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What happened to flight MH370?

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Re: What happened to flight MH370?

Postby Pyrpolizer » Sat Mar 29, 2014 2:03 am

Paphitis wrote:
Pyrpolizer wrote:Looking at the work the other professors presented (really dreadfully more advanced than mine but hey I can be excused because Physics is not what I studied) I have no doubt that Professor Jayson Taylor would add even more depth and more accurate analysis. If you want to know at what depth just read his last sentence.
Yet he refused to participate for the same reason i kept on shouting in this forum.(were's the data i.e)
Here's what he said on facebook.

https://www.facebook.com/jasontaylor777 ... 7479552158
wrote:

Nobody likes getting stale data and news, but that is what is going on with MH370. Who owns the MH370 data? Why isn’t it Creative Commons or copyleft? Is it right that the data be horded by MAS or the other dozen or so entities involved, with tiny fragments of it sporadically spoon fed to the public? Why aren’t the families' lawyers asking judges for subpoenas of all flight data? I’m glad one entity has finally started to demand it, and don't see the need for any secrecy here.

P.S. I don't follow this Doppler stuff, so I'd like to see that data too. Most receivers I know about can't store small frequency shifts like that. It just weakens the signal amplitude. Don't let this get over your head. You know this too. Incidentally, most of the velocity has to be transverse, which is an extra factor of beta/2=v/(2c) down and can be ignored. (It's from time dilation in special relativity.)



Of course we 've had that satellite Engineer telling us all that stuff I posted before.


Is that right!

Inmarsat have released the data and it has not been challenged by any serious "academic" or physics professor.

In fact, Boeing and Airbus have also confirmed the findings.

Inmarsat was only within coverage of 1 Satellite which is not surprising die to the remoteness of the area. Inmarsat analysed the Doppler Shift of the pings of MH370 and it moved away or towards the Satellite and compared this to other aircraft thus being able to define an approximate position.

To work out which direction was taken by flight MH370, Inmarsat, working with the UK’s Air Accidents Investigation Branch (AAIB), says it used some clever analysis of the Doppler effect. The Doppler effect describes the change in frequency (the Doppler shift) as a sound/light/radio source travels towards the listener, and then again as it moves away. The most common example is the change in frequency of a police or fire truck siren as it passes you. Radio waves, such as the pings transmitted by flight MH370, are also subject to the Doppler effect.

Basically, Inmarsat 4-F1′s longitude wobbles slightly during its orbit. This wobble, if you know what you’re looking for, creates enough variation in the Doppler shift that objects moving and north and south have slightly different frequencies. (If it didn’t wobble, the Doppler shift would be identical for both routes.) Inmarsat says that it looked at the satellite pings of other flights that have taken similar paths, and confirmed that the Doppler shift measurements for MH370′s pings show an “extraordinary matching” for the southern projected arc over the Indian Ocean. ”By yesterday [we] were able to definitively say that the plane had undoubtedly taken the southern route,” said Inmarsat’s Chris McLaughlin.

http://www.extremetech.com/extreme/1791 ... -the-plane


It hasn't released the data, I already provided you 10s of links of what they released, and what you explained above is just parrot repeating of what they presumably explained that doesn't really make sense without the data and without proof that their only satellite was able and did in fact record ed that data.

I dont remember them mentioning Airbus, they did mention they asked some information from Boeing- Boeing declined to confirm that they saw their data, they did say they passed the data to some other company, they refused to name the company, etc etc.
Later on they said it was a sister company ...
Last edited by Pyrpolizer on Sat Mar 29, 2014 2:08 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: What happened to flight MH370?

Postby Paphitis » Sat Mar 29, 2014 2:06 am

Pyrpolizer wrote:
Paphitis wrote:
Pyrpolizer wrote:Looking at the work the other professors presented (really dreadfully more advanced than mine but hey I can be excused because Physics is not what I studied) I have no doubt that Professor Jayson Taylor would add even more depth and more accurate analysis. If you want to know at what depth just read his last sentence.
Yet he refused to participate for the same reason i kept on shouting in this forum.(were's the data i.e)
Here's what he said on facebook.

https://www.facebook.com/jasontaylor777 ... 7479552158
wrote:

Nobody likes getting stale data and news, but that is what is going on with MH370. Who owns the MH370 data? Why isn’t it Creative Commons or copyleft? Is it right that the data be horded by MAS or the other dozen or so entities involved, with tiny fragments of it sporadically spoon fed to the public? Why aren’t the families' lawyers asking judges for subpoenas of all flight data? I’m glad one entity has finally started to demand it, and don't see the need for any secrecy here.

P.S. I don't follow this Doppler stuff, so I'd like to see that data too. Most receivers I know about can't store small frequency shifts like that. It just weakens the signal amplitude. Don't let this get over your head. You know this too. Incidentally, most of the velocity has to be transverse, which is an extra factor of beta/2=v/(2c) down and can be ignored. (It's from time dilation in special relativity.)



Of course we 've had that satellite Engineer telling us all that stuff I posted before.


Is that right!

Inmarsat have released the data and it has not been challenged by any serious "academic" or physics professor.

In fact, Boeing and Airbus have also confirmed the findings.

Inmarsat was only within coverage of 1 Satellite which is not surprising die to the remoteness of the area. Inmarsat analysed the Doppler Shift of the pings of MH370 and it moved away or towards the Satellite and compared this to other aircraft thus being able to define an approximate position.

To work out which direction was taken by flight MH370, Inmarsat, working with the UK’s Air Accidents Investigation Branch (AAIB), says it used some clever analysis of the Doppler effect. The Doppler effect describes the change in frequency (the Doppler shift) as a sound/light/radio source travels towards the listener, and then again as it moves away. The most common example is the change in frequency of a police or fire truck siren as it passes you. Radio waves, such as the pings transmitted by flight MH370, are also subject to the Doppler effect.

Basically, Inmarsat 4-F1′s longitude wobbles slightly during its orbit. This wobble, if you know what you’re looking for, creates enough variation in the Doppler shift that objects moving and north and south have slightly different frequencies. (If it didn’t wobble, the Doppler shift would be identical for both routes.) Inmarsat says that it looked at the satellite pings of other flights that have taken similar paths, and confirmed that the Doppler shift measurements for MH370′s pings show an “extraordinary matching” for the southern projected arc over the Indian Ocean. ”By yesterday [we] were able to definitively say that the plane had undoubtedly taken the southern route,” said Inmarsat’s Chris McLaughlin.

http://www.extremetech.com/extreme/1791 ... -the-plane


It hasn't released the data, I already provided you 10s of links of what they released, and what you explained above is just parrot repeating of what they presumably explained that doesn't really make sense without the data and without proof that their only satellite was able and did in fact record ed that data.


they have released the data to Boeing, the Australians, Chinese, Americans and so forth.

So far even Airbus has confirmed the calculations and they too have calculated an Approximate Position.

This is not some Bordello here. There is an investigation underway and the last thing anyone wants is a stupid media circus. Inmarsat deals with Governments and Boeing, not some pub bozos or street vendors like you!

Inmarsat were asked by the Malaysians to present the data to the relatives but they rightfully refused. You could just imagine how that would of panned out. A Satellite geek explaining a whole lot of hocus pocus black magic to grieving relatives. Yeh right! :roll:
Last edited by Paphitis on Sat Mar 29, 2014 2:18 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: What happened to flight MH370?

Postby Pyrpolizer » Sat Mar 29, 2014 2:16 am

Reh until even today the Chinese are DEMANDING to have the data, what are you talking about? What they released so far is very well known. Look at my links. Haven't you understood yet that Inmarsat is being used to provide someone else's findings, they could of have been fabricated?
And please when you make statement do provide links supporting your statements I am really tired of hearing of your "wonderful" world stories.
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Re: What happened to flight MH370?

Postby Paphitis » Sat Mar 29, 2014 2:20 am

Pyrpolizer wrote:Reh until even today the Chinese are DEMANDING to have the data, what are you talking about? What they released so far is very well known. Look at my links. Haven't you understood yet that Inmarsat is being used to provide someone else's findings, they could of have been fabricated?


No they did NOT DEMAND!

The Chinese are not that stupid!

They ASKED the Malaysians and they sent their Deputy Foreign Affairs Minister to do this carefully and diplomatically! They did NOT DEMAND!

If they DEMAND, then Malaysia has every right to say FUCK OFF! It is a joint Malaysian and Australian Investigation now, and China has very limited input or jurisdiction.

All they need to do is ask and they got it no problems at all!
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Re: What happened to flight MH370?

Postby Pyrpolizer » Sat Mar 29, 2014 2:23 am

Pyrpolizer wrote:http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-03-25/malaysia-jet-traced-with-physics-in-pizza-fueled-inmarsat-huddle.html

quote:

The Inmarsat teams, meeting in the glass-coated company headquarters that borders London’s financial district, also used Boeing data on aircraft performance to see where the Doppler effect would result in a pattern that matched the data from Flight 370, McLaughlin said. Boeing declined to comment.

The team’s "eureka moment" came over the weekend, McLaughlin said. To validate its approach, the team shared its findings with engineers familiar with satellites as a form of scientific peer review. He declined to identify the company.
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Re: What happened to flight MH370?

Postby Pyrpolizer » Sat Mar 29, 2014 2:29 am

Paphitis wrote:
Pyrpolizer wrote:Reh until even today the Chinese are DEMANDING to have the data, what are you talking about? What they released so far is very well known. Look at my links. Haven't you understood yet that Inmarsat is being used to provide someone else's findings, they could of have been fabricated?


No they did NOT DEMAND!

The Chinese are not that stupid!

They ASKED the Malaysians and they sent their Deputy Foreign Affairs Minister to do this carefully and diplomatically! They did NOT DEMAND!

If they DEMAND, then Malaysia has every right to say FUCK OFF! It is a joint Malaysian and Australian Investigation now, and China has very limited input or jurisdiction.

All they need to do is ask and they got it no problems at all!


http://www.scotsman.com/news/transport/ ... -1-3352381
CHINA has demanded that Malaysia turn over satellite data it used to conclude that a passenger jet was lost in the southern Indian Ocean with no survivors during a flight to Beijing.
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Re: What happened to flight MH370?

Postby Paphitis » Sat Mar 29, 2014 2:31 am

Pyrpolizer wrote:
Pyrpolizer wrote:http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-03-25/malaysia-jet-traced-with-physics-in-pizza-fueled-inmarsat-huddle.html

quote:

The Inmarsat teams, meeting in the glass-coated company headquarters that borders London’s financial district, also used Boeing data on aircraft performance to see where the Doppler effect would result in a pattern that matched the data from Flight 370, McLaughlin said. Boeing declined to comment.

The team’s "eureka moment" came over the weekend, McLaughlin said. To validate its approach, the team shared its findings with engineers familiar with satellites as a form of scientific peer review. He declined to identify the company.


Here is the full story rather than just pasting part of it!

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-03-2 ... uddle.html

Boeing does not have to make any comment and they would be ill advised to do so at this point. Boeing provided the performance data, and still I do not here any objections coming from Boeing.

What is it you want them to say?
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Re: What happened to flight MH370?

Postby Paphitis » Sat Mar 29, 2014 2:35 am

Pyrpolizer wrote:
Paphitis wrote:
Pyrpolizer wrote:Reh until even today the Chinese are DEMANDING to have the data, what are you talking about? What they released so far is very well known. Look at my links. Haven't you understood yet that Inmarsat is being used to provide someone else's findings, they could of have been fabricated?


No they did NOT DEMAND!

The Chinese are not that stupid!

They ASKED the Malaysians and they sent their Deputy Foreign Affairs Minister to do this carefully and diplomatically! They did NOT DEMAND!

If they DEMAND, then Malaysia has every right to say FUCK OFF! It is a joint Malaysian and Australian Investigation now, and China has very limited input or jurisdiction.

All they need to do is ask and they got it no problems at all!


http://www.scotsman.com/news/transport/ ... -1-3352381
CHINA has demanded that Malaysia turn over satellite data it used to conclude that a passenger jet was lost in the southern Indian Ocean with no survivors during a flight to Beijing.


No it did NOT DEMAND!

A media outlet sexing things up as if this was a james Bond movie does not mean they DEMANDED because to be totally frank this whole thing will get politicized and that is the worst thing that can ever happen!

Beijing: China's Foreign Ministry said on Tuesday it hopes Britain will provide satellite data by British firm Inmarsat on the missing Malaysian Airlines plane. When asked whether China wants Britain to give it the satellite information, Foreign Ministry spokesman Hong Lei said he hoped the "relevant country" could provide it.

Read more at: http://www.firstpost.com/world/china-se ... ef_article

http://www.firstpost.com/world/china-se ... 49927.html
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Re: What happened to flight MH370?

Postby Pyrpolizer » Sat Mar 29, 2014 2:40 am

Paphitis wrote:
Pyrpolizer wrote:
Pyrpolizer wrote:http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-03-25/malaysia-jet-traced-with-physics-in-pizza-fueled-inmarsat-huddle.html

quote:

The Inmarsat teams, meeting in the glass-coated company headquarters that borders London’s financial district, also used Boeing data on aircraft performance to see where the Doppler effect would result in a pattern that matched the data from Flight 370, McLaughlin said. Boeing declined to comment.

The team’s "eureka moment" came over the weekend, McLaughlin said. To validate its approach, the team shared its findings with engineers familiar with satellites as a form of scientific peer review. He declined to identify the company.


Here is the full story rather than just pasting part of it!

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-03-2 ... uddle.html

Boeing does not have to make any comment and they would be ill advised to do so at this point. Boeing provided the performance data, and still I do not here any objections coming from Boeing.

What is it you want them to say?


Are you giving me my own links back? You think I haven't read it? The fact is the reporter tried to be as detailed as possible.

Now you tell me if this part says they gave the data to Being and boeing agreed.

wrote: he Inmarsat teams, meeting in the glass-coated company headquarters that borders London’s financial district, also used Boeing data on aircraft performance to see where the Doppler effect would result in a pattern that matched the data from Flight 370, McLaughlin said.
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Re: What happened to flight MH370?

Postby Paphitis » Sat Mar 29, 2014 2:40 am

Here is an article from the highly regarded and influential "The Age" newspaper.

http://www.theage.com.au/comment/chinas ... zqnqi.html

:lol:
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