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New lockdown rules

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Re: New lockdown rules

Postby cyprusgrump » Fri Mar 27, 2020 9:52 am

Londonrake wrote:
Get Real! wrote:In a bizarre twist of fate, the virus is actually saving far more lives than it is taking!

Without the worldwide lock-down countless millions would’ve died in the last 1-2 months from road accidents, work accidents, murders, and from a whole bunch of other ways.

However, this global lock-down also means that most economies will be ruined by the summer; when the virus is expected to subside and/or a solution may be found.

I guess we will be returning to the dark days of the loan sharks like the IMF and the EU, who will probably have 2/3 of the world as customers this time round!

Also, there may not be enough money to bail every country out and to the extent that may be necessary!

I certainly don’t look forward to what’s coming... perhaps the lucky ones are those gone or going from the virus! :lol:


That’s a novel thought. Also, I did read yesterday that so far the majority of those who’ve expired with the virus in the UK were thought quite likely to have died from their other maladies within the next year or so anyway.

As for the rest of your post, I was always an admirer of your sunny, optimistic outlook.


Quite... There seems to be no distinction in the press between those that die with the disease and those that actually die from it.
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Re: New lockdown rules

Postby Paphitis » Fri Mar 27, 2020 10:52 am

cyprusgrump wrote:
Londonrake wrote:
Get Real! wrote:In a bizarre twist of fate, the virus is actually saving far more lives than it is taking!

Without the worldwide lock-down countless millions would’ve died in the last 1-2 months from road accidents, work accidents, murders, and from a whole bunch of other ways.

However, this global lock-down also means that most economies will be ruined by the summer; when the virus is expected to subside and/or a solution may be found.

I guess we will be returning to the dark days of the loan sharks like the IMF and the EU, who will probably have 2/3 of the world as customers this time round!

Also, there may not be enough money to bail every country out and to the extent that may be necessary!

I certainly don’t look forward to what’s coming... perhaps the lucky ones are those gone or going from the virus! :lol:


That’s a novel thought. Also, I did read yesterday that so far the majority of those who’ve expired with the virus in the UK were thought quite likely to have died from their other maladies within the next year or so anyway.

As for the rest of your post, I was always an admirer of your sunny, optimistic outlook.


Quite... There seems to be no distinction in the press between those that die with the disease and those that actually die from it.


The media are clearly over hyping the situation and ramping up the fear among people. Not that we should not be worried but it seems there might be an underlying agenda with regard to the US Election.

Trump has been kicking massive goals since they day he took office, in every facet and we also know how much the media, Hollywood and the establishment who never worked a day in their life, hate this wonderful POTUS.

I think the establishment want the economies to crash, and then all of a sudden it's Orange Man Bad's fault again even though he had no control whatsoever over current events.

After all, it's not the establishment or the rich which will be doing it tough, finding it hard to buy food, and keeping their house. They certainly love sitting in their 30 million dollar mansions telling us how to live our lives because they think they are so pure.

But they forget one thing. Trump has it in the bag now more than ever, even if the global economy disintegrates.
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Re: New lockdown rules

Postby CrookedRiverGuy » Fri Mar 27, 2020 11:01 am

cyprusgrump wrote:Quite... There seems to be no distinction in the press between those that die with the disease and those that actually die from it.


I don't believe there's much need to split. Even if you are 90 with no more than 6-12 months expected life time and suddenly have your lungs fill with this gore and die in less than one week, isn't it quite obvious that the cause of death is the Corona virus?
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Re: New lockdown rules

Postby Londonrake » Fri Mar 27, 2020 11:19 am

CrookedRiverGuy wrote:
cyprusgrump wrote:Quite... There seems to be no distinction in the press between those that die with the disease and those that actually die from it.


I don't believe there's much need to split. Even if you are 90 with no more than 6-12 months expected life time and suddenly have your lungs fill with this gore and die in less than one week, isn't it quite obvious that the cause of death is the Corona virus?


Possibly but is it not also the case that if you die of a heart attack, dementia, old age, et al and you have the virus, cause of death tends to be recorded as Corona?
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Re: New lockdown rules

Postby cyprusgrump » Fri Mar 27, 2020 12:01 pm

CrookedRiverGuy wrote:
cyprusgrump wrote:Quite... There seems to be no distinction in the press between those that die with the disease and those that actually die from it.


I don't believe there's much need to split. Even if you are 90 with no more than 6-12 months expected life time and suddenly have your lungs fill with this gore and die in less than one week, isn't it quite obvious that the cause of death is the Corona virus?



But that isn't what is happening...

People are dying of other illnesses and being tested post mortem to discover they had the virus.

Sure, there will be some that contract it and die of it but my understanding is that many in the stats just happen to die with it...

A comparison of the numbers that would normally die every day/month would seem to confirm this.
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Re: New lockdown rules

Postby erolz66 » Fri Mar 27, 2020 12:07 pm

cyprusgrump wrote:
CrookedRiverGuy wrote:
cyprusgrump wrote:Quite... There seems to be no distinction in the press between those that die with the disease and those that actually die from it.


I don't believe there's much need to split. Even if you are 90 with no more than 6-12 months expected life time and suddenly have your lungs fill with this gore and die in less than one week, isn't it quite obvious that the cause of death is the Corona virus?



But that isn't what is happening...

People are dying of other illnesses and being tested post mortem to discover they had the virus.

Sure, there will be some that contract it and die of it but my understanding is that many in the stats just happen to die with it...

A comparison of the numbers that would normally die every day/month would seem to confirm this.


We just do not know yet how this is affecting mortality rates. Nor do we know how many will end up dying from things like lack of treatment being available for things other than covid-19 because of the strain it is creating on health care.
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Re: New lockdown rules

Postby cyprusgrump » Fri Mar 27, 2020 12:50 pm

erolz66 wrote:
We just do not know yet how this is affecting mortality rates.


erolz66 wrote:
Nor do we know how many will end up dying from things like lack of treatment being available for things other than covid-19 because of the strain it is creating on health care.


So we don't know how it will affect mortality but we do know it will be a strain on health care...? :roll:
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Re: New lockdown rules

Postby erolz66 » Fri Mar 27, 2020 1:09 pm

cyprusgrump wrote:
erolz66 wrote:
We just do not know yet how this is affecting mortality rates.


erolz66 wrote:
Nor do we know how many will end up dying from things like lack of treatment being available for things other than covid-19 because of the strain it is creating on health care.


So we don't know how it will affect mortality but we do know it will be a strain on health care...? :roll:


When you start to have to build temporary morgues because too many people are dying at the same time then you know that is not normal. However that in and off itself does not prove there has been a big change in mortality rates. It just proves that there has been a massive change in how many people are dying concurrently.

Asking the question 'is the proposed treatment worse than the thing being treated' is a perfectly valid question to ask. Just asking it however does NOT provide an answer. Those who claim to definitively know the answer with the data we currently have are charlatans.

Rolling your eyes because of your failure to comprehend properly does not change that failure one iota by the way.
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Re: New lockdown rules

Postby Londonrake » Fri Mar 27, 2020 1:23 pm

If you’re talking about Italy, my understanding is that the government has banned all funerals. That, in order to prevent what are usually considerable numbers of predominantly older people gathering for them. :? Thus the backlog. A bit like “The winter of discontent” perhaps?
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Re: New lockdown rules

Postby erolz66 » Fri Mar 27, 2020 1:29 pm

Do we definitively know that the health care systems in places like Italy are overloaded. Yes we do. Do we know that such overloaded systems will lead to deaths of people both with corona virus and those without it that would not have occurred if the health systems were not overloaded. Yes we do. Do we know that mortality rates, over a year, over 5 years , over 10 years have been significantly changed because of corona virus. No we do not definitively know this yet.
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