Cyprus-Forum.com

[kurupetos]

There's nothing there that can help your filthy cause, cousin.

Try something else.

[repulsewarrior]

...three votes. When voting the elector chooses from three slates, electing a Turkish Cypriot Representative, a Greek Cypriot Representative, and for a Lower House, an Independent Representative (without Party affiliation).

If a leader could win a majority in a Legislature evenly split as seats Turkish and Greek, Parties, to win the leadership would necessarily fill all the slates toward that end. It would be in effect impossible to win such a House, without a majority of Cypriots in any case. Parties would necessarily have to present Platforms that their voters would consider as Individuals, not just as Persons. A Turkish Cypriot, as President, or a Greek Cypriot as President would be just as likely, and based on merit.

...and what of the demographics of the island? Is it believable that any 'number' chosen to represent some 'fair' split now will be as valid in the future? Why should it matter? Who is represented and how will minorities be given their recognition and respect in such as State if "Greekness" and "Turkishness" are fixed to some bloodline? Indeed it is far more complex, (or far simpler, either way) the issue is not one of "Greekness" or "Turkishness" but the Universal Principals we demonstrate, as Cypriots that we are willing to defend. (and allow me to add, there is no shame in "being" Cypriot)

Cypriot Constituencies may exist. They have the potential of being several as a sum. It is clear that a Turkish Constituency is prepared to demonstrate the value of such political representation, as Persons, specifically to nurture this Identity. Embracing this change, for Cyprus, the existence of distinct identities, within a Cyprus where Cypriots express no discrimination or distinction between themselves as Cypriots, is the BBF which offers to Individuals and Persons, their Freedom and Liberty respectively.

Cyprus has a Republic, a State. If it is to have a Turkish Constituency, i ask where are its equals? I ask, Cypriots, as Persons, would they, as Cypriot Constituencies, not have the same needs in sustaining their own diversity, that which makes them vital? Wouldn't they be more effective in sustaining their distinct identities through self-representation if in representing themselves there was a similar debate, as a 'majority' which may have different interests competing for attention, but always aware and mindful that there exists a 'minority' with its own special needs they must nurture as well? Wouldn't a Federal Government in this scheme of things be seen to be free of its present bias in securing a Cypriot their Freedom, and this Liberty, in setting a standard and goals?

...I ask, why not within this Republic, at another level of Government, as well, a Greek Constituency (and others)?

Could Mr. Akinci recognise the existence of the Republic (and work toward its reform), if the representative of a Greek Constituency was duly elected, not the President of the Republic? Is it possible for the President to remove himself from the discussions, so that when the Constituencies are in unanimity they may discuss the State's Constitutional reform with him? Mr. Akinci must demonstrate something more than a "Turkish" view to claim he is a Cypriot, imho.

Some may recall the Communal Chamber and why it failed, while the intention remains. One may also recall that while "Greeks" and "Turks" were busy doing their killings, it was not other "Greeks" and "Turks", it was Cypriots for not being "Them", who were murdered and made to disappear. That while the coup succeeded, removing Makarios from office it failed because there were so few "Greeks" on the island supporting it. And, I remind the readership that Cypriots have existed for millennia as Cypriots. In any case, Cypriots cannot be denied the same basic principals any Human being has, to being Cypriots. It would be a despicable thing if Cypriots cannot call themselves Cypriots to satisfy these same people who deny the existence of their Flag, the Flag of Cyprus, under which so many have died for at their hands already.

...a Cyprus divided, is a Turkey divided; it is something to think about. A "new" Cyprus, is not the answer, like a "new" Turkey i believe, they are likely to divide these populations further. The Problem is not exclusively a Cyprus Problem; witness how the same "Turkishness" has divided Turkey. Yet Cyprus is small in population; one hopes that this is an advantage in its own Constitutional reform. That while Turkish Cypriots look to Turkey for guidance, I suggest it should be the other way around; that while Turkey is in this state of reform it is all the more valid to think differently. That if, Cyprus is not "Greek", Turkey is not "Turkish" for the same reasons. That as a Constituency what can be gained being Cypriot, offers the same hope to the Kurds, and the Alevi, (not "Turks", but Turks) for example in Turkey. That this same hope, in a Cypriot way, makes it clearer, what is an Individual, what is a Person, what is a Nation, what is a State, what is Freedom, what is Liberty; and from a Unitary State exclusively, to a BBF, Cypriots, by changing themselves in this way may possibly change the political landscape throughout the region, being the "perfect" solution sought after for so long, because it is practical, it promotes respect among all Peoples, it is held in so much high esteem, (it is the solution to Turkey's Problem), and it is something which can be emulated.

It is wrong for Turkish Cypriots to think that they are weak and impotent; but as "Turks" they are.

[repulsewarrior]

I have said it before, and I will say it again:

...a Cyprus divided, is a Turkey divided.

The Problem, the Cyprus Problem, is Turkey's Problem. In effect, the Problem's solution must be "perfect". Without such a solution, there is no template, something held in such high esteem, that it is emulated. Such as it is, in Cyprus, to solve their issues, for fifty years, Turkey has sought to define "Turkishness", by exclusion of the rest (read: "Greeks"); this failed, with its culmination, when the Annan plan was rejected. And while there are "Greeks" in Cyprus, against "Turks", in Cyprus, the "Kurds" and the "Alevi" continue to grow uneasy in Turkey as well...

Respect, Trust, Recognition, are words that come to mind; that while Cyprus and Turkey have been adversaries for so long, they have proved themselves to be equals better suited working as equals together, and not against each other. What is true for Cyprus, is true for Turkey. What is true for Cypriots, is true for Turks. If we are to be divided, "our" side, the "others", the debate is flawed as it is, because the enemy is Ignorance (our own); there are those who are Loving, and there are those who are not. In any case, none of these "identities" are monolithic, "minorities" as such exist in them, there is no getting around that either, "security-wise".

(at some point "they" must identify themselves as "some", in a larger "one")

I have Faith in Mankind. I count on the "standing man". In their silence volumes of words for Erdogan's Turkey to hear, that "Turks" are not Turks, when even this voice is silenced.

Indeed, a change of intentions is needed. The recognition that as Nations the world has become so small, States exist; that beside "being" Persons, as Individuals, (Lest we Forget,) we must be willing to defend each other, without discrimination or distinction, and for the Universal Principals on which such thinking is based.

Such a BBF is possible; in Cyprus and in Turkey. Erdogan, by saying, "One Cyprus, One Turkey", may demonstrate this courage to the world, but more importantly, for him, to his constituency, and to the People of Turkey. If Turkey is not "Turkish", Cyprus is not "Greek", in a counter-intuitive kind of way, this makes sense. He may choose to make it so. If there is a "Greek Constituency", in Cyprus, among a set of Cypriot Constituencies, a set of Turkish Constituencies, in Turkey, is not so hard to perceive.

Recognition of Cyprus, a Cyprus that is an ally, is power; but first Erdogan must exhaust the possibilities he has for a Legacy, beyond the Treaty of Lausanne, in a "new Turkey". Cyprus, as Turkey's National issue, has been kept alive as an issue for moments like these. I am hoping that he has the will to leave a Turkey whole and stronger. With Cyprus, ("his", or not,) he has this possibility.

We are, not "Greek", and not "Turkish", as Cypriots, the other half. A "new Cyprus" is not the needed remedy therefore, but a Cyprus reformed, because Cypriots exist, still, despite the efforts for so long, of those, "Greek", and those, "Turkish", in their denial of them. It is a 'new Enosis' that is needed, for security: beyond the EU, beyond the historical antithesis, despite "it", Cypriots united toward a Cypriot way.

For our security, as Cypriots, "being" Cypriot first, counts a lot more, Cyprus being an island after-all.

[repulsewarrior]

Cyprus. first.

As Cypriots, without further discrimination or distinction: Cypriots; what is hard to understand?

...what and who in truth are those martyred, if we as Cypriots do not honour, them?

Let us not forget that Cyprus is an island, on it Cypriots still exist and, despite being torn apart, remain; after decades in assimilation, in effect still representing about half the population any way it's counted.

...if Mr. Akinci would stand under the Flag of Cyprus, what of the impact for Peace; who would oppose him: not his electors (...who remembers over whom, his victory). Who would be against him; if Anastasiades chooses to join, in standing under this Flag?

....something to think about speaking reform; i think: bigger still, in Cyprus this unity in Turkey unites.

...with those against a Cypriot, against a Cyprus, exposed, what is it a Cypriot can not do, defending the Freedom, that they all have a cause as Cypriots (and in effect as Human beings,) in defending? What prevents them from offering each other mutual respect, Liberty, by trusting and respecting each other in that capacity, as Persons, each others' distinct identities, as well?

These are the possibilities, if in the debate toward ending the Cyprus Problem, it has on one side of the table Cypriots representing the Cypriot way, and on the other those who remain compelled to define their "Greekness" and "Tukishness", together, as being more important to them:

...could the debate framed in this way form two levels of Government; a true BBF? One Cyprus, a State where as Individuals every Citizen can stand united in defending the Universal Principals on which it is based, and, within it this population, a diversity more clearly defined, where as Constituencies, and as Persons in their own diversity as a population, in demonstrating tolerance, as a majority toward minorities, and toward each other as Cypriots, recognising each others' special needs, reciprocally.

...happy Independence Day?

New thinking is needed indeed, common sense, and a little bit of courage, better intentions, for Cyprus.

...through all the mayhem let's never forget that those who died, mostly, died as Cypriots; at their bloody hands those "Greek" and/or those "Turk", they were murdered and made to disappear.

https://cyprus-mail.com/2018/10/01/pres ... -cypriots/

...on the issue of unity; a way, ahead.

[repulsewarrior]

...your country was saved by the brave people who did not join the efforts of the coupists: other Cypriots. Two days after the coup began, it fell. Surely you don't deny that the measures taken against Cypriots, because they were Greek, by the Turkish Army, were not well founded? The greatest Cypriots, those who stayed in their homes were rounded up, evicted, or made to disappear. What makes the "Turks" heroes, they are, and were, no better than the "Greeks". What makes '74 so right, if '63 was so wrong?

Cyprus exists because of the will of its people. In spite of Turkey, its "Turks", (and Greece, and other interlocutors as well,) "Cypriots" remains an identity Cypriots identify with.

cyprus43843.html?hilit=cyprus%20file

...another example.

[Maximus]

pages and pages and pages of some desperate deluded person trying to get a telephone number, to somehow show that he has 'courage'.

Do you want my telephone number?

[repulsewarrior]

...beyond the pages is the topic.

[repulsewarrior]

...Cypriotism,

Saturday, April 08, 2017
Cyprus: Lawmakers amend law ensuring peace talks restart
https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/eu ... 2ca6e51f7a

.


...a small minority had their day in the Legislature, and Mr Akinci was appalled.

...i remind the readership who elected these men, Mr. Anastasiades, and Mr. Akinci; certainly not the "Greeks" or the "Turks", they have their own Candidates, but, the other half, who do not have this compulsive need to deny as Cypriots, they are Cypriots.

It is clear who Mr. Anastasiades represents with his words and deeds, witness these efforts, something more than "Greekness". Will Mr. Akinci demonstrate the same courage against an opposition just as "Turkish", the same but not "Greek"; will he demonstrate to Cypriots something beyond "Turkishness", now?

I suggest from the day he was elected, with that angry phone call he got, that he has a lot to prove to have a lasting Legacy as a Cypriot. I dare him to stand beside the Flag of Cyprus for one thing (the "Greeks" have a Flag, the "Turks" have a Flag, and most certainly "they" both have an aversion to the Cypriot Flag), i dare him to go against that "Turkish" thinking, to state quite clearly, that such a Person exists, a Cypriot, Greek or Turkish perhaps (there are several Cypriot Constituencies), that such a State exists, in need of reform for many reasons, but where as Individuals, Citizens are willing to defend each other without any further distinction or discrimination.

...i remind the readership that the USA is a BBF, so is Canada, something the "Turks" should consider for their own reform, in Turkey.

Indeed, there are Cypriots they exist, let's not forget, them. It is up to Mr. Akinci, now, to demonstrate that he is a Cypriot.

...as true today, as when this comment was written.

[lonewolfcypriot]

Just Cypriot, a lot of people on this forum are a lot older than you are. I would advise that you show a bit more respect. You might learn something.

[repulsewarrior]

...who are you talking to?