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The Cypriot Resolve

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Re: The Cypriot Resolve

Postby DrCyprus » Wed Nov 04, 2015 11:24 pm

Sotos wrote:It appears that Galician is not even a dialect of Spanish, but actually more related to Portuguese, which renders your whole argument void.


I never ever claimed that Galician was a dialect of Spanish (a.k.a Castillian). As I said before, both Galician and Castilian are Iberian dialects of Latin that evolved into different languages. At some point Galician and Portugese had a common ancestor that diverged into two branches. Both Portugese and Galician are considered seperate languages even when their common ancestor is more recent that the one of mainland Greek and Cypriot Greek.


Nonsense. The pathway is clear to all that can study history and making the dialect an official language wouldn't change anything at all. So basically you couldn't even find a single real and practical benefit!


(A') Brand recognition. (B')Arousal of the interest of international linguists to explore the Greek Cypriot language to its absolute depths. (C') Birth of a Greek identity that Greek Cypriots can truly identify with, that doesn't obstruct or occlude their Cypriotness or tell them that they are a sub-culture.

Sotos wrote:1. Less of our students will be able to study at Greek universities


Galicians speak perfect Castillian (Spanish) because they are taught it from birth and at school, just as Greek Cypriots will also learn standard Greek from birth and at school.

Sotos wrote:2. Communication between Cypriot and Greek traders and businessmen would become more difficult


I speak fluent Spanish and never had a problem communicating with any Galician during my stay there. They did teach me a few of their words and expressions for fun and I used what they taught me to better connect with other Galicians.

Sotos wrote:3. Reduced ability to read the books written in standard Greek (which will always be many times more the number of books that could be written in the Cypriot dialect).

4. Most large software companies will not bother creating a version of their software for a language spoken by just half a million people.


Congrats, you just managed to regurgitate the same bullshit four times in four different ways. Even Basques, who are taught and speak a language that has nothing to do with Spanish (Castillian) can speak proper standard Spanish without a problem, read books in Spanish, talk to Spanish businessmen, receive education in Spanish universities and have software in Basque.

If Microsoft decides to not release the next Windows version also in Cypriot Greek, BIG FUCKING DEAL, we can petition it as a government and furnish them with the translations ourselves. If they still deny it, well we'll just settle for Modern Greek like every other Greek, and we'll be able to understand it just fine because it will be also taught in schools just like Galician and Castillian Spanish is taught in schools simultaneously.

I also worked at a school in Catalonia where the children were taught equally in all English, Catalan and Castillian at the same time from the age of 2 and onwards. NO PROBLEM WHATSOEVER, and they were lovely children too.

.... and I could list many more such practical disadvantages. Such thing would have NO benefit, lots of real practical disadvantages and it would push Cyprus further away from the other Greek speaking populations something which only the Turks can gain from.


Unfounded scaremongering bullshit.

We only have to gain from finally defining our own Greek identity, and no Greek will dare call us less Greeks or distance themselves from us. Everything is already there, we just have to put the stamp on it.

Really? So lets start with a single word. Tell me the one official way that we would write and pronounce the word "τσάντα" with "standard Cypriot".


First accept both candidates «τσιάντα», «τσέντα» as regional varieties of the different dialects of the Greek Cypriot language. Then take the one used by the most speakers of Greek Cypriot as the standard. If more Cypriots say «τσιάντα» will standardize it, «τσέντα» will also be accepted. big. deal.
Last edited by DrCyprus on Wed Nov 04, 2015 11:46 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: The Cypriot Resolve

Postby Get Real! » Wed Nov 04, 2015 11:26 pm

Nikitas wrote:That old dialect banana again. While we are at it we might as well distinguish the Cretan, Dodecanese, Eptanisian, Epirotik, Thessalic, Thracian and Pontian dialects, why limit ourselves to Cypriot.

We also have to invent a new alphabet, or at least some symbols, perhaps borrow the cedilla and the umlaut from Turkish to denote the special thick sounds of "CH" and "SH" and the extra heavy consonants.

Guys, lighten up. It is a dialect, just like Yorkshire English is a dialect. And as a dialect it has grace as well as limitations, ie when it comes to expressing complex thought and ideas that require lots of compound words, legal texts, etc.

One of you dialecticians should present us with a Charter Party written in dialect to prove its adequacy. Or a medical diagnosis, or the architectural definition of load bearing beams. That should be a humorous as well as edcuational exercise for the writer.

Greek is a dialect of Cypriot just as you are the descendant of your grandfather and not the other way round.
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Re: The Cypriot Resolve

Postby DrCyprus » Wed Nov 04, 2015 11:41 pm

Nikitas wrote:That old dialect banana again. While we are at it we might as well distinguish the Cretan, Dodecanese, Eptanisian, Epirotik, Thessalic, Thracian and Pontian dialects, why limit ourselves to Cypriot.


We should, if we are to preserve them.

We also have to invent a new alphabet, or at least some symbols, perhaps borrow the cedilla and the umlaut from Turkish to denote the special thick sounds of "CH" and "SH" and the extra heavy consonants.


Thousands of years of Greek history have provided us with ample characters and variations of characters and even accents and punctuation systems to differentiate these sounds without loaning foreign concepts.

One of you dialecticians should present us with a Charter Party written in dialect to prove its adequacy. Or a medical diagnosis, or the architectural definition of load bearing beams. That should be a humorous as well as edcuational exercise for the writer.


The only parallel I can draw from this type of thinking is that of the father who locked his son up in a room and never educated him or taught him how to speak and supressed his natural human insticts and repressed his needs... and when they asked the father why he kept his son locked up in a room he said 'because he's a retard, he can't live in the outside world.

What a cheeky twit you are, to have the nerve to say this with a smug look on your face.

I ask you to do the same thing with Greek, but mind you the version of Greek before Adamantios Korais and his Greek linguist peers touched up the language. Go on, amaze us.
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Re: The Cypriot Resolve

Postby repulsewarrior » Wed Nov 04, 2015 11:49 pm

Greek is a dialect of Cypriot just as you are the descendant of your grandfather and not the other way round.


...as history goes, well said.
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Re: The Cypriot Resolve

Postby Pyrpolizer » Wed Nov 04, 2015 11:56 pm

From the 1st to the 3rd grade of elementary school my teacher was a beautiful blonde hair- blue eyes - young woman from Greece.There weren't that many GC teachers back then. Basically I was initially educated like a mainland Greek boy. The other day I used a clearly mainland Greek word "γουβαδακι" to describe something and my daughter laughed at me asking where the hell did I learn this word from. Both the Mainland Greek and our local dialect have their own merits imo and we should be happy to know both. It makes us cleverer.
DrCyprus -btw does this mean Phd or Medical :wink: raised the issue that our local dialect might be the REAL Greek.

What is it that makes it a dialect then? Similarly what makes the TC language a dialect of Turkish?
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Re: The Cypriot Resolve

Postby DrCyprus » Wed Nov 04, 2015 11:57 pm

insan wrote:Reh guno(a loan word from GC dialect) :lol:

I'm neither a Turkologist, nor an academics or archeologist whatsoever... are you aware that you are talking absentmindedly?


There are hundreds of Turkologists, archeologists, linguists and academics from various nationalities who put forward these views with full evidence or partial evidence... your hate against anything not suits you took your lil brain under control... get rid of it you lil gubbins!


The preponderance of the scholarly judgment is that the Huns were Turks but the evidence for their being Turks could equally justify believing they were Mongolian. Of course, there probably would have been both Mongols and Turks in the leadership of the Huns just as in the 13th century Genghis Khan's Golden Horde about half of the warriors were Turks. The question of who were the Huns really centers on what was the ethnicity of the leadership of the Huns because without a doubt there were Goths, Gepids and Alans among the rank and file of the Hunnish army.




http://www.applet-magic.com/hunnish.htm



... and check how the civilized intellectual people discussing such issues! Gadaramenoya bak be!


http://www.eupedia.com/forum/threads/28 ... green-eyes


Re poushtoui (a loan word from the TC dialect) :lol:

If any of the theories you posted were proven common knowledge then you would have been able to simply link us to a Wikipedia link or at least a proper encyclopedia. Instead, you litter the forum with all these garbage B- and C- grade links.

You even believe in the Atatürk sponsored "Sun Language Theory". I knew you were damaged in the head when you brought up the Hittites.

Don't ever stop entertaining us, but please stop pretending to be a Cypriot because you weren't raised to be one.
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Re: The Cypriot Resolve

Postby insan » Thu Nov 05, 2015 12:27 am

DrCyprus wrote:
insan wrote:Reh guno(a loan word from GC dialect) :lol:

I'm neither a Turkologist, nor an academics or archeologist whatsoever... are you aware that you are talking absentmindedly?


There are hundreds of Turkologists, archeologists, linguists and academics from various nationalities who put forward these views with full evidence or partial evidence... your hate against anything not suits you took your lil brain under control... get rid of it you lil gubbins!


The preponderance of the scholarly judgment is that the Huns were Turks but the evidence for their being Turks could equally justify believing they were Mongolian. Of course, there probably would have been both Mongols and Turks in the leadership of the Huns just as in the 13th century Genghis Khan's Golden Horde about half of the warriors were Turks. The question of who were the Huns really centers on what was the ethnicity of the leadership of the Huns because without a doubt there were Goths, Gepids and Alans among the rank and file of the Hunnish army.




http://www.applet-magic.com/hunnish.htm



... and check how the civilized intellectual people discussing such issues! Gadaramenoya bak be!


http://www.eupedia.com/forum/threads/28 ... green-eyes


Re poushtoui (a loan word from the TC dialect) :lol:

If any of the theories you posted were proven common knowledge then you would have been able to simply link us to a Wikipedia link or at least a proper encyclopedia. Instead, you litter the forum with all these garbage B- and C- grade links.

You even believe in the Atatürk sponsored "Sun Language Theory". I knew you were damaged in the head when you brought up the Hittites.

Don't ever stop entertaining us, but please stop pretending to be a Cypriot because you weren't raised to be one.


At least I was raised to be humane, kind and civlized to the ones who deserve... reh mavro yerimo kahalı seni! :lol:
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Re: The Cypriot Resolve

Postby Sotos » Thu Nov 05, 2015 9:37 am

DrCyprus wrote:I never ever claimed that Galician was a dialect of Spanish


So how the fuck is it related to Cypriot which is a dialect of Greek??? Obviously if the Galicians speak a DIFFERENT LANGUAGE which is NOT Spanish, then they learn their own language just like in Cyprus the TCs have the right to learn Turkish. So stop confusing two totally different things.

Brand recognition


:lol:

Arousal of the interest of international linguists to explore the Greek Cypriot language to its absolute depths.

Doubtful, and with ZERO practical benefits for the Cypriot people.

Birth of a Greek identity that Greek Cypriots can truly identify with, that doesn't obstruct or occlude their Cypriotness or tell them that they are a sub-culture.

Most Cypriots have no identity issues like yourself. Enforcing our links with all other Greeks is actually a positive thing, especially when our common enemy is Turkey. Diminishing those links only benefits the Turks, not the Cypriots.

I speak fluent Spanish and never had a problem communicating with any Galician during my stay there.


The point is not about ability of communication but how well you know the standard form of the language. If we will introduce another language in schools then this will come at the expense of something else, unless you suggest to increase by several hours the time that students have to go to school. I'd rather have my kid learning something USEFUL in school, rather than wasting his time in something useless (because you still didn't manage to offer even a single practical benefit). In Spain those who learn a different language are those who have a different language.. NOT a DIALECT of Spanish. In the case of Cyprus such people are the TCs who speak a different language and not a dialect of Greek.

First accept both candidates «τσιάντα», «τσέντα» as regional varieties of the different dialects of the Greek Cypriot language. Then take the one used by the most speakers of Greek Cypriot as the standard. If more Cypriots say «τσιάντα» will standardize it, «τσέντα» will also be accepted. big. deal.


Why should the standard be what most people speak? How does this solve the problem you talk in your original post? Wouldn't a person from Paphos feel bad when his own language is considered "incorrect" and "villegey"? So you are solving NO problems but you are CREATING many more.
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Re: The Cypriot Resolve

Postby DrCyprus » Thu Nov 05, 2015 10:36 am

insan wrote:At least I was raised to be humane, kind and civlized to the ones who deserve... reh mavro yerimo kahalı seni! :lol:


The moment you added 'the ones who deserve it', it became a void sentence meant to feed your mavroyerimo ego.

Your hero Atatürk said "peace at home, peace in the world" not "peace at home, peace to those who deserve it".

You are either humane, kind and civilized to everyone, or you are not humane, kind and civilized at all. It takes personal power to accept that someone may disagree with you, have different opinions, and that maybe just maybe is proving you wrong.

Downplaying other forum contributors to lift yourself is just another proof that no matter how old you are, you have a lot of growing up to do inside.
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Re: The Cypriot Resolve

Postby DrCyprus » Thu Nov 05, 2015 11:12 am

Sotos wrote:So how the fuck is it related to Cypriot which is a dialect of Greek??? Obviously if the Galicians speak a DIFFERENT LANGUAGE which is NOT Spanish, then they learn their own language just like in Cyprus the TCs have the right to learn Turkish. So stop confusing two totally different things.


As I said 3 times already in this very thread, both Castillian Spanish (the language most people refer to as Spanish) and Galician Spanish started off as Iberian DIALECTS OF LATIN.

Mainland (Modern) Greek and Cypriot Greek started off as DIALECTS OF KOINE GREEK.

Koine Greek is NOT Modern Greek. => Cypriot Greek is not a dialect of Modern Greek.


Doubtful, and with ZERO practical benefits for the Cypriot people.


Certain, and with TONS of practical benefits for the Cypriot people.

Most Cypriots have no identity issues like yourself.


If I'm a Cypriot, and I feel the need to further express my Cypriotness, then that means that there's at least one Cypriot who wants to further develop the cultural identity of Cyprus. Even if I'm a minority of ONE, I still claim my natural right to freely express myself, and to present my ideas and beliefs to the world.

Enforcing our links with all other Greeks is actually a positive thing, especially when our common enemy is Turkey. Diminishing those links only benefits the Turks, not the Cypriots.


Being a Cypriot Greek is being a member of the Greek ethnos, and if we are allowed to further explore our Greek roots and have our own official Greek language then we'll be able to show to the world that we are the Greeks of Cyprus and underline our Greek culture.

What you type is just scaremongering dribble that stems from your ignorance.

If we will introduce another language in schools then this will come at the expense of something else.


We already have time devoted to Cypriot literature and Cypriot history and even seperate books on them.

I'd rather write an essay on Η 9η Ιουλίου of Vasiles Michaelides than Elitis' bullshit Τρελλή ροδιά.
Lots of Seferis because he loved Cyprus, and lots of Kavafis because he was spectacular and to remind us that once upon a time there were Greeks in Alexandria too.

Time to get rid of the useless, poisonous and indoctrinating θρησκευτικά to make more time.

Why should the standard be what most people speak? How does this solve the problem you talk in your original post? Wouldn't a person from Paphos feel bad when his own language is considered "incorrect" and "villegey"? So you are solving NO problems but you are CREATING many more.


As I said, regional dialects of the Cypriot language will be considered equal. I never felt that my Cypriot Greek language was incorrect or villagey, that's what they tried to force on me to accept. A ploy to downplay the rich culture of the Cypriot Greeks as though treating someone's culture like shit is a prerequisite for them to want Enosis with your country.

There's a whole difference between opressing the native Greek culture in favour of an imported one and the observing of regional varieties.
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