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Beirut explosion .......

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Re: Beirut explosion .......

Postby Robin Hood » Sun Aug 09, 2020 6:55 pm

Another interesting view of the explosion and the lead up to it. Escobar has been reporting on the region for a long, long time and is well informed.
Who Profits from the Beirut Tragedy - by Pepe Escobar : Republished from Asia Times by permission of author:

“The narrative that the Beirut explosion was an exclusive consequence of negligence and corruption by the current Lebanese government is now set in stone, at least in the Atlanticist sphere.

And yet, digging deeper, we find that negligence and corruption may have been fully exploited, via sabotage, to engineer it.

Lebanon is prime John Le Carré territory. A multinational den of spies of all shades – House of Saud agents, Zionist operatives, “moderate rebel” weaponizers, Hezbollah intellectuals, debauched Arab “royalty,” self-glorified smugglers – in a context of full spectrum economic disaster afflicting a member of the Axis of Resistance, a perennial target of Israel alongside Syria and Iran.

As if this were not volcanic enough, into the tragedy stepped President Trump to muddy the – already contaminated – Eastern Mediterranean waters. Briefed by “our great generals,” Trump on Tuesday said: “According to them – they would know better than I would – but they seem to think it was an attack.”

Trump added, ...... “it was a bomb of some kind.”

Was this incandescent remark letting the cat out of the bag by revealing classified information? Or was the President launching another non sequitur?”

Rest of the article ..........

https://thesaker.is/who-profits-from-the-beirut-tragedy/
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Re: Beirut explosion .......

Postby Londonrake » Sun Aug 09, 2020 8:26 pm

Robin Hood wrote:I have not seen that suggested anywhere so I assume it is your own personal conspiracy theory? Have you been out in the sun without sun-screen and your hat? :roll: :)


A jest, obviously.

As far as too much sun's concerned. Well, in this sort of weather I do seem to spend an inordinate amount of time dragging the neighbours gardens out of the pool. :D The sombrero and rose tinted Ray Bans help though.

Obviously, this thread was going to enter the conspiratorial dimension at some stage, these incidents always do. Nevertheless, a pity I think. But you can't win an argument with a good CT man. It's akin to taking on a very religious person about their views. Ultimately pointless. In a similar vein to the scriptures there's no requirement for any evidence, unlike in other incidents where to be accepted (which would be a first) it has to be forensic and of a "hold up in court" standard. All that's needed on their part is belief and "faith" to make the case so obviously true. Except to the infidel, closed-minded unbelievers of course.

What primarily interested me in this was hearing and feeling the explosion. We tend to think of and post about ME subjects with a sort of detached view I think. As though all of these King/fiefdoms were distant and academic. That event brought home to me how close these things really are though.

I did actually post on the subject first - with the same title - but when Erolz (lord of pedantry) answered yours I deleted it. Obviously, there was no point in running 2 threads on the same subject.

I think all the evidence to form a rational view of what happened on that evening is there. The video (I'm assuming that in this case there isn't a claim it's faked). Plus anecdotal stuff relating to how the material ended up in that warehouse and was neglected for so many years. It's likely volatile condition. The fire burning prior to the explosion - etc, etc.

Again, there's been a significant amount of protest and rioting in Beirut today with talk of early elections. Which I suppose the long-term incumbent politicos perceive as a way out of their dilemma. If so, those who take a close interest in such things seem to think that "our friends" (JBC) in Hezbollah are likely to significantly increase their presence in parliament. Not really a good result I suggest for the Israelis. You would think they'd have seen that one coming before they started a fire which ignited the fireworks which set off the bomb. Sort of "There was an old lady that swallowed a fly" stuff. Clever.

So, who will win the CF Beirut conspiracy theory competition? It's looking like a close thing at the moment. Will the Israelis be found guilty - by default? Or those inscrutable Hezbollah hordes? Sadly, the Martians are 100 - 1.

Ding, ding! Seconds out.

I'm sure this will be nugatory effort. Nevertheless - once again - please note the size of the fire (to which the brigade were called out) the flashes which take place at its base and how it subsequently precipitates the main blast. Also, a further reference in the narrative to a port worker talking about the storing of fireworks there. This isn't a bomb going off or a missile, it isn't an attack, it's a mega fuck up.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LNDhIGR-83w

.
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Re: Beirut explosion .......

Postby Robin Hood » Mon Aug 10, 2020 7:50 am

All I have said so far is that I believe it was an accident! That is just MY opinion and I have no more proof of that than anyone else!

If I leave it there and accept that as the only explanation and don't bother to follow that up, then I would regard any other theory as a 'conspiracy theory'. But I am not made that way! I am sceptical by nature! I am always prepared to accept a situation (or a person) as I find them until I learn otherwise.

That is why I post information that I find that could be of interest ......... not offering it as an explanation or theory!

It will cement my current opinion when I start reading from other sources about the money trail the politicians and elite will have left behind them. But I would expect that information to come from multiple independent sources. Being a sceptic, I would consider it highly likely that the UK/US Government, through the banking system, are fully aware and have been for decades, about the corruption in Lebanon and where all the money is. It would therefore be in their power, as they have demonstrated with others, to turn off their access to finances within hours. After all the rhetoric, if that does not happen then IMO ..... there is a cover up going on behind the scenes and the UK/US and others with vested interests, will be in there somewhere, but most improbable that either Russia or China will be involved.

So I have no immediate opinion ........ conspiracy theory or official theory. It will take some time for people like Escobar to get to those that have the information. Then each theory should be considered on the credibility of the evidence.
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Re: Beirut explosion .......

Postby Cap » Mon Aug 10, 2020 5:31 pm

Republic of Cyprus continues to aid .... and rightfully so.
'Cyprus is sending 20 tons of dry food to Lebanon, collection continues'

https://in-cyprus.philenews.com/cyprus- ... continues/
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Re: Beirut explosion .......

Postby Londonrake » Mon Aug 10, 2020 9:45 pm

Robin Hood wrote:All I have said so far is that I believe it was an accident! That is just MY opinion and I have no more proof of that than anyone else!

If I leave it there and accept that as the only explanation and don't bother to follow that up, then I would regard any other theory as a 'conspiracy theory'. But I am not made that way! I am sceptical by nature! I am always prepared to accept a situation (or a person) as I find them until I learn otherwise.

That is why I post information that I find that could be of interest ......... not offering it as an explanation or theory!

It will cement my current opinion when I start reading from other sources about the money trail the politicians and elite will have left behind them. But I would expect that information to come from multiple independent sources. Being a sceptic, I would consider it highly likely that the UK/US Government, through the banking system, are fully aware and have been for decades, about the corruption in Lebanon and where all the money is. It would therefore be in their power, as they have demonstrated with others, to turn off their access to finances within hours. After all the rhetoric, if that does not happen then IMO ..... there is a cover up going on behind the scenes and the UK/US and others with vested interests, will be in there somewhere, but most improbable that either Russia or China will be involved.

So I have no immediate opinion ........ conspiracy theory or official theory. It will take some time for people like Escobar to get to those that have the information. Then each theory should be considered on the credibility of the evidence.



Yes, all the evidence - and you might perhaps trust your own eyes in that respect - points to the devastating tragedy which struck Beirut last week being the result of criminal negligence on the part of the Lebanese government over many years.

You present somebody called Escobar :? "The Saker" as being authoritative on the subject. Who is he? Does he live in Beirut? Is he Lebanese? His Wicki says he's Swiss and lives in Florida (amazing, how so many anti-US bloggers wishing the destruction of the Great Satan actually live there). So, where does he get his information from? Perhaps this might give a clue: https://www.stopfake.org/en/the-saker-b ... -defiance/ His web entry on the subject, like so many of his others, is a rabid anti-west effort. What he seems to offer in support of his conspiracy theory is a couple of words from Trump inferring it was an attack. That's the Trump of course who's idiotic knee-jerk comments on a host of matters are legendary. Try looking up what he's said about Covid over the past 6 months. And that's "proof"? :lol:

We both know that, if you're determined to find an Israeli connection, then of course you will at some point. In an earlier post you said "You have the knack of misrepresentation to make your point. I would counter your accusation saying ..... like your reaction to events you see, although also without proof, as having some Russian involvement? MH17 and The Skripals being just two examples! Is that not what is referred to as 'cognitive bias'?" Well, close. That's an expression you picked up from me long ago :wink: . Actually though, it's "confirmation bias". What it means is that rather than accept a contrary view - no matter how compelling and obvious - you look instead extensively for something which agrees with your own.

Anyway, it you want the view of those who actually live in Lebanon I recommend you look at "Lebanese newspapers". You will find it comes up with about 15. I've been through half a dozen or so of them (you need to select translate for most). Some rail against the government, others less so. What I haven't found, in any of them, is mention of an Israeli connection. Even Aoun - in a desperate attempt to deflect blame - merely said he didn't rule out an act of sabotage, without any mention of by whom.

Rioting continues in Beirut. In the past week 3 cabinet ministers have resigned on the issue. There's speculation that the government might stand down, en masse.

The idea that Israel or Hezbollah played a part in this tragedy are conspiracy theories. Nothing more, nothing less. Like you say "without a shred of evidence".

Your talk of the US/UK banking system, like your previous references in this thread - which is about the Beirut explosion - to Hiroshima/Nagasaki, 9/11, Antisemitism, MH17 and the Skripals has absolutely no bearing at all on the disaster which struck the city last week. Apologies if I missed any out.
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Re: Beirut explosion .......

Postby repulsewarrior » Tue Aug 11, 2020 12:30 am

https://www.dw.com/en/lebanons-governme ... m_ln=43785

"I declare today the resignation of this government. May God protect Lebanon,'' Diab announced.
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Re: Beirut explosion .......

Postby Londonrake » Tue Aug 11, 2020 6:15 am

repulsewarrior wrote:https://www.dw.com/en/lebanons-government-resigns-over-deadly-beirut-port-blast/a-54514487?maca=en-newsletter_en_bulletin-2097-xml-newsletter&r=3716057580304684&lid=1578084&pm_ln=43785

"I declare today the resignation of this government. May God protect Lebanon,'' Diab announced.


As expected.

You have to admire Yialousa. He lobs in a 3 word hand grenade then is never heard of in the thread again, :lol:
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Re: Beirut explosion .......

Postby Robin Hood » Tue Aug 11, 2020 8:16 am

Londonrake:

So, once again you divert a thread to pass on your opinion on me and my posts. Yet ANOTHER thread you have hijacked! :roll:

I regard Escobar as having the experience over the last 20 years to have contacts and sources that qualify him as an informed source. That is why I posted his article. Before trying to destroy the message and the messenger try at least to get the basics correct! Has it never occurred to you that ANY journalist who publishes the other side of the news will most likely display an apparent anti-Western bias as they publish the side of the news stories that the Western MSM don’t. This does not automatically make any journalist you happen to disagree with ........ a Kremlin/Russian/KGB/Putin agent or stooge!

According to you, I am guilty of ‘cognitive/confirmation’ bias ..... but of course you are not, your sources are impeccably neutral and devoid of any bias? :lol: So do try to at least get the basic facts correct.

Pepe Escobar was actually born in Brazil and is the roving correspondent for Hong Kong/Thailand-based Asia Times and also analyst for Toronto/Washington-based The Real News. Since the mid-1980s, he has lived and worked as a foreign correspondent in London, Paris, Milan, Los Angeles and Singapore/Bangkok. Since 9/11 he has extensively covered Pakistan, Afghanistan, Central Asia, China, Iran, Iraq and the wider Middle East. When not on the road, he lives between Sao Paulo, Paris and Bangkok.

This suggests he has the background and sources to write the articles he does with some authority on subjects related to events in the region.

Now your chosen source ......... yes they come over as really unbiased! :lol: :lol:

Your fact check site ‘STOPFAKE’ was founded 2014 in Kiev, Ukraine as an anti-Russian propaganda web site. The site is financed by crowd funding, readers' contributions, the Renaissance Foundation, the Foreign Ministry of the Czech Republic, the Foreign Ministry of the United Kingdom and the Sigrid Rausing Trust.

As noted by Wiki ....... they have unpleasant baggage!

"In 2020, Ekaterina Sergatskova, a Ukrainian journalist, published an article detailing links between leaders of far-right and neo-Nazi groups and the directors of StopFake.org. Following this, she was targeted for harassment and threats, and personal information of her and her son were posted online. Sergatskova was forced to flee Kiev citing fears for her life."

At least Escobar doesn’t get thugs to threaten those that happen to question his credentials.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/StopFake


You are the main, in fact only reason, I don’t bother with this forum much any more. You seem to sit at your keyboard, logged on to this forum, waiting for an opportunity to make your opinions of me and any sources I reference, known to all. Do you think putting me down makes you some sort of HERO and a focus point for Western values ? Get a life! :roll: :x
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Re: Beirut explosion .....

Postby Londonrake » Tue Aug 11, 2020 8:36 am

Ehh? I haven’t “put you down” at all. :?

And, far from waiting for you to post, I think - with the single exception of expressing sympathy for your Wife’s medical plight during the lockdown - I haven’t commented once on anything you’ve contributed in here for something like 6 months. :?

For a number of reasons I‘ve a close interest in what’s happened/happening in Beirut. Not wishing to see it shunted off into another conspiracy thread isn’t “hijacking”.
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Re: Beirut explosion .......

Postby Cap » Wed Aug 12, 2020 12:19 pm

CYP armed forces deliver 20 tonnes of food to Lebanon.

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