Cyprus-Forum.com

[Saint Jimmy]

My dear brothers,I have at last made some impressionON Piratis If he is fanatic then these are the type of people who
are an obstacle to PEACEin the world. I use the word ETHNOCENTRIC which is the polite word for RACISM I would be glad if Piratis gets upset
perhaps he can gain some insight into the dangers of fanaticism and would invite all members of this form to join me inthe quest to expose these dagerous people.)

Uzan, I don't want to get into such a conversation. It serves no purpose.
Perhaps you should ask Piratis what he intends to do if a solution that finds him in disagreement is adopted (the logic being that, seeing as he describes himself as a believer in democracy, he could not, surely, state that he would actively go against any kind of majority that will have voted for such a solution). Maybe his answer would be a good indicator as to the usefulness of such conversations.

Denktash has,on many occasions, stated that "the problem with the Gc is that they are dreamers and live in a fantasy world"(not that I am supporter of Mr Denktash but I must respect his long years of experience with Gc)

Hmmm... I have my doubts as to whether we should reject Denktash (or anyone else, for that matter) when we disagree with him and quote him when we want...

[Piratis]

Perhaps you should ask Piratis what he intends to do if a solution that finds him in disagreement is adopted (the logic being that, seeing as he describes himself as a believer in democracy, he could not, surely, state that he would actively go against any kind of majority that will have voted for such a solution). Maybe his answer would be a good indicator as to the usefulness of such conversations.

There are different degrees of disagreement. On some things I just disagree, and some things I strongly oppose and find totally unacceptable. I highly doubt that the majority will ever approve what I strongly oppose.

In the highly unlikely case that such thing happens then this is the decision of Cypriots and I will not oppose it in any way. Of course this doesn't mean that I will become a victim because the others choose too.

[Saint Jimmy]

Well, presumably the issue is a version of the Annan plan as a solution, right? Is there anything in there that could make you feel victimized, enough to cause your (and, presumably, others' who share your stance) active reaction? Personally, that is...

[Piratis]

The only action that will ever be needed by me and others who share my views is our vote in a referendum. That will be more than enough to stop any attempts to victimize some people just because they speak Greek.

Some people that in the referendum supported "yes", after the results became known they did not accept them and they tried in 100s of ways to harm other Greek Cypriots and Cyprus as a whole to take their "revenge" because what they supported was not accepted by the majority. I can assure you that such things that equal with treason is not what I would do.

Unfortunately it seems that democratic values are only supposed to be respected by some, while others can act not just in undemocratic, but in illegal ways as well, and remain unpunished.

[Saint Jimmy]

Dude,
I couldn't figure out if you were talking about me, but, all the same, I don't get what you mean.
Maybe you should explain what you mean by people trying to get revenge on those who voted 'no'... and 'hurting' them...??? Could you give me an example of what you have in mind?

I suppose the part about democratic values being respected only by a few is an extension of the paragraph directly above it. So, I would like you to explain that part first before we can talk.

[uzan]

Uzan, your "research" is obviously not a valid one since it was created with the sole purpose of promoting the interests of Turkey and your community. You already told us your aim: partition. Such kind of propaganda will not help your aim though.

Personally I am atheist, and my fiancee is neither GC or Greek. So you will have to create a different "research" to give a bad label to me since I obviously do not fit in the group that you tried to discredit with your "research".

What I am is a democrat that considers democracy as one of the highest values that can not be given up. If this doesn't serve your purposes then feel free to label me whatever you want, I couldn't care less. The same way I am free to call such people like you as thieves, that are trying with any way possible to excuse the crime that they continue to commit even this very moment we are talking.

As a result of this Tc&GC will be better off to remain as they are at the present but to accept the Northern Cyprus into the EC

If there is one thing that we can guarantee you that will never happen is this.

My dear friend Piratis, You have again missed my point I am not claiming that aa Greeks are ethnocentric or racist and I am glad to find out that you are as democratic as I am and probably most of the Tc are the same as us . I have merely tried to enlighten the forum that the Orthodox Clergy of any religious denamination are an obstacle to democracy in this troubled world and since we are specifically talking about Cyprus communities I have no choice but use the Gcdominant religion as an example to express my poit of view. Is no need for some one like you to react in such an undemocratic manner. I
it is I guess a possibility that you have little or no training in debating in any professional way. In debates of such nature the opinion of the participants should be respected without becoming personal ornasty in any way. Any way It must be expected that in such an open form participant should come from all walks of life and therefore I respect your reaction to me and I am sorry if I have offended you in any way it was not meant to be that way.
Please do not give up your contribution to the cause of peace in Cyprus and please join my quest to get the The Greek Orthodox Church to stop involving them-selves in politics and instead concentrate in their function to respect all other religions and not to be ETHNOCENTRICwith regards to their chosen faith.

[Piratis]

My dear brothers,I have at last made some impressionON Piratis If he is fanatic then these are the type of people who
are an obstacle to PEACEin the world. I use the word ETHNOCENTRIC which is the polite word for RACISM I would be glad if Piratis gets upset

You first called me fanatic and racist and said that you would be glad if I get upset, and then you come to give me lessons about "professional debating" where the opinion of participants should be respected. Can you be even more hypocrite than that?

Any way It must be expected that in such an open form participant should come from all walks of life and therefore I respect your reaction to me and I am sorry if I have offended you in any way it was not meant to be that way.

Fuck you too, and sorry if I offended you

please join my quest to get the The Greek Orthodox Church to stop involving them-selves in politics and instead concentrate in their function to respect all other religions and not to be ETHNOCENTRICwith regards to their chosen faith.

I am doing this. In school I used to argue all the time with the religion teachers. In elementary school some kids used to call me muslim because of that. Still, while this is a society problem, I disagree that it is a main problem for the relations of the two communities, and you should not use such thing as an excuse to promote division or anything undemocratic.

[-mikkie2-]

Yet more crap in this thread as well!

Geez we are supposed to be reconciling, not drawing swords!

I fail to see how the Orthodox Church is brain washing people. What was the bishop of Morphu preaching? Was he preaching 'death to the Turks' or was he preaching peace with our Turkish Cypriot compatriots?

You forget that people are much better educated and more knowlegeable about the world than they used to be and are capable of thinking for themselves. The influence of religeous leaders in politics is minimal.

[Saint Jimmy]

Mikkie I don't disagree on the Morphou guy, but I was wondering if you could name one more of our clergy that really works towards reconciliation... I would say most of them are sinister figures who are more worried about who gets to be Number One, instead of preaching love. But, to tell the truth, I don't have particular in their interest in their actions or words, so I couldn't pass as an expert on the issue...

[boulio]

greeks and orthodox clergy are racist?the greek people in a one day telethon raised 20,000,000 euros for the pre-dominatly muslim tsunami victems,the roc has raised close to 1,000,000 in personal contributions,how much has turkey and the dektash raised for there fellow muslim brethern?do you know how much the gulf states have plegded according to the new york post combined 50,000,000 dollars.take your rascism remarks and shove them up your ass.