply by standing under their Flag, the Flag of Cyprus; what would "They" do?

Too far is how far; that is the question: can Cypriots remain silenced?

Yet the People, at any time may appropriate peacefully, this Flag, their Flag, and their Identity.

If they do it Publicly, and in large enough numbers, (not just as voters,) they may find that the Leadership may be unable to dismiss the fact that Cypriots exist, too.
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Re: Cypriotism (Cypriot Nationalism)

Postby repulsewarrior » Sat Apr 03, 2021 8:43 pm

Lordo:
"In fact part of the Cyprus problem was the Cypriots Nationalists being used to not only to fight agaianst each other but to destroy RoC, which they did in 1963."

You are mistaken Lordo, your logic is flawed. Think about it. Who did they murder and disappear, but Cypriots?

Frankly, i do not recall Greeks, fighting as "Greeks" against Turks fighting, as "Turks", in some big heroic battle, in Cyprus, do you?

Indeed, among us, as Cypriots, there are those who betrayed such a notion as Cypriot; denying who they are in their mythic realities inflamed by a Leadership more interested in Power, rather than Governance.
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