Cyprus-Forum.com

[Bananiot]

Cyprus cannot prevent the entry of turkey into the EU. The entry of Turkey is a must for the big powers, its part of their geo stragetical policies regarding the curbing of islamic fundamentalism, the fight against terrorism, the formation of a model islamic democratic country and the passage of oil pipes. How can people suggest that wee Cyprus will stand in the way of America, Britain and Europe? I feel I am stating the obvious but apparently our government is guilty of another thing too. Raising the hopes of its citizens with unfounded expectations and leaning heavily on patriotism and relevent rhetoric that has only face value and no real clout.

[erolz]

But if the TRNC is recognized (EU aside) then Cyprus would never allow Turkey to enter the EU, n'est-ce pas?

Maybe maybe not.

Try reading Banniot's post above.

The idea (hope?) that the RoC can dictate any terms over Cyprus (or any other matter) to the EU and the world under threat of vetoing Turkeys accession is in my humble opinion an unrealistic one.

[Piratis]

How can people suggest that wee Cyprus will stand in the way of America, Britain and Europe?

Sure, US and UK want Turkey as a full member, but the majority of EU countries do not. Most EU countries would prefer a close relationship with Turkey, but not full membership. If they wanted Turkey so much as you claim Turkey would have been a member already.

I believe that Turkey in 10-15 years not only will need Cyprus and Greece not to veto, but she will need Cyprus and Greece as strong supporters of her membership.

[erolz]

Sure, US and UK want Turkey as a full member, but the majority of EU countries do not. Most EU countries would prefer a close relationship with Turkey, but not full membership. If they wanted Turkey so much as you claim Turkey would have been a member already.

What do you think happened at the last EU summit?

If most EU countires had wanted only an offer of 'special relationship' then they would have offered that. It was not just the 'majority' of EU members that agree to start (full) accesion talks with Turkey, it was in fact a unamious desidion of the heads of state of ALL the EU members, RoC included (because that is what is required under current rules). Yes many problems still remain. Yes different members of the EU have different concerns. Yes there is still the issue of 'popular support' for Turkish entry, but to say that the majority of EU countries do not want Turkey in the EU, after this historic summit, is just denial on a massive scale.

[insan]

Cyprus cannot prevent the entry of turkey into the EU. The entry of Turkey is a must for the big powers, its part of their geo stragetical policies regarding the curbing of islamic fundamentalism, the fight against terrorism, the formation of a model islamic democratic country and the passage of oil pipes. How can people suggest that wee Cyprus will stand in the way of America, Britain and Europe? I feel I am stating the obvious but apparently our government is guilty of another thing too. Raising the hopes of its citizens with unfounded expectations and leaning heavily on patriotism and relevent rhetoric that has only face value and no real clout.

You exactly sum it up very well, Bananoit. This is the fact that we all should have acknowledged and take our steps accordingly. Otherwise, it is obvious that the weaks which resist to this new world order policy, unfortunately will be victimized as a consequence...

[Piratis]

is just denial on a massive scale.

Erolz, I am afraid you are the one in denial. As I said most EU countries want a special partnership with Turkey. For now this special partnership will be achieved by having Turkey a candidate country for the next 15-20 years. If they didn't give the date to Turkey then the Turko-EU relationship would worsen, something that is not for the benefit of neither Turkey or EU.

Why do you think EU made it so clear that the result of negotiations is "open ended"? Countries like France and Austria have already, 15 years earlier, declared that a referendum will be held about Turkey.

EU made sure not to give any fake promises to Turkey so nobody will say that was cheated or back stubbed in 15 years from now.

Do you honestly think that EU will let Turkey in, when by that time Turkey will have larger population than any EU country?

[erolz]

Erolz, I am afraid you are the one in denial. As I said most EU countries want a special partnership with Turkey. For now this special partnership will be achieved by having Turkey a candidate country for the next 15-20 years. If they didn't give the date to Turkey then the Turko-EU relationship would worsen, something that is not for the benefit of neither Turkey or EU.

I do not believe the EU works in that way. I do not believe that it says one thing and means another. I believe that it is essenstialy sincere. I do not believe that it, as a centralised entity, has agreed to accession on the basis that it will never actually grant it, regardless of what changes Turkey makes. Not only do I not beleive it would act in such a way I do not think it would be possible for it to do so.

Why do you think EU made it so clear that the result of negotiations is "open ended"? Countries like France and Austria have already, 15 years earlier, declared that a referendum will be held about Turkey.

All negotiations are 'open ended'. If they are not then they are not negotiations. The wording of the 'document' was a compromise. It allowed for the possiblity of some other status as a result of the negotations, because such was a requirement to get the unanimous decision necessary. However it also clear that the first prefered objective is for full accession of Turkey. That is the prefered solution that the document indicates.

EU made sure not to give any fake promises to Turkey so nobody will say that was cheated or back stubbed in 15 years from now.

Well your idea of 'fake promises' and mine differ somewhat. Yours would appear to be based on a 'legalistic' approach. For me what matters is intent. If the intent of agreeing accession negotions was to never actualy allow such accession, regardless of what changes Turkey makes, then I would consider that the 'promises' (to allow accession if the necessary hurdles can be overcome) is most definately 'fake' in my view. If this is what the EU has done (which I do not believe) then yes it has cheated Turkey and stabbed it in the back, regardless of any 'sophistry'.

Do you honestly think that EU will let Turkey in, when by that time Turkey will have larger population than any EU country?

I do not think that accession will be easy for either Turkey or the EU but I do think that as things stand currently both sides are comitted to (sincerely, and not with some hidden agenda) try and achieve this. If the EU had already decided that it would never let Turkey into the EU I do not believe it would have made the agreements it did at the last summit.

Accession for Turkey is not guaranteed but you seem to think it's guaranteed that such accession is impossible, despite the sumit decsion. That to me seems like wishful thinking rather than a rational dispaionate assment of events.

[Piratis]

Accession for Turkey is not guaranteed but you seem to think it's guaranteed that such accession is impossible, despite the sumit decsion. That to me seems like wishful thinking rather than a rational dispaionate assment of events.

Why wishful thinking? After all why is it for Cyprus benefit if Turkey is going to be rejected from the EU anyways?

What I say is what I believe will happen. Only time will show who is right on this one.

[brother]

I find it strange that forum users are almost suggesting that the E.U is about saying one thing and meaning another in other words 'two faced'.

I REALLY HOPE YOU ARE WRONG FOR THE SAKE OF THE WHOLE PLANET

[Piratis]

find it strange that forum users are almost suggesting that the E.U is about saying one thing and meaning another in other words 'two faced'.

What did it say? It said that negotiations will start in October (if by that time Turkey does what she has to do). Nothing more than that.

It was stated very clearly that the result is open ended. All negotiations in the past were theoretically open ended, but never before this was stated so clearly. So because you do not like one of the two possible results (the most possible result I believe) this means that EU is two faced????

They told you that is open-ended, some told you that they will hold referenda in their countries about Turkey (and in those countries public opinion is against the Turkish membership), but you only hear what you want to hear.

I REALLY HOPE YOU ARE WRONG FOR THE SAKE OF THE WHOLE PLANET

Here we go with the whole planet again. Like the whole world will loose its sleep over the Turkish EU membership.