Cyprus-Forum.com

[erolz66]

Max do you think there are serious problems and issues with policing in the USA and some kind of effort to achieve change is needed ?

If you do think some kind of effort to achieve change is needed do you have any ideas, thoughts or suggestions on what possible routes to achieving change might be ?

[Maximus]

I dont know enough about it,

I am just commenting on these deaths (case by case basis) as I see them with the information available.

[erolz66]

I dont know enough about it,

I am just commenting on these deaths (case by case basis) as I see them with the information available.

Fair enough. Did you have a chance to look at this case ? cyprus45751-410.html#p898142 I ask not to harass you but because I do actually have significant degrees of respect for you and your input. I would suggest if you have the time and the will to start with the video and then read the link. Would really like to hear you comments on this particular case ?

[Maximus]

I dont know enough about it,

I am just commenting on these deaths (case by case basis) as I see them with the information available.

Fair enough. Did you have a chance to look at this case ? cyprus45751-410.html#p898142 I ask not to harass you but because I do actually have significant degrees of respect for you and your input. I would suggest if you have the time and the will to start with the video and then read the link. Would really like to hear you comments on this particular case ?

I appreciate that Erolz, and no worries about disagreements,

What I see from that video you posted are some officers that wanted to talk to a guy, there is no mention for what reason or why.

Then it seems that they either wanted to pat him down and or try and hand cuff him.

then a scuffle broke out, an officer gets hit and has a bleeding nose and the guy gets taser for resisting what seems t be an arrest.

I dont know what to make of it but given what I see in the video they arrested him and read him his rights.

What for? I dont know.

[erolz66]

I dont know enough about it,

I am just commenting on these deaths (case by case basis) as I see them with the information available.

Fair enough. Did you have a chance to look at this case ? cyprus45751-410.html#p898142 I ask not to harass you but because I do actually have significant degrees of respect for you and your input. I would suggest if you have the time and the will to start with the video and then read the link. Would really like to hear you comments on this particular case ?

I appreciate that Erolz, and no worries about disagreements,

What I see from that video you posted are some officers that wanted to talk to a guy, there is no mention for what reason or why.

Then it seems that they either wanted to pat him down and or try and hand cuff him.

then a scuffle broke out, an officer gets hit and has a bleeding nose and the guy gets taser for resisting what seems t be an arrest.

I dont know what to make of it but given what I see in the video they arrested him and read him his rights.

What for? I dont know.

Until a couple of days ago and the police body cams becoming public this guy had spent the last 5 months in jail awaiting trial on charges of assaulting a Police officer and under 250,000 bail facing a possible sentence of 21 years in jail.This to me is an extreme example of where Police abusing citizens rights led to the manufacture of a criminal that was not a criminal before they got involved and started abusing this person rights. The attorney generals office originally brought the charge without even reviewing the police body cam footage. Thankfully since the video footage became public they have reviewed this footage and their decision and all charges against the victim have been dropped and they are considering if charges against any police officers need to be considered and brought. The whole thing is seriously fucked up imo. How much wasted time was spent on this that should have been and could have been spent on trying to catch real criminals rather than on making a citizen a criminal via abusing his rights ? They guy now has a good lawyer and will be seeking damages, all time and money not spent on stopping and catching real criminals. The kind we ALL want stopped and caught ? I also have to wonder how many cases are there like this, how many people in jail, where the police footage does not become public, where it get lost or where the police simply turned off their cameras before abusing someones rights ?

I personally see a connection between individuals like myself choosing to either educate themselves and to not automatically conceed to any police request beyond what is legally required and the chances of police officers believing they can act in ways like this and get away with it. I do appreciate it is not a clear and direct line between two dots but I think it is real and a dam sight clearer and real than some of the more populist dot connecting some people here on this forum seem so enamored of.

[Maximus]

I just finished reading the link to the article you posted.

Body camera video released to cleveland.com shows the driver, who said he had his elderly mother in the passenger seat, told police after Settles was arrested that he thought Settles was a “bum” and was going to ask him for money. The man said Settles stood behind his car for about a minute before he moved quickly up to the door and “jerked” on the handle. The man laid on the horn and told Settles to leave, he said.

“When I laid on the horn, he pointed, like he was saying something,” the man was recorded telling police on the video. “I couldn’t hear because I was laying on the horn.

The man said Settles walked, not ran, away from the car after he sounded the horn. He said he decided to call the police because he thought Settles might have been trying to steal his car, and he decided that “if he went down the street and carjacked somebody, I don’t know if I could live with myself.”

Just another guy that dindu nuffin....

[erolz66]

And sorry but am on a bit of a rant now. I think there is another vital point in the video Kiks posted that we, society, need to really get a grip on. This idea that politely insisting that Police respect your rights to not answer questions when there is no legal obligation to do is NOT "non co operation". It is not an automatic sign or proof of guilt. I think that most Police and most people consider it is such and that I think is part of the problem. we need to really get to grips with this if we want change I think. I constantly hear the refrain "if you have nothing to hide then why would you not concede to any request from Police regardless of if there is any legal obligation on your to do so" ?

[Maximus]

You have the right to remain silent and that is a sign, in the moment, of non co-operation but it doesn't automatically prove guilt for anything.

If they suspect you of doing something, or committing a crime they can still question you in the presence of a lawyer.

So that is not some kind of get out clause for everything.

[Paphitis]

This is a classic video where PI who is an ex cop gets pulled over in his car. A must see.

Those 3 coppers were actually really nice Kikapu.

very polite and they didn't get heavy. I am trying to relate and compare them to Australian police.

Australian Police would not have been so nice. If you do the above to Aussie police, they would screw you like you never been screwed before. They would in all likelihood be arrogant.

Even if you knew your rights and didn't put a foot wrong, they would get you out of the car and say we pulled you over because we spotted a few things wrong with your car and we want to inspect it. They will find something and defect your car.

You are then only able to drive your car home, and then from home to a licensed mechanic to fix the problems on the yellow sticker they fix on your rego. Then you have to take it to an approved inspection point, where police will inspect your vehicle again. It will cost you a couple of hundred dollars, for the inspection and then they will find something else because they black marked you and they will be arseholes. So back to the mechanic to get that fixed and then back for another police inspection for another couple of hundred dollars. they will have you go back and forth for as many times as they can possibly do, just to bust your chops and fleece you.

Eventually you will pass after several hundred dollars.

personally, I would prefer cops like those in that video who really kept it together. Australian coppers will really screw you over. Can't really complain with those coppers really.

The only reason these 3 cops were “nice” it’s because they were being video and the driver knew his rights under the constitution, which these three cops tried over and over to violate it for almost 30 minutes without success. You see Paphitis, the law keeps the cops in check, as well as the citizens. If the citizens do not know their rights, the more the cops become cunts. I don’t know what laws you have in Australia, but the US constitution is the foundation of everyone’s rights, and if broken, there are recourses to punish those who break them, no matter how small or large. From monetary compensation to prison terms. I hope you take note of all this if and when you make the USA your home one day for yourself and for your family.

I don't know about that Kikapu.

These days we all have cameras and video, and we even have these dash cams now. But my encounter was on video, and that police officer was a lot more arrogant than these 3 police officers were.

I actually think these 3 officers were really good and perhaps Aussie police should be taking some notes.

the older police officer of the 3 was especially cool.

[Paphitis]

You have the right to remain silent and that is a sign, in the moment, of non co-operation but it doesn't automatically prove guilt for anything.

If they suspect you of doing something, or committing a crime they can still question you in the presence of a lawyer.

So that is not some kind of get out clause for everything.

Absolutely! they are allowed to arrest and question you on suspicion of an offence.

They can remain silent. What this guy did was resist arrest, and also assaulted a police officer. he got tazed.

I see nothing wrong with any of that.

The only thing I see wrong in that video is that the assaulted police officer mocked him and used foul language. Clearly he was angry but that was still unnecessary and uncalled for as well as unprofessional.